Is the overall quality of Ky football improving; holding steady; or declining?

[jack99]

With Trinity and the winning percentages vs. out of state teams that you all posted, but the number of Div. 1 and 1-AA talent that signs every year just seems to keep on increasing.

 

This is the more accurate gauge IMO, because the number of total scholarships is realtively the same from year to year. Are Kentucky kids getting more of them? Is there an easy way to look back at the number of D1 and D1aa scholarship players coming out of the state over the past 10 years?

[bugatti]

Here is the record of KY against out of state schools for the last 9 years.

year W/L winning %

2011 45-46 49%

2010 37-58 39%

2009 40-51 43%

2008 24-31 43%

2007 25-30 45%

2006 41-44 48%

2005 31-43 39%

2004 28-45 38%

2003 30-44 40%

This year is kind of an outlier with Trinity playing so many out of state opponents and being so dominating. These numbers reflect that KY is typically around the lower 40% mark. Also fair to point out that Kentucky schools normally play out of state against teams from Tennessee or Ohio. Two solid football states.

[Clyde]

Does T ranking so high nationally serve as a stimulus to improve Ky high school football across the state; hurt Ky high school football across the state; or have no or only a de minimis effect?

 

Moving beyond T, what are your thoughts as to my original question? What are fair barometers to judge whether we are improving? Or are there no fair barometers other than judging improvement is like identifying pornography: you know it when you see it?

 

1. No effect IMO. Schools look at them as an aberration .

 

2. I'm not sure what barometers would be used. If you forced me to pick I'd say it is not getting better overall. That's off of the eyeball test.

[skycvg]

Considering the butt wiping that Trinity put on all out of state foes this year and little Highlands finally beat the mighty Elder to boot. Turf fields are on the rise all over the Commonwealth. It is a wonderful time to be a Kentucky High School Football Fan.

[Bill scfan]

It looks like we are talking about two different things here the quality of football that we see every Friday night and the number of quality players we see getting scholorships. One is not necessarly related to the other. To compete with out of state teams in Ohio, Indiana or Tenn. you must have a well rounded program with sufficient players (70 or more) and play few players both ways and have plenty of back-up. Teams with this formula stand out in the state and compete every year with out of state compitionn not necessarly win every year but compete. I think somewhere between 7% to 10% of KY teams that could do this year in and year out although not that many play out of state teams. I don't think this number has increased any for sometime. I do think most of these programs have a contiuos improvement. As far as winning precentages I think they can easly move up and down any given year. The more a coach devotes himself to a program and taking intrest in the feeder schools, freshman and JV football the more successful thsy will be over time.

 

As far as talent in Ky, I do think we are producing more D1 and D1aa talent than we have in the past.

[bugatti]

We have teams like Trinity that have never been better. But I also believe we have more teams that have never been as bad than what we have today.

[leatherneck]

Thanks folks for the thoughts. Because it's admittedly tough to judge football overall throughout Ky, perhaps we should refocus the issue: how about each poster answering the question: is your football program better or worse than it was 5 yrs or so ago and why? Just your program and let each poster's answer stand without rebuttal. Obviously posters of the same school can disagree with their assessment of their program.

 

As for Highlands, I think the program is stronger than what it was 5 years ago. Mueller's movement to two platoons has not only helped make the team better able to compete against the bigger schools where depth is key, it means that each year there is a decent number of starters and experience returning. While peaks and valleys was never a big problem at Highlands, the chance of a setback caused by losing a large number of seniors that filled a lot of the starting positions because they started on both side of the ball (like after the 04 season) is almost non-existent.

 

Next?

[Bullwinkle]

I have to say I got those number from a different site. They had them broken down by state not school.

 

I do think the level of play overall is slowly improving. I see school B looking at school A and saying "we are still not winning against them, how do we get better."

That approach forces team C to do the same thing. (or at least it should)

[Voice of Reason]

I think the 6 class system has weakened the product. It is only natural since a team would theoretically have less competition. There are some teams advancing further than they ever would have advanced under the previous system.

 

I think the 6 class system would strengthen the product. Smaller districts free up the schedule. The schools who want to get better have more dates tp schedule tougher teams and get better versus being locked into 5-6 district games that may not be as competitive.

[Jumper_Dad]

I think the 6 class system would strengthen the product. Smaller districts free up the schedule. The schools who want to get better have more dates tp schedule tougher teams and get better versus being locked into 5-6 district games that may not be as competitive.

Good Point! Would Trinity be better if they had to play more district games?

I know locally Somerset's current coach has taken this approach, scheduling difficult teams out of district to make team better. With 3 or 4 classes teams would have much less flexability to schedule up.

[Ram]

.......perhaps we should refocus the issue: how about each poster answering the question: is your football program better or worse than it was 5 yrs or so ago and why?

Next?

 

Well you ask a simple question. I wish the answer could be as easy. With the change to six classes, it would appear most programs are better, but is that because the program is better or because there is less quality competition? So, may be hard to answer. But, asking those close to the program may be more fruitful, so her goes:

 

A program is so more then wins/loses. Raceland I think is more improved from the ground up. Our Junior Football League has been more focused upon in the last 10 years and is producing great numbers with great interest in the elementary students. That aspect has strengthened the program. Raceland's Junior High Program has also had a new focus, with varsity coaches now overseeing and coaching that program. The Jr High players are now learning the Varsity's offense along with the JFL players learning the varsity terminology. The head varsity coach is now heavily involved in both the JFL and Jr High helping coaches organized practice schedules and coaching the coaches. All these things are currently strengthening the program.

