Dear KHSAA,

[Ram]

Yes, this is another realignment thread. If you think the current alignment is perfect or you think we should give it more time before we make a decision, then quit reading now.

 

Lets try to keep the personal attacks to a minimum, and pretend, for a minute, that we have been contracted by KHSAA to develop and critique the Kentucky High School Football alignment.

 

I have always found, that if I am starting something new or if I wish to improve on something, I look at someone who is successful in that field. I may not do things exactly like them, but I look at how they do things, and determine what aspects of their method would work for me, and look at what aspects doesn't work for them as well as it could. With that said, I believe that most, if not all, of us would agree that Ohio football is superior, as a whole, to Kentucky football. We have had threads on this and have agreed on this. So, for the purpose of this discussion, I believe we would be remiss in our attempt, to not look at Ohio as a possible model. Likewise, we need to look at Kentucky, what we are currently doing and what we have done in the past. And compare the two, Ohio and Kentucky, to find out what works and does not.

 

Link to the Kentucky/Ohio debate, if you have not read it.

http://www.bluegrasspreps.com/showthread.php?t=125614

 

To start a fix for the problem, we must admit we have a problem. I believe we do. Almost every team in the state will make the playoffs this year, thusly the regular season records virtually mean nothing. Most teams can go 0-10 and still make the playoffs. What is the purpose of making them play the district schedule, if they are going to make the playoffs anyway? Many teams will play a first round playoff game against a team that beat them by over 40 points in the regular season, the out come of that playoff game will be predictable by most of us. Only one 2A team in the entire state is going to miss out on the playoffs this season. That is not much of a reward for the rest of the 2A class.

 

So, I admit we have a problem. Next, how do we fix it. This is where we will look at someone else, to see how they do it. Ohio challenges it's teams to do as good as possible, against other very good teams, to make the playoffs. Teams are broken down into size (Division 1, Division 2, and so on), Kentucky is also broken down it to size, we use: 1A, 2A, and so on. So, we do not have to change that. In Ohio, each Division's teams are broken down into Regions, Kentucky already does that as well, so no need to change that. Ohio has a Power Ranking system, just like used in college football, which assigns a score for win/loss record and strength of schedule. Kentucky does not have this, so we will remember this when are coming up with a solution to our problem. In Ohio, the top eight teams from each Region make the playoffs, in Kentucky basically everyone makes the playoffs, so we will also remember this for our solution. In Ohio, every regular season game means something, it goes to the Power Ranking; in Kentucky, the regular season means nothing for over 90% of the teams. So, we will also remember this.

 

So far we have:

.................................................Kentucky.....................Ohio

Districts by size..............................Yes...........................Yes

Districts in Regions..........................Yes...........................Yes

Power Ranking.................................No............................Yes

Who makes playoffs......................Everyone................Top 8 in Region

Regular Season Means something........No............................Yes

 

Now, we have admitted we have a problem, we have looked at someone who is very successful in the field that we want to improve in, and we have compare the way that we do things with the way that successful person does it. Now, we have to determine if their was is better than our way. If it is then maybe we should implement some of their strategies, if not then we find someone else who is successful and compare the way they do it to the way we do it.

 

To compare Ohio football to Kentucky football we can look at the number of teams Ohio has yearly ranked nationally. I don't think I have to do the research to prove that point. Next, we can look at win/loss records from Ohio teams versus Kentucky teams, again I don't think I have to do the research to prove that point either.

 

So, I have determined that Ohio is much more successful in their form of football then Kentucky. I think that Ohio would prove to be a model for Kentucky to follow to fix our playoff problem. Next, we must determine how to implement the reform.

 

Ohio has roughly 700 football playing schools, Kentucky has roughly 200 football playing schools. Ohio has eight teams from each Region, in each Division making the playoffs. Eight teams making the playoffs for each Region will not fix our problem. So, I think we should divide the eight teams in half. That will have us allowing four teams from each Region making the playoffs. Two teams from each district, which will immediately cut the number of teams making the playoffs in half. Now, what if their is a tie, well that would be a good place to use the Power Ranking, rewarding the team that played tougher competition and having more victories through the regular season.

