Which class was stronger last year, 1A or 2A?

[westsider]

Did the same thing for A and 2A ... I used theguru's 2A Cantralls to determine position. For A, I used my Cantralls from the next-to-last week of the regular season.

 

Head to head

#20 ... Fleming County 30, Nicholas County 18

 

Common opponents

#5 Russell vs. Newport Catholic

Russell 31, Newport 14

Newport Catholic 21, Newport 14

 

#7 Belfry vs. Middlesboro

Belfry 20, Pikeville 13

Middlesboro 25, Pikeville 13

 

#12 Trigg County vs. Crittenden County

Crittenden County 8, Caldwell County 7

Caldwell County 56, Trigg County 27

---

Crittenden County 20, Heath 13

Trigg County 30, Crittenden County 13

---

Webster County 14, Crittenden County 7

Webster County 25, Trigg County 21

---

Crittenden County 19, Russellville 3

Trigg County 48, Russellville 0

 

#14 ... Corbin vs. Paintsville

Middlesboro 34, Corbin 14

Middlesboro 35, Paintsville 8

 

#19 ... Whitesburg vs. Hazard

Whitesburg 27, Fleming-Neon 0

Hazard 55, Fleming-Neon 12

 

Of the common-opponents matchups, none of the teams appear to have a clear edge.

 

Overall, give 2A a slight edge at best ...

[password]

West,

Maybe I'm not following this part but aren't you missing the whole Beechwood, LLoyd, NewCath, head to head/ common opponents?

[westsider]

Originally posted by password

West,

Maybe I'm not following this part but aren't you missing the whole Beechwood, LLoyd, NewCath, head to head/ common opponents?

 

I was only matching up the top 20s by position ... 1 vs. 1, 2 vs. 2, 3 vs. 3, etc. Beechwood and NewCath were rated in the top 5 in A. Lloyd was #6 in 2A.

 

I want to wait to see what thescribe does with his numbers ... but I've got a method in mind to try and fairly assess A and 2A, one that would include the games you're referring to. I might try to put something together over the next day or two.

[westsider]

Originally posted by theguru

Here are some LIT ratings from late in the season for each class:

 

Class AA

1 BREATHITT COUNTY 104.6

2 LARUE COUNTY 93.8

3 RUSSELL 89.5

4 ERLANGER LLOYD 88.9

5 MERCER COUNTY 88.1

6 MASON COUNTY 86.7

7 MONROE COUNTY 80.0

8 OWENSBORO CATHOLIC 78.4

9 GARRARD COUNTY 77.3

10 LESLIE COUNTY 77.2

11 GLASGOW 77.0

12 PRESTONSBURG 76.2

13 BELFRY 75.9

14 TRIGG COUNTY 75.0

15 CALDWELL COUNTY 71.5

16 MADISON SOUTHERN 70.2

17 WAYNE COUNTY 69.7

18 NEWPORT 69.3

19 CORBIN 67.2

20 RUSSELL COUNTY 66.7

 

Class AAA

1 BOYLE COUNTY 113.9

2 HIGHLANDS 98.3

3 LEXINGTON CATHOLIC 97.6

4 COVINGTON CATHOLIC 94.8

5 WEST JESSAMINE 94.3

6 EAST JESSAMINE 93.9

7 BELL COUNTY 93.5

8 ASHLAND BLAZER 93.3

9 LAWRENCE COUNTY 91.5

10 ROCKCASTLE COUNTY 90.4

11 SHELDON CLARK 88.3

12 WARREN CENTRAL 86.7

13 ALLEN COUNTY 83.8

14 HOPKINSVILLE 83.6

15 HARRISON COUNTY 81.1

16 BULLITT EAST 80.6

17 BOWLING GREEN 78.6

18 PADUCAH TILGHMAN 77.2

19 CALLOWAY COUNTY 76.2

20 PULASKI COUNTY 76.1

 

 

I haven't compared them for all 4 classes ... but how someone can see these Litratings and the final Cantrall ratings and think Lit is anywhere in the same ballpark as Cantrall is beyond me.

[goherd96]

Personally, I thought the Massey ratings were more accurate last season.

[Mr. Reality]

Guru,

 

Who did beechwood beat that demonstrated they "put it all together"? ??????

[oneijoe]

So did I, goherd96... The Massey site is a real gem of info...

 

_____________________

 

It needs to be added, with all this 3A vs. 2A discussion going on while we're waiting on theScribe, that overall 3A strength and overall 2A strength is NOT equal to each classes' TOP 20.

 

_____________________

 

Of the common-opponents matchups, none of the teams appear to have a clear edge.

 

With the exception of Fleming Co., I agree. I'm not sure if I'm a believer in "common opponent" style debate points, anyway, westsider.

 

There's just too many factors that will affect point spread vs. common opponents - did they play one team early and another late?, was one team or the other injured during one of the games?, was there some kind of "revenge" factor going on encouraging a team to run up the score?, is the coach of one of the teams better at running in his second string?

