Patriots Punishments

[woodsrider]

Are you done contradicting yourself?

 

you said if they got caught cheating then drop

the hammer.

 

They got caught cheating and now you say they didn't?

 

Please show me where I'm wrong. Show me in the report where it said there was no wrongdoing.

 

I will wait. Again maybe you can answer the question I have asked for the last couple days that none of the Brady defenders have even dated to answer...Why were the balls deflated after the inspections? Haven't even heard an attempt from any of you trying to explain that one.

No I'm done discussing this with you. Either you can't read or choose not read all of my posts. Either way I'm not wasting any more time on you. I've made my position completely clear. You either get it or you don't.

[Hellbird]

No I'm done discussing this with you. Either you can't read or choose not read all of my posts. Either way I'm not wasting any more time on you. I've made my position completely clear. You either get it or you don't.

That is what I already said you already made up your mind and no matter what proof the league has you will continue to stick your head in the sand and ignore the facts.

 

Thats is your right. The only problem I have with what you said is you contradicted yourself. You said if they were found to be cheating then drop the hammer. Well the league did find they cheated and you get upset.

The Patriots and Brady are known for their cheating. It's a fact. Some of you think cheating is fine. That's your right. I on the other hand have higher morals. I don't think cheating should go un-punished.

 

All that has happened is the league came out with their report saying the pats cheated and the few Patriot apologists in here can't admit it and got your egos bruised.

Some of us already knew it long before the report came out. We arent gullible.

[Hellbird]

I just wish any of the apologist would answer my simple question.

 

why did they deflate the balls after the inspection?

 

You all

have your theories and aren't afraid to share them. Simply answer the question so I can understand if I'm wrong and there was no cheating going on.

[rjs4470]

Are you done contradicting yourself?

 

you said if they got caught cheating then drop

the hammer.

 

They got caught cheating and now you say they didn't?

 

Please show me where I'm wrong. Show me in the report where it said there was no wrongdoing.

 

I will wait. Again maybe you can answer the question I have asked for the last couple days that none of the Brady defenders have even dated to answer...Why were the balls deflated after the inspections? Haven't even heard an attempt from any of you trying to explain that one.

 

 

One last attempt with the possible scenarios that resulted in the balls being at too low of a PSI

 

1. Brady decided to circumvent the rule requiring a minimum PSI, and asked someone to remove air after the ref's did their test. This is the scenario that you've been proposing. And it's completely possible. Suspension and penalty deserved.

 

2. The balls were inflated to the absolute minimum PSI and checked out during the ref's inspection. Once the balls were moved outdoors, the low temperature caused the balls to have a lower PSI than the minimum. Again, completely possible. I've had to inflate footballs that were fine until they sat in the cold for a little while. Suspension in this case, not deserved, no one cheated, and no one let any air out of the ball.

 

3. The whole two gauge issue (one reads lower than another when checking the same ball) that was mentioned in the Patriots report. Hasn't really been denied by anyone, including the official that did the check.

 

4. The equipment manager made a decision on his own. After having the balls inspected they didn't feel right, and not wanting to anger Tom, he let a little air out on his own. Yes, he broke the rules, but Brady wasn't involved, at least directly.

 

At this point in time, there is no clear cut picture of exactly what happened. I don't think people here are blindly supporting Brady, or defending him because they are Brady apologists. I'm certainly not. I do think it's possible that he did ask for air to be let out....that whole point they made about "deflator" referring to weight loss, sounds absolutely wonky. But the other three scenarios that I presented are certainly possible, and haven't been proven or disproven. I'm not a Patriots fan, but I don't carry the hate and disdain for the organization that so many people seem to have (If this were the Cowboys, the team I love to hate, maybe I wouldn't be so impartial;). Anyway, simply don't think the NFL has really proved anything. "More than likely", to me, just isn't good enough for how hard the Pats got hammered.

 

I know this probably won't be good enough for @Hellbird. But I'll still drink a beer or two with you at the next get together.

[Hellbird]

One last attempt with the possible scenarios that resulted in the balls being at too low of a PSI

 

1. Brady decided to circumvent the rule requiring a minimum PSI, and asked someone to remove air after the ref's did their test. This is the scenario that you've been proposing. And it's completely possible. Suspension and penalty deserved.

 

2. The balls were inflated to the absolute minimum PSI and checked out during the ref's inspection. Once the balls were moved outdoors, the low temperature caused the balls to have a lower PSI than the minimum. Again, completely possible. I've had to inflate footballs that were fine until they sat in the cold for a little while. Suspension in this case, not deserved, no one cheated, and no one let any air out of the ball.

 

3. The whole two gauge issue (one reads lower than another when checking the same ball) that was mentioned in the Patriots report. Hasn't really been denied by anyone, including the official that did the check.

 

4. The equipment manager made a decision on his own. After having the balls inspected they didn't feel right, and not wanting to anger Tom, he let a little air out on his own. Yes, he broke the rules, but Brady wasn't involved, at least directly.