 

To fix this all we have to do is do away with the first two playoff games and have the two best teams from the regular season play in the playoffs. Pretty simple isn't it.

 

Now, we have the top two teams from each district making the playoffs and playing the top two teams from another district, 1vs2 and 2vs1. A Regional semi-final, then a Regional final, with the winners going on to play in the State Semi-Finals, then on to the State Championship game. Teams are rewarded for playing tougher competition and winning more regular season games, and teams are encouraged to do better in the regular season. And, we have taken a proven method to use as our model for Kentucky Football alignment, and hopefully it will bread success for Kentucky Football in the future.

 

Please fill free to tell me that you think I am wrong in my methodology, or to provide a better solution or improvements to my plan.

 

KHSAA and member schools, please read this thread and take under advisement.

[HT721]

I think one of the biggest problem many football coaches had with not everyone making playoff was the format for baseball and basketball. A lot of coaches at small schools were upset that they watched a 1-23 basketball team make the district tournament every year, but they could coach 15 years and go 5-5 6-4 and still not make the playoffs. Also I don't think the playoff format really effect how the top teams perform. The top teams from Ohio will most likely still be better than the top teams from kentucky no matter what we do to "fix" the playoff system.

[Ram]

Also I don't think the playoff format really effect how the top teams perform.

I agree with you somewhat, but I think it does affect the good teams when a player is hurt in a first or second round game that the outcome was predictable.

The top teams from Ohio will most likely still be better than the top teams from kentucky no matter what we do to "fix" the playoff system.

Again, I agree somewhat. I think one reason Ohio teams are better, is the level of competition. With Kentucky teams being rewarded for tougher schedules it would bread better competition and increase the level of play by Kentucky teams.

[Hatz]

It's not a bad idea at all but is it that different than what we had in the mid 80's when the top 2 district winners went to the playoffs? I guess with more classes it changes it some but I think it's not a bad idea.

[strongopenyon]

Excellent points raised.

 

I can give you firsthand knowledge of why I don't think Ohio High School football should be the Kentucky model.

 

I begin by saying I very much dislike the Kentucky six class system. Way, way, way too watered down!

 

The big negative with Ohio is the eight teams in each region. What has happened is an Ohio school can play a locked in schedule within their own conference (let's say, nine league games) and go undefeated (10-0) and not make the computer playoff system? Remember, only eight in each region make it.

 

In Kentucky, the converse is true. A team could go 0-10 and make the playoffs.

 

As is obvious, I do not have a proposed solution, but I certainly have a "Strongopenyon" of the systems I do not like. I would like to increase the teams who qualify in Ohio, and decrease the number of classes and make the regular season meaningful in Kentucky. I am not familiar with other state's sytems as to who has the best model.

[LRCW]

I honeslty don't feel the KHSAA is too concerned about improving the quality of play of their member schools. I'm sure all that matters to them is the almighty dollar, and cutting the number of schools that make the playoffs isn't something that's going to help generate money.

[westsider]

I thought the setup we had through the 2005 season was pretty good ... the KHSAA made a lot of needless changes to accommodate a lot of whiny coaches and administrators.

[strongopenyon]

I thought the setup we had through the 2005 season was pretty good ... the KHSAA made a lot of needless changes to accommodate a lot of whiny coaches and administrators.

That was my thought!

[HT721]

One more thing we could force tougher schedules and improve the Kentucky system in my opinion is if certain Louisville teams weren't given an unfair advantage by having districts drawn up to where they won't see each other until a state championship game.

[leatherneck]

I don't think we have a problem by permitting as many kids as possible to get to play football another week a year. It doesn't bother me one bit that a lot of teams get in the playoffs.

 

I also disagree that the regular season games are meaningless. I was raised to want to win every game I participated in for, if nothing else, the sake of winning. I sincerely doubt that if you ask any kid strapping his chin strap for a regular season game, "does this game matter to you?", any one of them would say "no" in response. Furthermore, hosting the first round of the district playoff against the worst team in the district means a lot to most coaches. Besides the obvious benefit of getting to play at home, the competition will in most cases be a little easier than the second placed team playing the third placed team. If a team is beat up at that time of year (as a lot are), the ability to get some rest and recovery for the starters in that first game is very meaningful. Furthermore, in the second round when the first placed team plays the second placed team (assuming the higher placed teams win), the first placed team getting to play that game at home is also very meaningful. I've said it before and I'll say it again: if Highlands had beaten CovCath in the regular season game, Highlands would have beaten them in the playoffs and may have won state. That regular season game was critical. Thus I totally, but respectfully, disagree with your underlying premise of what is wrong with the KHSAA's model.