 

The Varsity Program is now much improved with players more prepared for varsity playing time. This years team was .500, but much of that is because the of the size of the JR/SR classes. But, the Freshman and Sophomore classes are some of the first classes to pass though the "New" JFL program and many Sophomores were asked to do things not normally expected of players their age. The learned and responded. Next years team with heavy with experienced Juniors and will produce. Likewise in two years many of the Seniors with be three year starters with two being four year starters. Again prepared to produce.

 

From the Sophomore class down to, at least, the 7th grade has an average number of 20 players, that will likely produce 70-80 varsity players in two years. A very large team for a 1A school. We normally have about 10-12 players per class. Our goal has been 20 since I was running the JFL and we are now prepared to see that goal met.

 

We were also able to do something that I have never seen a Raceland team do in the past. We were able to rotate 8 different linemen in on the OL/DL. We normally barely have 5 quality linemen at a time, this year we had 8. After they matured and grew into their position we have see that wear down other team's linemen. A big assets to a team. Likewise we have been able to substitute freely at virtually every position giving players breaks. Again something we have not been able to do in the past. That is a direct result of good numbers and the quality of the JFL and Jr High programs preparing players to play.

 

Raceland has a great coaching staff with great experience. Raceland has put together a great staff with a mix of young and older coaches all of good quality in their own right. All most all played college football and have been able to mold our high school players into college players with many player playing college football.

 

The Raceland Touchdown club has always been very active in the sport. But, over the last two years we have been able to raise more money and purchase more equipment then we have ever been able to do. The Touchdown Club has taken a more controlling role in providing for the program. They don't' call us "Boosters" for nothing.

 

All in all, I think Raceland's program has improved in many aspects, and the best is yet to come. Raceland has been a fixture in the top 10-15 teams in 1A for some time now, but the next two years will be special in Raceland. IF Raceland is not on your 1A radar for the next two years, get a new radar because your's is broken.

[PulpFiction]

I feel skill wise that kids are improving moreso because of the improved coaching that has occurred over the last 20 yrs. Athletically we still do not match up with other parts of the country but our kids are definitely more knowledgeable and and more disciplined in their craft.

[leatherneck]

Well you ask a simple question. I wish the answer could be as easy. With the change to six classes, it would appear most programs are better, but is that because the program is better or because there is less quality competition? So, may be hard to answer. But, asking those close to the program may be more fruitful, so her goes:

 

A program is so more then wins/loses. Raceland I think is more improved from the ground up. Our Junior Football League has been more focused upon in the last 10 years and is producing great numbers with great interest in the elementary students. That aspect has strengthened the program. Raceland's Junior High Program has also had a new focus, with varsity coaches now overseeing and coaching that program. The Jr High players are now learning the Varsity's offense along with the JFL players learning the varsity terminology. The head varsity coach is now heavily involved in both the JFL and Jr High helping coaches organized practice schedules and coaching the coaches. All these things are currently strengthening the program.

 

The Varsity Program is now much improved with players more prepared for varsity playing time. This years team was .500, but much of that is because the of the size of the JR/SR classes. But, the Freshman and Sophomore classes are some of the first classes to pass though the "New" JFL program and many Sophomores were asked to do things not normally expected of players their age. The learned and responded. Next years team with heavy with experienced Juniors and will produce. Likewise in two years many of the Seniors with be three year starters with two being four year starters. Again prepared to produce.

 

From the Sophomore class down to, at least, the 7th grade has an average number of 20 players, that will likely produce 70-80 varsity players in two years. A very large team for a 1A school. We normally have about 10-12 players per class. Our goal has been 20 since I was running the JFL and we are now prepared to see that goal met.

 

We were also able to do something that I have never seen a Raceland team do in the past. We were able to rotate 8 different linemen in on the OL/DL. We normally barely have 5 quality linemen at a time, this year we had 8. After they matured and grew into their position we have see that wear down other team's linemen. A big assets to a team. Likewise we have been able to substitute freely at virtually every position giving players breaks. Again something we have not been able to do in the past. That is a direct result of good numbers and the quality of the JFL and Jr High programs preparing players to play.

 

Raceland has a great coaching staff with great experience. Raceland has put together a great staff with a mix of young and older coaches all of good quality in their own right. All most all played college football and have been able to mold our high school players into college players with many player playing college football.

 

The Raceland Touchdown club has always been very active in the sport. But, over the last two years we have been able to raise more money and purchase more equipment then we have ever been able to do. The Touchdown Club has taken a more controlling role in providing for the program. They don't' call us "Boosters" for nothing.

 

All in all, I think Raceland's program has improved in many aspects, and the best is yet to come. Raceland has been a fixture in the top 10-15 teams in 1A for some time now, but the next two years will be special in Raceland. IF Raceland is not on your 1A radar for the next two years, get a new radar because your's is broken.

 

Excellent post and analysis of your program Ram.

[westsider]

I don't think the quality of football is all that much better than it was ... say, 20 years ago. The talent level and quality of athletes may be better, but I think fundamentals (blocking, tackling, etc.) have suffered. Some blame the implementation of Hal Mumme-style spread offenses, and I'm inclined to agree somewhat.

 

Six classes had had a negligible effect on things, other than watering down the competition.

[westsider]

Does T ranking so high nationally serve as a stimulus to improve Ky high school football across the state; hurt Ky high school football across the state; or have no or only a de minimis effect?

Minimal or none at all ...