3a fan rankings for fun.

[Tigertalker]

Rankings don't mean nothing but someones opinion and gives peope something to chatter about. I know a lot of coaches that don't even follow to see where or if their team is even ranked. But I know a few coaches that will break down polls to see if their team is getting any respect and all that.

 

Being with Hopkinsville I have noticed the comments about Hoptown being 0-2. There are a couple of other good football teams in the state that are 0-2 and I can guarantee their staffs are throwing in the towel just yet.

 

Hopkinsville lost in the opening game to a very good Memphis Ridgeway TN. team by 3 in OT. Their O-line averaged 280 pounds and they weren't just big they was good. Their QB is rated in the top 50 in the nation and is getting several D1 offers. They had a real good RB who has gotten some offers along with a D1 prospect at WR and a LB who has gotten D1 offers. In the end their depth and Hoptowns mistakes it was what won them the game. Then after playing Ridgeway on Saturday we turn around and go to Male on Friday with our QB Curtis Pulley at only 65-70% with a ankle injury and some other kids banged up along with a few that need to mature and grow a bit. Hoptown played as bad as I ever seen and didn't deserve to even be on the field. We had WR's running the wrong routes and on defense we couldn't get lined up right and tackled very poorly. Plus Male is a pretty good team ya their young but they got a solid team that is only gonna get better. But Hoptown only loss by 5 when it could have been a lot worse.

 

I would rather have 2 losses to good teams like we do then 2 wins over some teams that aren't that good. When you play good competition it only makes you better and you find out more about your team.

 

Then if ya really wanna break it down a week before the season starts Hoptown loses their best football player Marcel Laseur for the season with a ACL & MCL injury. Here's a kid that was our best RB and coud run in between the tackles and last year rushed for over a 1,000 and only fumbled twice. On defense he was our leading tackler and QB on defense. He lined us up he made the defensive calls and checks. That has been a big problem in the early part with the defense and some of the kids took the loss of him as if it killed us. It didn't kill us but did set us back that is obvious. The mistakes we have made are correctable and will get fixed and the kids are gonna play harder then they have been or they won't be playing for Coach Craig Clayton.

 

Before the season started I really felt liked Hoptown was a top 3-4 team in 3A with the talent returning and the staff we have down here. With the loss of Laseur now weren't not as good but were still better on offense then we was last year but don't have the late in the game eat up clock runner that Laseur was. Gonzalez and Barker are excellen offensive kids but rely on the whiggle and speed more than power runner. On defense we just need to listen, tackle better, be aggressive and we will be fine. On offense were only running about 30% of our offense but now were hitting a stretch in the season where Coach Clayton likes t crack the whip so to speak and start adding things to the offense and defense. Plus we'll start getting game film on our opponents so we can break them down and put in a proper game plan. Against Ridgeway we went into that game blind because of lack of film and they started a different O-Line then they were expected to. Against Male their defense won't let you run a lot stuff so you have to limit your plays and rely on the big play which shouldn't be a problem for us but the other night it was.

 

Were gonna play a lot better then we have (exleast I hope so) so we still feel confident about this teams potential. As long as your playing good come district play and the playoffs that's all that matters.

 

My point is that I think people look at a teams early season record of 0-2 and immediately pass judgement that well that team in overrated when they don't know that much at all about that team except for their record.

[WHO YA WITH]

Originally posted by theguru

If we are doing it this way I think West Jessamine should be #1.

 

:cry: :cry: :cry:

Did you have to bring that up?

[lcfan]

theguru,

 

To answer your questions, Lawrence Co. has never made it to the state finals. The last time they made it to the semi-finals was in 1999 when they lost to nationally ranked Highlands. Before that, they made it to the semi-finals in 2A in 1997 and were led by Jason Michael (who quaterbacked Western Kentucky to the 1-AA National Championship this past season). Before 1997, LC made it to the semi-finals in 2A in 1991. They lost to Mayfield 21-18.

 

Keep in mind that LC has only been a school for about 22-23 years.

[bargedawg]

Originally posted by lcfan

theguru,

 

To answer your questions, Lawrence Co. has never made it to the state finals. The last time they made it to the semi-finals was in 1999 when they lost to nationally ranked Highlands. Before that, they made it to the semi-finals in 2A in 1997 and were led by Jason Michael (who quaterbacked Western Kentucky to the 1-AA National Championship this past season). Before 1997, LC made it to the semi-finals in 2A in 1991. They lost to Mayfield 21-18.

