Where does Lincoln turn...

[Hatz]

Records of wins, nor playoff wins measures a coach. People who do that cheapen the game. High School coaches should be measured on several things. 1) Leadership, 2) what situation did they inherit, 3) community involvement, 3) what do they teach players (morally), 4) involvement in other activities in school, 5) do they prepare kids to reach new levels, and 6) if they left today, where would the program be.

Let me expand on each topic.

1. Leadership - each program has to have a vision and plan. If not, then luck is the only thing that will run the program. Every program needs a short and long term plan. If not eventually bad luck will take over.

2. What do you inherit? Mason County is a great example of this. David Buchanan inherited a team that hadn't won very much and was considered purely a basketball school. He has changed that perception greatly.

3. Community involvemnet. Does a coach support the community and get invovled? If not, it hurts the program and the school. Coaches are looked upon as leaders of the school. They must be involved in community and get players involved. This helps build future community leaders.

4. The coach has to realize that he/she must support other programs in the school. This enhances a students experience in the school. I am not talking about just athletes. I mean each student.

Also if each program is successful, then one sport does not hold the financial burden of the other sports programs. Also, if all sports teams are successful, then each sport's particapants get a better chance of having more resources for their sport.

5. A coach may not have much athletic talent. But if he/she works the athletes and makes them more skilled, that is a good coach. They may not have very much success, but they will perform better.

6. Finally, is the program better than when the coach was hired? that is a big question for me. If yes, then they have done a good job.

 

I think Coach Buchanan has answered all of traits at Mason County.

 

 

You and I have very similar notions of a good coach for High School football. :thumb:

[Burger House]

You and I have very similar notions of a good coach for High School football. :thumb:

 

In a perfect world, I would agree. In the long run, it all comes down to how successful your program is, that is why they keep score. A school that is use to winning is not going to keep a coach very long when they are not producing results, no matter how good a guy and role model he is ex.(Tubby Smith). But, there were alot nice of feel goods in the quote.

[Hatz]

In a perfect world, I would agree. In the long run, it all comes down to how successful your program is, that is why they keep score. A school that is use to winning is not going to keep a coach very long when they are not producing results, no matter how good a guy and role model he is ex.(Tubby Smith). But, there were alot nice of feel goods in the quote.

 

I have to ask again, you have raised legitimate questions - do you have any suggestions? You are good at cutting on Buchanan's record. Fine. I think the evidence produced has been more than to the contrary but you can look at it however you want. He hasn't coached Mason County to Louisville. And Larry French has never coached any team to the Finals either. What is the difference?

 

Do you have any names to counter his name? Or do you just sit there and figure if you say it enough then there must be some "great proven" coach with a better record that will end up at Lincoln? If we had some names or even schools you could suggest it would make for great comparison/contrast but to ignore any other suggestions I think you are just railing at the sky.

[real sport]

Larry coached his team at Meade to the state finals. Not sure on exact year but early 90's, I was still a pup. But he did never win the State he has been there Hatz. But to go with your point I agree, some of the best coaches in this state have never went to the finals. It is the job they do with what they have. If all schools and all kids were the same then yes State Champions would be important. But to most of the state it is not the case.

[Hatz]

Larry coached his team at Meade to the state finals. Not sure on exact year but early 90's, I was still a pup. But he did never win the State he has been there Hatz. But to go with your point I agree, some of the best coaches in this state have never went to the finals. It is the job they do with what they have. If all schools and all kids were the same then yes State Champions would be important. But to most of the state it is not the case.

 

 

My bad. I forgot about that season.

 

My point is still out there for Burger House to give us some actual names rather than mythical "should bes."

[LCPATS]

LCPATS,

 

6 wins?? Just depends on the scheudule. Even though 6 classes has watered it down a little, I still consider playoff success the ultimate measuring stick. 6 wins could be a great season or not just depending on who was beat or when your season ended.

 

I know it's hard to believe with all the ups and downs over the past decade (just looking at Mr. Networks post of records), but Lincoln has been to the region finals twice in the past 8 years. 1999 and 2007 (winning this year), there are many programs out there who would like to have had that overall success.

 

 

Podgie,

 

All I was saying was that Buchanan has only had the two losing seasons. Every other season was a winning one.

 

What do the 99 and 07 teams have in common? Great athletes. The talent surrounding the program around the 99 team had a great amount of talent.

[Bear65]

In a perfect world, I would agree. In the long run, it all comes down to how successful your program is, that is why they keep score. A school that is use to winning is not going to keep a coach very long when they are not producing results, no matter how good a guy and role model he is ex.(Tubby Smith). But, there were alot nice of feel goods in the quote.

 

Well, Tubby is a sore subject with me. He did win. He is winning now. We (UK) aren't!

