The health of Kentucky high school football

[All Tell]

A certain coach who I am not going to name lamented the health of Kentucky Football after his team's exit from the playoffs. He said that it's not healthy for Kentucky Football when the same team wins all the time. Now we know who he was referring to but I want to expand his discussion. Yesterday Highlands won their 6th in a row and their 22nd overall. Central won their 3rd in a row and 5th in the last 6 years. Mayfield won. Forgive me but I don't know how many titles they have but I know they have been very successful and have multiple titles. Today Bowling Green looks to make it 2 in a row after several years of coming up just short in the title game and Trinity is going for their 3rd in a row and 22nd over all. At first glance it certainly seems to me that 5 of the 6 classifications have one or 2 teams that are always at or near the top. 2A may have as well but again I apologize, I'm not very familiar with that classification. What does this say for the overall health of Kentucky football? Is 2A the "healthiest" classification because currently they don't seem to have 1 or 2 dominant teams?

[nky_harry]

What can possibly be done about it? Not rhetorical.

 

Somehow hamstring the successful programs? I don't think most people like the idea of punishing success. If this was happening in one division, maybe you could tweak something, but since this across the board- small thru large schools- tells me success can be had at every level.

This reminds me of the class war in this country. "It's not healthy for those people to have all that money!" Study the successful programs, and do what they do.

[sml007]

This is a byproduct of the 6 class system. Instead of Highlands, Boyle County, Lexington Catholic, Bell County and Bowling Green all competing for a 3A title the past 6 years, they were all winning titles in various years without having to play each other. The 1st four years of 6 classes, Highlands, CovCath and BG were 5A, but otherwise 5A was very, very weak. Boyle, Bell and LexCath were 4A and each won at least 1 title.

The 6 years before 6 classes, the 3A Champion was Boyle 3 times, LexCath, Highlands and CovCath all one time. BG played for the title in most years, but there was 1 champion. When teams like Highlands keep winning titles, they become stronger and separate themselves from the pack even more. Until last year Highlands did not have to play 2 of the 3 teams that had beaten them the final 6 years of 4 classes.

The health of KY football is very poor. The culprit is that 6 classes have watered down and separated the competition so much that the rich have gotten richer. Some teams are winning titles every year because of the system.

[Mayfieldsportsfan]

You know there are two things that make the very good teams good. Jimmy and Joes and coaching. Everyone should know that all coaches are not on the same level. Some coaches just can't look at film and see what say Highland's, Trinity's, Central's or Mayfield coaches see. It really makes a hell of a difference. Some coaches are not good at in game adjustments and some are great at it and it makes a difference on the outcome of the game. I told my wife yesterday that Coach Joe at Mayfield is like his father in one respect in that they both surrounded themselves with great assistants. You have to have all the pieces of the puzzle not just one or two.

[TS]

Six divisions is probably too many but Highlands and Trinity have not won 22 titles each in the last 6 years. The gap existed long before the 6 class division.

[Clyde]

I don't have any answers that others haven't provided.

 

All I know is that the football playoffs stop being interesting to most after the quarter- and maybe semi-finals.

 

There are very few intriguing state championship games.

 

As a high school football fan I am not getting in my car for 3 hours to watch blowouts. I would go if I had a good chance of seeing tight games.

[Clyde]

I would also add that an undefeated team getting destroyed in the state championship game does not speak well for the health of football either.

[Bluegrasscard]

Who wins state should not be the primary measure of health. Though it often is. The State pie had 2 slices added to it. Great for 4 more teams on the last weekend. But overall does it improve the overall interest, participation and general 'heath' of the sport? The KHSAA says going to 6 classes has substantially increased participation - one its key measures. I find that claim difficult, if not impossible, to believe. Even if there is some uptick in participation I would like to see the correlation to the 6 class system or if it more correlates to elements like the rise in KYMSFA with its focus on state-wide middle school improvements.

 

Here are the elements that I personally dislike in the current system:

1. Lack of playoff participation by all participates. A subset of schools do not even make the playoffs and some never do. Kids at these schools never, ever get to feel a playoff game. That is terrible.

2. Too much predictability and too much per-determined structure of the current playoff format. If those knowledge here had filled out brackets at the beginning of the season how accurate would they have been - most would probably have been near 100%. Who would not have had HHS, CCH, LexCath and Boyle as the finalists in 4A East. There was no mystery in the football season for those teams and many others at all. Its all just way to predictable.

