Proposal 20 Passed

[LSURock]

:laugh: You are too funny, LSU. Champagne corks. Good one. :lol:

 

Tell me, were the Trinity faithful donning black armbands at the prospect of ending the "rivalry games" with hapless Eastern and Ballard?

 

You can laugh all you want, but I'm betting in a few years the 4A trophy will be called the "Redman Trophy". Too bad it won't mean much. Ask yourself, why are they hapless? They aren't hapless in basketball of baseball.

[Wildcat]

Here is my 2 cents worth...

 

I am very glad and I hope there is a seperation and here are my reasons.

 

1. Public schools can not be selective and give placement exams for admittance. Privates can, and provide scholarships. Scholarships, in high school.

2. They don't deal with the same demographics as a typical public school. ( more could be elaborated )

3. They are not held accountable by state testing and the norm grading system.

4. Resources are no where the same. When you compare private donations to having a bake sale for uniforms, there is no equal playing field.

5. The rule of playing the best, well here is actuality in the matter. If you were a kid from Whitley County or Owensboro and had a very good team. Wouldn't you want to have the opportunity to win a state title. As of now, X or T will win that battle.

6. The playing fields are no where the same in terms of populations. All girls or all boys have the unfair advantage of having a huge drawing pool.

7. As for going to a place to receive more recognition, let me say this. I came from a very, very small school in rural KY and I played Division I football. The bottom line is if you have the talent and size, they will find you. It is your ability, not who you play for or who you play against.

 

 

1. scholarships for academics

2. you're right-private school parents are in the hole 4-5 K

3. grading system in privates is often much higher-i.e. 94+=A, 86+=B, 77++C, 70+= D

4. it is NOT equal-publics get state and federal funding; privates do not

5. if a coach works hard to build the program, recruits his own school, teaches fundamental football, teaches effective ways to beat the opponent, involves the community(like Chuck Smith, like Mike Yeagle, like Dale Mueller, like Sam Harp, like Bob Redman, ) they have an opportunity every Friday night

6. population is the school district's CHOICE- Boone chooses no, Kenton has open enrollment within the county, Beechwood & Highlands accept tuition, Fayette chooses no

7. I agree; if a kid is good enough; the colleges will find him

[Wildcat]

Recruiting is cheating, legal or not. Not to worry private schools. It'll never be implemented.

 

 

The good schools recruit themselves, meaning, the academic program 1st, the coaches 2nd, the tradition 3rd, the facilities 4th. They don't have to recruit in the sense that you intend.

 

I paid tuition to go to an independent school district; no coach ever came knocking on my door or anyone at the school that paid tuition. We were recruited by the above.

[Wildcat]

I'm for the split.!

 

 

I feel sorry for you. I always find it sad that people are unwilling to face challenges and work hard to achieve a goal.

[doubletrouble]

This is not just because of X and T, UHA in Western Ky. has had quite a hand in giving private schools a bad reputation. And to some extent Fort Campbell, which can recruit nationwide, when they have the right commander.

[Les]

Don't feel sorry for me man. I'm just for the split. This isn't a life or death situation here.

Now, if Leo Mazzone goes to Baltimore and leaves Atlanta, then feel sorry for me.

[H]

You can laugh all you want, but I'm betting in a few years the 4A trophy will be called the "Redman Trophy". Too bad it won't mean much. Ask yourself, why are they hapless? They aren't hapless in basketball of baseball.

 

I'd be shocked if the split cleared all the hurdles in front of it. I'm not in favor of Prop 20 (too drastic), and I hope cooler heads prevail in crafting a compromise that all sides can live with. So I doubt we'll ever see a "Redman Trophy" scenario.

 

Eastern and Ballard have been hapless in football because 1) Eastern has traditionally been a basketball school, 2) coaching (except when Red was at Ballard), and 3) insufficient numbers to compete with the 6A schools, uh, I mean Trinity and X (even in years when E and B have put decent teams on the field).

[All Tell]

I'll say it in this thread as well. It's awfully easy to SAY you oppose this when the 4A championship has basically been gift wrapped for you.

[strike-3]

I'll say it in this thread as well. It's awfully easy to SAY you oppose this when the 4A championship has basically been gift wrapped for you.

 

 

So H is lying? He can't have an opinion?

[H]

I'll say it in this thread as well. It's awfully easy to SAY you oppose this when the 4A championship has basically been gift wrapped for you.

 

Believe what you will.

[Pete W]