I believe that you should keep score. It is part of the process of teaching kids how to handle success with humility and failures with grace. Most of us have failed at some point. Hopefully we did not waller in self pity.

As far as being "used to winning", there are factors that play into it that sometimes have nothing to with coaches. My examples are Highlands, Mayfield, Trinity, and St. X. All have won with different coaches. I would say that their support and tradition play a big part of winning. But when I think of consistent winning, Lincoln County does not pop in my mind. I will say they have had GREAT TEAMS, but not consistent winning teams. If it was a consistent program, I doubt Coach French would have left. Did they even have a freshman team this past year?

[Tall Trees]

No Freshman team? That is not good for a school that big.

[3wishes]

Did they even have a freshman team this past year?

 

They played freshmen games but the majority of them were not freshmen, they dressed 29 in the games I saw.

[Podgie]

Podgie,

 

All I was saying was that Buchanan has only had the two losing seasons. Every other season was a winning one.

 

What do the 99 and 07 teams have in common? Great athletes. The talent surrounding the program around the 99 team had a great amount of talent.

 

LCPATS,

 

I agree..........

[Mr.Network]

Basketball was or has watned the upper hand since Upchurch was head coach there. I know they are successful now and will be, but I think both sports are feeding off each other and will be successful.

 

I was thinking about your post.

 

Are you joking? I assume you are talking about Jack Upchurch and not Mark Upchurch. Since Jack Upchurch came there after Nelson Moore left, Lincoln County has won 4 regional championships (1988, 1990, 1993 and 2007) in football and appeared in two state championship finals (1990, 1993) and had 1993's Mr. Football (Jeremy Simpson). The basketball team won one regional title (2007) and has played one game in the Sweet Sixteen.

 

I am happy about the recent success of the basketball program and with the quality coaching provided by Jeff Jackson but since 1980 or so, football was the preferred sport at Lincoln County. Don't let a low point in our history confuse the facts. Lincoln County supports football and basketball and both are working very well together. An upturn in talent has benefitted both programs that have relied during the past two's years success on many of the same athletes.

[mchammer]

You could say that about alot of programs during their down years. Lincoln was a premier job in the early 90's, but fell on some tuff times with players and coaches. French did bring it back to respectability, but one reason for that is he had some great talent that provided some much needed excitement in the program. The excitement is continuing, so it would be a great job for any coach in the state. I think you can see that by the interest it is receiving from many top coaches (Settles, Buchannon, and others).

Are you whacked?! In all your other comments you have totally bashed Buchanan and his coaching credentials and claimed he is nothing more than 'mediocre'. Please, at least be consistent! Don't start riding the rail and saying he is a 'top coach' when you speak quite the contrary! :irked:

[mchammer]

Can you name any of these that are on a realistic wish list? I'd love to see their records for comparisons sake.

HATZ, its obvious to me Burger House doesn't have any substance to his case or he would have already responded to the various inquiries on his picks. Oh well, there's one in every crowd.

[Burger House]

Are you whacked?! In all your other comments you have totally bashed Buchanan and his coaching credentials and claimed he is nothing more than 'mediocre'. Please, at least be consistent! Don't start riding the rail and saying he is a 'top coach' when you speak quite the contrary! :irked:

 

Hammertime,

 

I should have said Head Coaches, sorry for the mistake. It is more interesting talking about the coach(es) that I don't want, than the coaches that I do.

 

I have not bashed Buchanon. Like previously stated in my previous quote, I just think you and others think Lincoln would be lucky to have him, I think quite the opposite. He would be lucky to be at Lincoln. He has expressed interest in many schools, but he is still at Mason. It is either Mason is a great place to be, or the schools decide not to hire him. Maybe he just likes to interview. I have known coaches like that(Jaggers). That is my point.

[Hatz]

Hammertime,

 

I should have said Head Coaches, sorry for the mistake. It is more interesting talking about the coach(es) that I don't want, than the coaches that I do.

 

I have not bashed Buchanon. Like previously stated in my previous quote, I just think you and others think Lincoln would be lucky to have him, I think quite the opposite. He would be lucky to be at Lincoln. He has expressed interest in many schools, but he is still at Mason. It is either Mason is a great place to be, or the schools decide not to hire him. Maybe he just likes to interview. I have known coaches like that(Jaggers). That is my point.

 

 

 

There is something to be said for comfortability and familiarity the older we get. My guess is that David is picky about the situation he would leave Mason County for. There is also the matter of family. As we get older, the drive of career is balanced by the desire of family stability and moving more than just yourself.

 

I have lived in VA since 1991. My children know no other home. If I were to move anytime soon, I would (and I have) weigh the impact on them as much as the prospect of career enhancement.

 

Again, you haven't given us a list of the great coaches with glowing records for the Lincoln job. I think you will find Settles' record no better than Buchanan's so it really doesn't hold much water there.