3. The above pre-determined structure leads to 'blow-out' weekend. There are structures that would address 1 and 2 and avoid 3. It requires eliminating districts and going to 7 team regions.

 

The creme will rise to the top in 3, 4 or 6 classes. The entire focus on state with absolutely not focus on district, region or semis is more a problem I believe.

 

The Indiana-style system, I believe, is an improvement. If Kentucky adopted it it would need to go back to 4 classes. But it would work well with 2 very separate post season tournaments. Indiana also uses random draw for its tournaments. It keeps things fresh and removes the constant, highly predictable patterns that I believe do discourage kids nowadays. This per-determined playoff structure is exactly why the 6A super district was created and its one-off rotation is done. How soon before 4A coaches and fans call for a super district of HHS, CCH, LexCath and Boyle Co?

 

I have gone into detail on the Indiana system in the past and the possible playoff structure that I believe would benefit Kentucky if adopted. But its not worth retyping since its apparent that the current approach is here for a while.

[newarkcatholicfan]

I will only say as a casual fan it becomes very boring knowing the same few teams are going to win it all more times then not.

 

With the way things are now certain schools have a huge advantage on players showing up at heir school to get an education until these loop holes(or what ever you want to call them)are fixed things will stay the way they are.

[Jody Porter]

The solution is so obvious that I can't believe the KHSAA hasn't seen it yet.

 

Teams should be classified every season, not every four years. Too much can happen in four years. Just look at Walton-Verona. (I have no idea what's happened at Walton-Verona the past four years, but I love that name, and just thought that you all should look at it.)

 

Classification should NOT be based on "enrollment" (a made-up word that the government uses to further divide us, giving them all nice cushy salaries and retirements from the tax dollars it affords), but instead should be based on talent.

 

Every year, the KHSAA Talent Evaluator (a position I just created) will go to all the schools and assess talent. (On second thought, one person probably couldn't do it alone. We'll need a committee. Say four, or maybe six. No, definitely six.)

 

To avoid bias, the KHSAA Talent Evaluation Committee will have a set of standards based on real-life players. Example: QBs will be compared to Johnny Football. He's a 10. If a school's QB is as good as Johnny Football, they get a "10" in that category. If he (or she) is half as good as Johnny Football, the school will get a "5". This ain't Rocket Science, folks.

 

After the Talent Evaluation window closes, the Committee will sit at a round table (so that no one Talent Evaluator feels superior) and pass their scores to the person to their left. This is where it gets a little tricky, and I implore you guys (and gals) to offer suggestions that I'll ignore. After the scores have been passed to the person to the left, the scores will then be exchanged around the table as if it is a six-sided star. (Six-sided star example) At that point, each Talent Evaluator will look at the scores that they now have, and either add 1 or subtract 1 to each category, depending on what happens at Walton-Verona, and pass the scores back to the Talent Evaluator from whence they originated. THEN, that Talent Evaluator will ALSO add 1 or subtract 1 to each category, taking them back to what they were originally (checks and balances...avoid bias).

 

That's the hard part. From here on out, it's simple. Average the scores for each school, adjust it to a six-point scale, round ALL decimals UP (a 4.1 becomes a 5, a 5.1 becomes a 6, a 0.6 becomes a 1, you get the picture), and bam, there's your six classes. (All schools that got a "1" are "1A", schools that a "2" are "2A", and so on.) (The KHSAA will hire a Math Consultant to help with the shift from a ten-point scale to a six-point scale.)

 

In the unlikely event of class imbalance (unlikely because of the built-in checks and balances, and no bias), the Talent Evaluation Committee will shift schools either UP one class or DOWN one class (depending on what happens at Walton-Verona) to get an equal number of schools in each class.

 

The only problem I can see with my solution is the potential travel-related expenses schools will face each year that can't be budgeted until the Talent Evaluation Committee has done their job and released their results on a blog or a facebook page. Not knowing who your district opponents are going to be until two weeks before the first game is, I admit, a glaring weakness in this system. But it's a weakness that pales in comparison to the weaknesses of the current system. Schools will find a way to deal with it. That's their problem, not mine or the KHSAA's.

 

All the Way to State!

Edited December 3, 2012 by True blue (and gold)

[John Anthony]

Doesn't matter to the Khsaa more teams get to play, they need to start handing out participation medals.