Quit grabbing at straws, the player mentioned had been at Christian Academy when his parents decided to enroll him at Trinity for the ninth grade.Early in his sophomore year decided they wanted tranfer him to Manual. By this time, some students may have left Manual (for various reasons) opening spots for possible transfers. This does not happen very often and I believe would only be considered if the inquiring student is NOT enrolled in another Jefferson County PUBLIC School. Manual has lost three student/athletes to private schools in the past two years and we just have to say that it may have been a choice that the student and parents felt best for them. That is what this should be about, we do not own these kids or their families. And NO! Manual does not (knowingly) accept students from outside Jefferson County. We all know that some people do not offer 100 % accurate information on applications so there would be a possibility of overzealous parents wanting their child to have the best academic opportunity available and fibbing about residence. I am sure the subject will continue to arise about Manual, Male, etal having the ability to draw students from " all over." Keep in mind that is JUST In Jefferson County and open enrollment means all Jefferson County schools have this opportunity. It is just that Manual and Central do not have a defined "home" district. For all the straw grabbers, this means that if a student can not get into a school of their choice that they must attend their "home" school. What is so difficult about that? Where is this an advantage? See a school with 1400 - 1500 positions available all of which would be filled by a male. To fill these positions you have no defined boundaries to draw from and you canvas 12-13 counties and cross state lines to fill these spots, all the while you keep an eye out for that special someone who can shoot a basketball, catch a football, throw a baseball, etc. Say that you even sponsor a middle school level team for each of these sports. You may even be able to tell the kids that live farther away that they can request special transportation to and from school. Oh, you may even be able to apply for "financial assistance" as our tuition may be more than your parents can afford. It is human nature to feel good about "special" attention whether it is a "financial aid" packageor just the thought that they want me and the parents' chests puff out and they tell all their friends and families that they are getting "recruited." I have heard all this first hand so doubt it all you want, I know what the color of the sky is in my world. Now we know that these private schools need to have students (or someone) paying tuition to be able to pay teachers,adminstrators, and operational expenses so recruiting is not in question. When student/athletes who do not meet basic criteria to get into those schools then there are some questions. A very huge question remains when student/athletes are being drawn from Indiana,or Ohio,or Tennessee for various schools. How can this be possible? We (public) schools are drawing students to fill 1800 positions (large 4A) many of whom will be females from a single county. Possibly even only from 2-3 traditional middle schools as is the case with Male. A high percentage of students are also female, not too many play 4A football, basketball, baseball, wrestle, etc. When certain private schools are fielding freshman teams of 100 plus players each and every year and can dress over 100 on friday night then numbers definitely are issues. Facts are facts and you cannot always divert focus to other arguments. There should be no way a non resident on the state should be eligible to compete in athletics in another state. Don't say they want the best education so they came here. If the education is what they want, let them stay in your school with "financial assistance" and get the eduacation, just do not play sports. Now you are going to say " they (KHSAA) do not have the best interest in mind." This was the case with a certain football player displaced in New Orleans and most recently emerging in Kentucky. If this student was NOT a standout player in Louisiana, would the school(s) in question still be so willing to offer a financial aid package and be willing to bend over backward to allow him in school? (Let all the evacuees trek to this school and apply for the opportunity of a quality education.) Of course the answer to that question would be Yes!?!?! There have been many of the same issues questioned for years but the powers that be have regularly chosen to ignore these concerns, sweep them aside and say, "you are just crying."

Now we all know that a split will cost everyone more money, the KHSAA to put on all the games for rent and trophies, etc. Private schools in increased travel expenses in post season and non district games. Public schools in loss of gate in playing private schools in playoffs or possibly even in non district play depending on how all this shakes out. I know that we all feel that the state title will be "diluted" or "watered down" on both sides. The private state title would also be watered down because they would not have gone through the number of teams at their competition level as the public school teams. If the private school supporters say otherwise, then I personally know the true feelings. That would mean that you know that your teams are better without a doubt.So why would you want to continue to continue with this inferior competition. You should be playing only those teams that are your equals. Hopefully this vote will be the catalyst to set defined rules of competition. Maybe we can level the playing fields so we can quit crying and you can quit being so wrongfully accused for things just because you outwork and outcoach the public schools. Peace!

[All Tell]

Trust me I already do.

[strike-3]

You can laugh all you want, but I'm betting in a few years the 4A trophy will be called the "Redman Trophy". Too bad it won't mean much. Ask yourself, why are they hapless? They aren't hapless in basketball of baseball.

 

 

Not even worth comparing basketball to football. Lets see in basketball you need 5 players in footbal 22. It a little easier to make up for the disparity of enrollments in these other sports.

 

I wish T & X would just admit that they have a huge advantage based on enrollment. (Nothing wrong with that) But I hate the arguements that are always made that their guys work harder or have more school spirit, yada, yada, yada. Give Apollo an extra 700 boys to pick from and I'm sure we would have a better team than we do.

[Watusi]

I'll say it in this thread as well. It's awfully easy to SAY you oppose this when the 4A championship has basically been gift wrapped for you.

 

Its really nice to pigeonhole H in with all the proponents of P20, as if all public schools supporters are just craving an easier path.

 

If he says he isn't in favor of it, I see no reason for anyone to insult his integrity by insinuating that he is sacrificing the truth just to be PC.

[scooterbob]

I have long been an advocate for Rose Hill. For the last couple of years, I have continually advocated Rose Hill discontinuing its membership in KHSAA. The developments of today underline the fact that Rose Hill, and other private schools, would benefit from this disassociation.

Within a 100 mile radius of Ashland, to the east and to the north, there are many high schools in West Virginia and Ohio that would offer superior competition when compared to what is presently offered in the 16th Region and eastern Kentucky. The absence of contests with Kentucky schools would not be detrimental in the least.

I know some would argue that athletes would not be exposed sufficiently to attract the attention of recruiters and college coaches. This is a false argument. If an athlete is deserving, he or she will be seen. Many at Rose Hill play AAU. Obviously, college recruiters and coaches frequent AAU events. However, the best example of the fact that athletes will be seen is Saihou Jassey. Saihou, for (I believe) other than legitimate reasons, was declared ineligible last year. He played nowhere. Nonetheless, his talents became known and he received a full scholarship at Bradley University. The number of KHSAA member school seniors who received scholarships of this stature are very few. Certainly, Jassey's scholarship was enormously more impressive than any other received by anyone in eastern Kentucky.

Independence opens many doors and, also, gets rid of the whiners who seek to "level" that imaginary "playing field" through harming their opposition with self-centered proposals rather than working to produce a better product.

So I repeat to my associates at Rose Hill, as well as others in a similar situation- it's time to move on to bigger and better venues where you are not handcuffed by those who seek to harm you.