 

Keep in mind that LC has only been a school for about 22-23 years.

 

LC Fan I dont know this to be true but my older brother told me the old Louisa Bulldogs did win the state championship! that would have been in the 60's:eek:

[HoosierEagle]

Originally posted by theguru

 

==============

 

HE,

 

We are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

==============

 

Agreed. But if you are just a little bit curious why at least a significant minority believe that a NKY bias exists, try this exercise:

 

Compare the current AP poll to the current BGP poll. Mark the NKY teams. For each place that BGP has a NKY team ranked higher than AP, award a point. For each place that an NKY team that is ranked lower, award a negative point. (For some BGP teams, you will need to extend the AP rankings well beyond a top 10. For example, BGP has Lloyd ranked 6 in AA, but the AP has them pegged at 19, so you would award Lloyd a +13.

 

After going through all of the teams listed in all but 4A rankings (NKY is not represented), count the number of NKY teams ranked higher in the BGP poll than AP, the ones ranked the same, and the teams ranked lower.

 

Now, repeat the same exercise for EKY teams. Then add the NKY points, and finally add the EKY points. I think the results will surprise you. I suspect that you would find a similar trend in last season's early rankings, but I have not researched it.

 

Naturally, as the season wears on, all of the polls and rankings begin converging as "gut feels," "educated guesses," and "informed analyses" give way to head-to-head results, but I think you might agree that there is an apparent early season bias toward the NKY teams. That doesn't mean that the BGP voters are wrong in their assessments (I would not dare defend the AP's record), but I think it does reflect a tendency to give the NKY teams the benefit of the doubt during a period when game results are scarce.

 

Does the NKY's impressive collection of state titles warrant a little extra early season consideration when ranking the teams? Maybe it does, and I mean that sincerely.

[eastboy]

Eastboy's Top 10:

 

1. Boyle Co.(#1 till they get beat)

2. Bell Co. (They are for real this year, and Dudley is Hungry for another State Title.)

3. Hoptown

4. Paducah T.

5. Highlands(There back this year.)

6. Mason Co.(Will surprise alot of people.)

7. East Jessamine

8. Lex. Cath.

9. Rockcastle Co.(Lost alot of key players last year.)

10. Bowling Green

[Watusi]

I get what you are saying HE, but I think the AP voters are out of touch with reality. Any argument based on the AP poll is not very useful, IMO, because it is so full of inaccuracies and agenda.

[HoosierEagle]

Originally posted by Watusi

I get what you are saying HE, but I think the AP voters are out of touch with reality. Any argument based on the AP poll is not very useful, IMO, because it is so full of inaccuracies and agenda.

Watusi,

 

You will get no argument from me about the AP poll. There is no comparison between the BGP and AP poll when it comes to the football expertise of the voters. I used the AP poll to test my theory because there is not much else available this time of year.

 

If you could conduct a poll and force every football coach in the state to respond, I suspect that you would see much the same result. I also believe that good officials honestly try their best to call all games fairly, but a home field advantage is still a fact of life. Guru has often said that computer rankings all must begin with a "magic number," but human rankings have their own built-in flaws. IMO, regional bias, especially in the pre- and early season is the BGP's Achilles heel. (But it is still the best game in town.)

 

I just don't know how else to explain how Covington Catholic and Lloyd soared to such lofty heights in the polls so quickly, after both posted decent, but disappointing campaigns a year ago. ("Dissapointing" in the fact that both had very high expectations in the preseason and expected to contend for a state title, but neither were considered real threats to win titles as they entered the playoffs.)

[Booge]

Don't forget Bellevue and CHC. Bellevue had a losing record last year, and CHC was 7-5, got blown out often and had wins over very soft competition, to put it mildly. You are on the money HE, the "human" factor favors N Ky teams.

[Oldbird]

Exactly why were Cov. Cath's and Lloyds season's disappointing.

 

Lloyd lost three games. They lost to NCC, who was a top 10 single A school, they lost to Dixie who was a top 10 4A school and they were eliminated in the playoffs by Mason County, who by all accounts was the third best 2A team in the state. Lloyd also beat Beechwood. I don't remember where Lloyd ended the season ranked in our poll, but the only thing disappointing about Lloyd's season was they were in the wrong side of the bracket. The strong side.