 

What's wrong about Ohio's system is that while an Ohio coach may have thought he's scheduled tough teams that will get him a bunch of Harbin points so his team qualifies for the playoffs, he never really knows how tough his opponents will be. Look at the Ohio teams that scheduled CovCath this year. Unless CovCath improves dramatically, CovCath may only end up with 3 or 4 wins. LaSalle's win over them doesn't help LaSalle get many Harbin points. While those close to CovCath may have predicted a down year for CovCath, I doubt LaSalle could have predicted it. Furthermore, since most contracts are for a two year period, it makes it really tough (almost impossible) for coaches putting a schedule together to predict how strong their opponent will be two years down the road. On the flip side, an Ohio coach must be very wary about scheduling too tough of competition. If he overschedules and loses, those losses may cost him a berth in the playoffs. Whereas in Kentucky, teams like Highlands, Trinity and CovCath can schedule really tough out of state competition without worrying if the loss will cost them the playoffs. All they have to be concerned with is playing very tough competition to improve themselves. I actually think Ky's rule encourages teams to play much tougher competition, it just a matter of the Ky coaches having the guts to do so or having the money to travel for some of the Ky schools located in remote areas.

 

Hope that didn't come across too brash. Was not my intent.

[leatherneck]

I honeslty don't feel the KHSAA is too concerned about improving the quality of play of their member schools. I'm sure all that matters to them is the almighty dollar, and cutting the number of schools that make the playoffs isn't something that's going to help generate money.

 

 

I TOTALLY disagree with this post.

[leatherneck]

I agree with you somewhat, but I think it does affect the good teams when a player is hurt in a first or second round game that the outcome was predictable.

 

Again, I agree somewhat. I think one reason Ohio teams are better, is the level of competition. With Kentucky teams being rewarded for tougher schedules it would bread better competition and increase the level of play by Kentucky teams.

 

 

There is nothing, and I mean nothing stopping Ky teams from having tougher schedules. Actually, the Ky method actually encourages tougher schedules because the losses to tougher opponents do not impact your ability to make the playoffs.

[Ram]

It's not a bad idea at all but is it that different than what we had in the mid 80's when the top 2 district winners went to the playoffs? I guess with more classes it changes it some but I think it's not a bad idea.

 

Exactly.

[giantkiller]

I think your efforts are great and you bring up a good point. But if every team in Ohio made it then it would be March before it is over. KY does have a unique situation and one that has been address and changed over the years and everytime we change it has been a good thing. i am not say that 6 classes is the right choice but give it a chance before we shoot it down. If in 2 years it isn't working then they will probably change it again. To me tell me who we are going to play and we will go play. Let the politians do what they need to do and the football teams go play football. I hope that football continues to grow. A lot more kids are getting exposure through the expanded playoff system and technically a coach is getting at least 4 more weeks of practice by making the playoffs with a kid from freshman to senior year. But I do believe that you have some valid points but I will say that Ohio is NOT the right model for KY

[BULLDOG51]

I honeslty don't feel the KHSAA is too concerned about improving the quality of play of their member schools. I'm sure all that matters to them is the almighty dollar, and cutting the number of schools that make the playoffs isn't something that's going to help generate money.

 

I AGREE. One thing I would like to see is this:

 

If a school has 3A enrollment, they should be 3A. Allowing schools to petition and dictate their districts is ridiculous. They can whine all they want about rivalries and travel. When you allow certain schools to jump up a class (2 in some cases), then the school with the lowest enrollment for that class in that district should be allowed to drop down a class if they so choose. Why have a class system if you don't make schools play that way. I think some schools may have looked at their alignment and thought they would have a better shot at a championship if they jumped up a class or two.