[Clyde]

The solution is so obvious that I can't believe the KHSAA hasn't seen it yet.

 

Teams should be classified every season, not every four years. Too much can happen in four years. Just look at Walton-Verona. (I have no idea what's happened at Walton-Verona the past four years, but I love that name, and just thought that you all should look at it.)

 

Classification should NOT be based on "enrollment" (a made-up word that the government uses to further divide us, giving them all nice cushy salaries and retirements from the tax dollars it affords), but instead should be based on talent.

 

Every year, the KHSAA Talent Evaluator (a position I just created) will go to all the schools and assess talent. (On second thought, one person probably couldn't do it alone. We'll need a committee. Say four, or maybe six. No, definitely six.)

 

To avoid bias, the KHSAA Talent Evaluation Committee will have a set of standards based on real-life players. Example: QBs will be compared to Johnny Football. He's a 10. If a school's QB is as good as Johnny Football, they get a "10" in that category. If he (or she) is half as good as Johnny Football, the school will get a "5". This ain't Rocket Science, folks.

 

After the Talent Evaluation window closes, the Committee will sit at a round table (so that no one Talent Evaluator feels superior) and pass their scores to the person to their left. This is where it gets a little tricky, and I implore you guys (and gals) to offer suggestions that I'll ignore. After the scores have been passed to the person to the left, the scores will then be exchanged around the table as if it is a six-sided star. (Six-sided star example) At that point, each Talent Evaluator will look at the scores that they now have, and either add 1 or subtract 1 to each category, depending on what happens at Walton-Verona, and pass the scores back to the Talent Evaluator from whence they originated. THEN, that Talent Evaluator will ALSO add 1 or subtract 1 to each category, taking them back to what they were originally (checks and balances...avoid bias).

 

That's the hard part. From here on out, it's simple. Average the scores for each school, adjust it to a six-point scale, round ALL decimals UP (a 4.1 becomes a 5, a 5.1 becomes a 6, a 0.6 becomes a 1, you get the picture), and bam, there's your six classes. (All schools that got a "1" are "1A", schools that a "2" are "2A", and so on.) (The KHSAA will hire a Math Consultant to help with the shift from a ten-point scale to a six-point scale.)

 

In the unlikely event of class imbalance (unlikely because of the built-in checks and balances, and no bias), the Talent Evaluation Committee will shift schools either UP one class or DOWN one class (depending on what happens at Walton-Verona) to get an equal number of schools in each class.

 

The only problem I can see with my solution is the potential travel-related expenses schools will face each year that can't be budgeted until the Talent Evaluation Committee has done their job and released their results on a blog or a facebook page. Not knowing who your district opponents are going to be until two weeks before the first game is, I admit, a glaring weakness in this system. But it's a weakness that pales in comparison to the weaknesses of the current system. Schools will find a way to deal with it. That's their problem, not mine or the KHSAA's.

 

All the Way to State!

 

 

Well done, Jody. You need to post more often. Very enjoyable read.

Edited December 3, 2012 by True blue (and gold)

[mcpapa]

I humbly volunteer my services as Math Consultant.

[DragonFire]

Just came across this on the KHSAA site (may have been posted here before), a survey of the member schools on the playoff system: 11/4/12 – Results of 2011-2012 Football Playoff Format Survey of Member Schools | Kentucky High School Athletic Association

 

It's a minor issue, but one thing that jumped out to me was the question of bracketing within your district or cross bracketing in the playoffs. The coaches were for cross bracketing in a landslide, but every other position (principal, superintendent, AD) were all for within. Clearly a difference between the folks making the budget and those worried about the competitive aspects.

[Bluegrasscard]

Just came across this on the KHSAA site (may have been posted here before), a survey of the member schools on the playoff system: 11/4/12 – Results of 2011-2012 Football Playoff Format Survey of Member Schools | Kentucky High School Athletic Association

 

It's a minor issue, but one thing that jumped out to me was the question of bracketing within your district or cross bracketing in the playoffs. The coaches were for cross bracketing in a landslide, but every other position (principal, superintendent, AD) were all for within. Clearly a difference between the folks making the budget and those worried about the competitive aspects.

 

Maybe its a cost thing. Same district is cheaper. Administrators may be more sensitized to cost and with the stretched out districts and even more stretched out Regions the cost of away games is higher for schools in playoffs under this system.