 

Cov. Cath did not have a great record, but Cov. Cath played a brutal schedule. They lost to Moeller (no comment needed), they lost to Columbus DeSales (Columbus power and recent state champ in OH), they lost to Dixie (who gave Trinity their best game last year) and they lost to Highlands. When the dust cleared Cov. Cath entered the playoffs with a 500 record and a second place finish in their district. In the second round of the playoffs Cov. Cath lost to Lexington Catholic at Lexington Catholic by 1. Do you want to guess who was the consensus number 1 pick in every 3A poll at the end of the season last year? Despite the record I seriously doubt there were 10 better 3A teams in the state than Cov. Cath last year.

 

Your memory is short HE. So short that you fail to remember how good these teams were last year. These teams were both very good last year. Lloyd isn't as good this year, but neither is 2A. Cov. Cath was good last year and they are better this year. They are ranked because they are good. Even though you wantt to think there is some type of bias, it is more a product of your own mind than anything that really exists.

[Booge]

Putting Bellevue and CHC so high in the polls shows the bias more than overrating CovCath and Lloyd (who are overrated.)

[INMOTION]

Originally posted by Oldbird

 

In the second round of the playoffs Cov. Cath lost to Lexington Catholic at Lexington Catholic by 1.

 

 

actually it was 2, 29-27- but who's counting, huh?:jump: anyway, good point!

[HoosierEagle]

Originally posted by Oldbird

Exactly why were Cov. Cath's and Lloyds season's disappointing.

 

Lloyd lost three games. They lost to NCC, who was a top 10 single A school, they lost to Dixie who was a top 10 4A school and they were eliminated in the playoffs by Mason County, who by all accounts was the third best 2A team in the state. Lloyd also beat Beechwood. I don't remember where Lloyd ended the season ranked in our poll, but the only thing disappointing about Lloyd's season was they were in the wrong side of the bracket. The strong side.

 

Cov. Cath did not have a great record, but Cov. Cath played a brutal schedule. They lost to Moeller (no comment needed), they lost to Columbus DeSales (Columbus power and recent state champ in OH), they lost to Dixie (who gave Trinity their best game last year) and they lost to Highlands. When the dust cleared Cov. Cath entered the playoffs with a 500 record and a second place finish in their district. In the second round of the playoffs Cov. Cath lost to Lexington Catholic at Lexington Catholic by 1. Do you want to guess who was the consensus number 1 pick in every 3A poll at the end of the season last year? Despite the record I seriously doubt there were 10 better 3A teams in the state than Cov. Cath last year.

 

Your memory is short HE. So short that you fail to remember how good these teams were last year. These teams were both very good last year. Lloyd isn't as good this year, but neither is 2A. Cov. Cath was good last year and they are better this year. They are ranked because they are good. Even though you wantt to think there is some type of bias, it is more a product of your own mind than anything that really exists.

Did you bother to compare the AP poll to the BGP rankings, OB? If so, did you find even a single instance where BGP ranked a NKY team lower than the AP? I had not seen the AP poll, I just took a wild guess that BGP would have picked NKY teams higher early in the season, and I was right. If the NKY bias is a product of my own mind, maybe I am psychic. Move over Miss Cleo!:lol:

[Watusi]

I broke our polls down by voters in NKY and voters in Non NKY. I'm not getting into how many voters we had or which voters voted what way but here are the aggregate results.

 

In the 3A and 1A polls, at least 60% of the voters are from outside the NKY area (Lou, Lex, West, South and East). In the 2A poll, 100% (all) of the voters are from outside the NKY area.

 

But here is the interesting part. The average ranking of the teams you guys claim are only there because of the NKY bias is lower for the non NKY voters than it is for the NKY voters. Cov Cath is the only team that even showed a significant difference when broken down by voter region.

 

Cov Cath : NKY voters ranked them on average 8.0, non NKY voters ranked them on average 6.2.

 

Lloyd : No NKY voters. Non NKY voters ranked them 5.2.

 

Cov Holy Cross: NKY voters ranked them 6.0, non NKY voters ranked them 6.0.

 

Bellevue : NKY voters ranked them 9.5, non NKY voters ranked them 9.6.

 

So tell me where is the bias?

[colonel-fan]

Originally posted by Watusi

Cov Cath : NKY voters ranked them on average 8.0, non NKY voters ranked them on average 6.2.

 

Thanks NKY voters! It sounds like an anti-CovCath conspiracy up here...