All A revisit!

[Lawnboy13]

Somebody's making lots of friends in this thread. :lol:

[sweet16]

So then why not have classes in all sports? Then no one can argue it's not fair, right?

 

I have no problem with that but that is not going to happen. That decision is not ours but the KHSAA.

[Mustang]

So two state champs?

I don't think that any Class "A" programs are claiming that the "A" is on an equal plane with the KHSAA Sweet Sixteen State Tournament. We all realize that it is a statewide invitational for the lower half of the enrollment base of the state. We also realize that with few exceptions it is also dominated by mid-major programs capable of competing in the post-season district, regional, and state tournaments.

We also feel strongly enough about it, since it is a statewide competition, encompassing all 16 regions (some stronger than others), played in a state tournament format and encompassing half of the teams in the state, that we do celebrate it as a "state" or state-wide championship. We think enough of it to celebrate it with the purchase of rings, hanging a banner in the gym and alongside a picture of the "State"/"State-wide" championship team.

 

Why do you hold this against us???

We think it is a major accomplishment and are proud of achieving championship status in this competition. If the other schools do not wish to recognize us for our accomplishments, then so be it. However, if they win the L.I.T./King of the Bluegrass/or Republic Bank Classic and would want to do the same for their teams, if they think that success warrants it, I don't think there will be an outcry from the "A" Schools that they are out of line, or over the top. We might think that, but won't say it.

 

Success within ones own program is measured in different ways. There is a picture hanging in the gym at Bracken County High School of the 1998 10th Region "A" Champs, and there should be one at Calvary Christian for their success in the 2009 renewal. These are major accomplishments for these schools, who realistically can't compete on a level playing field with the mid-majors, or majors year in or year out.

 

At Brossart, when we win a 10th Region "A" Championship we print T-Shirts, but reserve picture on the wall status for winning the "A" State or winning the 10th Region post-season championship. Those things are challenging for us, and important to us, and worthy of recognition in our program. I wear a 2007 "A" State Champs ring, which I am extremely proud of, knowing the hard-work, dedication, and ability to overcome adversity it took to win it. It means a lot to us, and to NCC, and to Holy Cross, and to St. Henry. This is the level that we can compete at, and when we are successful we celebrate it. If you don't like how we view it, then turn your nose up to us and foo-foo our accomplishments, but don't hold it against us becasue we are celebrating something other than the one and only, unclassified, one-for-all and all for one, almighty KHSAA Sweet Sixteen State Tournament.

[Baller99]

Well said Mustang;

RCC;

Year in and year out some of the small schools can compete and do at the highest level however it is much more difficult to do at a school that has 375 kids in it. When you are lining up against a school that has 1200 kids year after year to choose from it becomes difficult to reload with that low a number. Also most of the kids are playing 2 if not 3 or in some cases 4 sports to fill the roosters out at these small schools. RCC that's what you don't get. In small school programs you have to look for small successes like beating a "big" school in anything. That does not put limits on your program but celebrates an accomplishment. When you are competing against schools that cut more kids off their teams than you have or have over half their team that only plays one sport year around you are happy as hell to compete and sometimes win those games. When Holy Cross beats Ryle or Brossart beats Highlands in anything for a few examples that is a big deal just due to the numbers. So when the SMALL SCHOOLS can play against the other small schools and win we do look at it as a success for the program. You keep saying it's only a few that can win but NCC, Brossart , and Holy Cross which are truly small schools with under 400 kids have good programs because their kids work hard and are well coached. in SOME cases the larger schools are good due to the number of kids you have to pick from. Not to pick on them but for an example NDA has how many girls try out for Soccer every year 70-80?? I don't know but it's a bunch but the small schools very seldom cut anyone to fill the rooster. If you do not see the difference in that then you will never understand "Small" School sports. I am very proud of what success all the small schools in NKY have achieved and always will be. The all "A" is not a second chance, it is a tournament of truly SMALL SCHOOLS competing with other schools of the same number of kids and we all like it. RCC, Kids from small schools are well adjusted hard working kids that don't need your "protection" to be able to compete in life. They are doing just fine without your intervention but thanks for trying to "HELP" them.

[CatPride24]

So if the enrollment changed and Highlands was able to participate in the All"A", you would waive the right to participate in the softball tournament, hope Coach Richey would do the same in basketball, but if not, forbid your daughter from playing because of the terrible message it sends?

[sweet16]

Well said mustang and baller99

[PurplePride92]

I see what you are trying to say RCC9. I'm following your logic. :thumb:

[lawildcat]

I see what you are trying to say RCC9. I'm following your logic. :thumb:

 

Don't encourage him...

[PurplePride92]

Don't encourage him...

 

Just wanted to let him know he isn't alone. I think his words and logic are being taken too close to heart by people who don't agree with him.

 

I think everything is fine the way it is and while I don't personally have a problem with the All A classic I do understand why some people don't like it.

 

I'm more against classifying all sports that have a single champion more than anything else.