 

You see what I mean?

[theguru]

Originally posted by Mr. Reality

Guru,

 

Who did beechwood beat that demonstrated they "put it all together"? ??????

 

Oh stop it Mr. R. Isn't it past your bed time?

 

IMHO, Beechwood improved a lot as the year went on. I can't help it they didn't play anyone until the finals.

 

Do you think Beechwood improved a lot as the year went on?

[password]

As a Beechie follower out of necessity lets review and I will point out where Beechwood improved.

 

Forget the opener against the out of state team because no one knows if that win meant anything.

 

Thumped by Lloyd in a game that Lloyd played very well after starting the season a little rough. Step backward.

 

Beating Holmes was a step forward as Beechwood had lost to them the year before.

 

Losing to Highlands 27-6 was a side step as the Beechies moved the ball well especially on first down but turned it over at critical times.

 

Beating Simon Kenton was a side step because it was struggle although SK was the type of team that played a lot of good teams close.

 

To me the turning point came in the second half of the Holy Cross game. Holy Cross wasn't a bad team and had fallen behind NewCath early when getting beat by them. Against Beechwood they led 8-7 until just prior to the half. From that point on Beechwood went on a massive 34-0 run.

 

After that turnaround the Beechies buzzed through Dayton, Bellevue by large margins.

 

That set up the district showdown with NewCath. The Beechwood offense did enough and the defense played a steller game in shutting out NewCath 20-0. (Remember NewCath had defeated Lloyd 28-21 and then Lloyd whipped Beechwood ).

 

After that it was a rip thru Fairview, another pasting of Holy cross in terrible weather, and another 20-0 against NewCath and then a 37-14 thumping of a good Middlesboro team. The run ended with the 14-7 loss to Mayfield on the carpet.

 

To me the key was the defensive turnaround from the beginning of the season.

[zanderman5]

Originally posted by Mr. Reality

Guru,

 

Who did beechwood beat that demonstrated they "put it all together"? ??????

 

Good point...I am a big Beechie follower and the last 3 teams if i was to rank them from the last 20 they would fall somewere between 15 and 20.:(

 

Z5

[westsider]

Originally posted by password

Forget the opener against the out of state team because no one knows if that win meant anything.

 

I'd say it meant something. Scecina made it to the 2A semifinals in Indiana.

 

Originally posted by password

That set up the district showdown with NewCath. The Beechwood offense did enough and the defense played a steller game in shutting out NewCath 20-0. (Remember NewCath had defeated Lloyd 28-21 and then Lloyd whipped Beechwood ).

 

Watching Beechwood and NewCath from afar, knowing one of them would meet Mayfield or Danville in the finals, the first NewCath win was the first signal that Beechwood had arrived.

[theguru]

Originally posted by westsider

I'd say it meant something. Scecina made it to the 2A semifinals in Indiana.

 

Wow, I didn't know that. I was not impressed with Scecina or Beechwood in that game. Beechwood wasn't the only one of the two that improved a lot.

[westsider]

Originally posted by oneijoe

So did I, goherd96... The Massey site is a real gem of info...

 

Can someone give me a link to the Massey ratings? I never saw them.

 

Originally posted by oneijoe

It needs to be added, with all this 3A vs. 2A discussion going on while we're waiting on theScribe, that overall 3A strength and overall 2A strength is NOT equal to each classes' TOP 20.

 

Actually, oneijoe, the top 20 is about 40 percent of the class. As much difference as there is in the top 20 between the two classes, I doubt 2A can make it up in the middle and bottom of the ranks ... there are some truly bad teams in both classes.

 

Originally posted by oneijoe

Of the common-opponents matchups, none of the teams appear to have a clear edge.

 

With the exception of Fleming Co., I agree. I'm not sure if I'm a believer in "common opponent" style debate points, anyway, westsider.

 

There's just too many factors that will affect point spread vs. common opponents - did they play one team early and another late?, was one team or the other injured during one of the games?, was there some kind of "revenge" factor going on encouraging a team to run up the score?, is the coach of one of the teams better at running in his second string?

 

You see what I mean?

 

Fleming-Nicholas was a head-to-head matchup, not included as part of the quote. I was referring to the common-opponents matchups.

 

I don't believe that comparing scores is infallible, but I think it's something worth considering, especially if several examples start to show a pattern.

 

Yes, all those examples you cite can play a role in skewing the matter, but I personally think those arenÕt nearly as big of factors as you might think.

[theguru]

Here you go west:

 

Link to the Massey Ratings

[3wishes]

Originally posted by theguru

I don't think that holds water in the Rock's case. The Rock was coming off of a State Runner Up finish with most of their team back.

 

I realize that and I see your point, but 4 big time starters including 1 D1 athlete did not see the field that night. However that isn't the case Mason County did what they had to do to win and they did, no excuses. I just wanted to let you know that Rock improved also because of the missing players.