 

At this point in time, there is no clear cut picture of exactly what happened. I don't think people here are blindly supporting Brady, or defending him because they are Brady apologists. I'm certainly not. I do think it's possible that he did ask for air to be let out....that whole point they made about "deflator" referring to weight loss, sounds absolutely wonky. But the other three scenarios that I presented are certainly possible, and haven't been proven or disproven. I'm not a Patriots fan, but I don't carry the hate and disdain for the organization that so many people seem to have (If this were the Cowboys, the team I love to hate, maybe I wouldn't be so impartial;). Anyway, simply don't think the NFL has really proved anything. "More than likely", to me, just isn't good enough for how hard the Pats got hammered.

 

I know this probably won't be good enough for @Hellbird. But I'll still drink a beer or two with you at the next get together.

Number 2 is the one I would get behind if it was proven and would stand next to you if that is what was proven. The problem I have with that one though is what I brought up earlier and that is if they were all inflated near the 12.5 psi before inspection and then during the time from then and halftime they naturally lost air then I could live with that. The One thing that stands out though which brings huge doubt in my mind is the wide range of differences in the psi in all the balls if they were all inflated to around the same 12.5 psi. That is why I find that one really hard to believe.

 

3. Even though both gauges read differently, they still

both read all

the pats balls under inflated so this one simy shows what we know, that all the pats balls

showed under inflated. Colts balls not so much.

 

4 just seems a little too far fetched for me. Why risk your job doing something no one asked you tondo that would benefit you in zero ways. Just kind of far fetched to me, but hey i will

admit anything is possible.

 

in the end, I will still buy you a beer and hope to see you again during football

season

[frankdracman23]

I think #4 is the most likely.

 

Equipment guys probably got reamed in the past for balls being over-inflated or too hard even if they were in the legal range. So they know they have been dealing some shoes, uniforms etc. on the side so they are trying to please everyone and keep the side gig going. Ref weighs the balls with the "high" gauge and they are all legal and some are over the minimum significantly. After ref weighed them they figured, "Geez better take some air out of the big ones or Brady will be crying again." So they take air out of some of them that they think were way over the minimum. Not trying to deflate them under the legal limit but not really knowing if they were or were not under the minimum when they were done. Then cold air makes them naturally lose some pressure. So on high gauge some pass......some do not.

 

So penalty should be assessed against the Pats for "lack of institutional control" by their employees. Fine of XXX amount and a draft pick similar to the text and crowd noise penalties.

 

And NE would grumble and accept it because it is not worth fighting. NFL shows they took action.

 

But instead Goodell suspends a player 4 games because he more likely than not knew the guys were doing something to the balls. That brings lawyers and the NLFPA into it and it will be an off-season of turmoil and He Said, She Said.

[LIPTON BASH]

Everyone is arguing irrelevant points. There is some evidence that points to cheating. The Patriots and Brady weren't completely forthcoming and then decided to poke the NFL after the fact. The Patriots made their own bed by their attitude. Goodell may cut the penalty to seem merciful but they will be punished. Those saying this case may not hold up in a court of law are correct. But this isn't a court of law and the players and the Owner of the Patriots agreed to how this case would be prosecuted on the last bargaining agreement. In fact Robert Kraft was one of the main owners who fought for Goodell to get his current power.

 

At the end of day is the transgression a huge deal ? Nope. Has this organzation shown a history of disrespect for the rules? Yes . Poke the guy who controls the punishment just isn't smart business.

 

I think most reasonable people can agree the Patriots probably did something wrong. If that is the case then I think we can all agree while the NFL is being a little crazy the Patriots could of probably handled the aftermath a lot better.

[spindoc]

I'll be glad when it's over. This circus needs to leave town.

[Hellbird]

Lipton said it best.

History of cheating doesn't sit well with the commish. Not cooperating doesn't sit well with the commish. Poke the bear and the bear will strike back.

[ggclfan]

I am a big Pats fan but totally agree the Pats have handled this very poorly. The NFL has as well. Total debacle from both sides...embarrassing really...

[Djason Unchained]

Wait, so the Colts violated the rule also when they had an intern take a gauge to the ball they intercepted? You mean that the only people who can measure the pressure in the balls are the game officials and anyone else who takes a gauge or needle to the ball during the game is in violation of the rule? The same rule that has Tom Brady suspended for 4 games? So the Colts violated the rule in order to prove the Patriots violated the rule?

 

 

Hmmmmmmm.......methinks Brady won't miss a game.

[John Anthony]

...

[ggclfan]

So Kraft keeps talking...defending Brady even more today. Kraft and Goodell are going to the NFL spring meetings starting tomorrow. I would LOVE to be at those meetings...

[spindoc]

I so don't care about this whole ordeal. Wow, this has been the story that they just won't let die. Why do I think this is a "tail that wags the dog" deal?

[ggclfan]

Maybe Kraft and Goodell are having a cold one right now laughing about how they have kept the NFL in the news the entire off-season with this story???