[Big sale]

I'm more against classifying all sports that have a single champion more than anything else.

 

Why? And isn't it going on already?

[TAC]

Have you seen the signs that pop up for Campbell County when they win a district? It looks like an election year in front of the middle school. Good for them if they want to promote success at whatever level. Same way if a small school wants to promote the All A or any accomplishments they choose. Nice looking T-shirts the entire city of Augusta were wearing at the Regional tourney this year featuring back to back district champs!

[PurplePride92]

Why? And isn't it going on already?

 

No. Football and track have multiple champions in different classes and I think that is it. I'm perfectly okay with that and hope they don't change it any of the other sports.

[RCC9]

Man oh man. I really could care less how the little schools celebrate their A success. But to say they don't treat it as respected as the KHSAA Sweet 16...not sure I'll go with that one. I've been told by many players, ex-coaches and parents that once the all A is over for some of these schools, it's hard to keep the kids motivated. That's because all the goals are geared towards the A.

 

Also, I saw a preseaon interview with NCC's girl's coach. Buttel did it at the beginning of the season. If we could post that on here, it would be great. Go back and watch that and tell me how many times he mentions preparing for the All A vs the regular season. When they ask him about goals, his first response was something about success in the All A. We are talking about the number 1 team in the 9th region and the eventual winner. Why is the All A the top goal? Please don't tell me it's not more respected to the smaller schools.

 

You can mention all those other tournaments you are talking about, but I don't think when they win those others they are claiming to be state champs, buying rings, hanging banners (maybe they are doing this one, i dont know for sure), and taking off school learning time to play in these games. So it's apples to oranges. The A is run exactly like the state tournament for a reason. It's a way to segment out the smaller schools to keep them quiet so the state doesn't get pressure to lose their precious "Sweet 16". My problem is, why do it for some and not others? There are 100's of teams that NEVER compete (just like the true small schools) in any championship basketball. Why should schools that are typically in the hunt for regular titles be given a second opportunity when you know 1000s of kids never will.

 

Never said this wasn't a great tournament. Or a great experience for the kids. Or that the schools shouldn't celebrate it. I'm saying, don't pretend that it is something that it isn't. It's completely a segmented way to keep people from complaining. I don't think that's right. And the majority of the teams that are successful are the ones that defend it to the death because they have an easy way to experience success, that's different than what other kids can. Where is the logic in saying a kid from Brossart or NCC (or any of the other teams that win it) deserves more opportunity than any kid from any other school? How does that sound right to any of you? Especially when those schools are extremely competitive in the regular play. Why do we feel we need to make up tournaments to let them compete when they already do? Either compete with all the schools (many of which have NEVER experienced half the success of Brossart or NCC and others), or don't. Classes or not?

[RCC9]

So if the enrollment changed and Highlands was able to participate in the All"A", you would waive the right to participate in the softball tournament, hope Coach Richey would do the same in basketball, but if not, forbid your daughter from playing because of the terrible message it sends?

 

Yes, I would play in it because I already said its a nice event. And I would want to provide the girls an opportunity, if others were getting that opportunity. But it doens't mean I agree with the philosophy behind it. I would still feel it's segmenting out teams to create a way for discrimination to happen. I would still feel it's unfair to others. I never said the tournament stinks. It's the segmentation, the "getting around the rules" to "create opportunities for the poor little kids that never have a chance" mentality that drives me crazy. If I played in it, I would be embarrassed to defend it as a tournemant that creates opportunities for the small schools. Because that to me would be admitting that I have no chance to compete anywhere else and I pesonally would NEVER admit that. If you are an athlete or have an competitive bone in your body, you never admit that you can't win something else so I need someone to provide me with a second opportunity to win. If that the way all you guys were brought up. Just throw in the towel and go for something lesser because you can't compete somewhere else? Again, I would NEVER do that. Why compete if you're not trying to be the best? So now that I'm typing and thinking through your question, I'm not sure I would put my softball team in the All A, especially if I felt that I was competitive enough to at least be competitive and challenge for the regular season. Noticed I didn't say win it. It should be VERY diffiucult to win any championship event.

[frankdracman23]

You are kind of all over the place on some of your points. First, you say coaches and players have a problem with motivation after the All-A and then you say the teams that do well in the All-A generally do well in the full Region competition. So are you saying the also-rans get all geared up for the All-A? If so, that goes against your point that the tourney is only worthwhile for the teams that can compete in the Region. You point out NCC Girls coach mentioning the All-A instead of the regular season? What is there to mention about the regular season other than District seeding games? And even those don't really matter as long as you are a #1 or #2 seed. Not sure how NCC with 375 students should prepare for 1600 students Butler other than by playing the best schedule they can which would include meeting some quality teams in the Region and State All-A.

 

And once again for the 845th time you or anyone else are free to start an ALL-3A/4A tourney for all those "100s of teams and 1000s of students" that do not have the opportunity that the All-A provides.