Why not split?

[ladiesbballcoach]

LBBC, if the KHSAA adopted your proposal, I don't think the Private schools would have a big problem as compared to a straight split.

 

With a straight split, we would still be in the KHSAA, but there would be some feeling that we are "not getting our money's worth", and would push to leave, feeling that even more exposure for the programs on a national stage could be built.

 

What could you do on the national level by yourself that you could not do as a separate division in the KHSAA?:confused:

[TonyDanza]

So what was I "WAY" wrong about. Publics want to split and privates don't care. I personally don't care if you sit back and laugh. Just do it in your own division.

 

My bad I misread your post from yesterday. Sorry about that.

However, yes if the split happens I will sit back and laugh because it is so sad to see that some people don't want their teams to play the best level of competition regardless if it is a public or private school. What kind of example do you think you are setting for these kids on life??

[ladiesbballcoach]

My bad I misread your post from yesterday. Sorry about that.

However, yes if the split happens I will sit back and laugh because it is so sad to see that some people don't want their teams to play the best level of competition regardless if it is a public or private school. What kind of example do you think you are setting for these kids on life??

 

So your belief is that football, cross country and track should be one class?

 

And life is filled with actions to level the playing field. There are gender and racial hiring quotas. There are rules and guidelines placed on businesses on what competition that they can actually participate in. There are special levels in school for resource students and G & T students. There are tariffs and taxes placed on items to allow American businesses to compete against foreign businesses and call for even more to be done as American businesses are struggling to compete against them. Look at the present income tax system.

 

Heck, politics is nothing but one person trying to sell a mass audience that their plans to level the playing field is the best one and vote for them.

[Covercorner]

What could you do on the national level by yourself that you could not do as a separate division in the KHSAA?:confused:

I don't know that it is possible, but it's a thought that passed around a couple of years ago with the split vote. I think that the idea if the Private schools left the KHSAA and formed thier own association, they could become "Oak Hill like"- which I don't think is a good idea. But when that idea is tossed around, I'm not sure if people understand that you couldn't just play other teams without going through the rules of National Federation, and how you must be a member of the state association to play someone from out of state. Leaving the KHSAA is not a way that Private schools can "get back" at the Publics if there was a split. Just not possible.

 

I think the exposure can come to BOTH public and private schools, but not with a split. I think someone earlier mentioned that if it happend, the public championship wouldn't mean as much. I kinda agree, but more in the sense that the perception from outside our state would see the Private division as the legit or upper division, because (at least in Football- how it is in other sports I claim ignorance) it seems to work that way in other states.

[ladiesbballcoach]

I don't know that it is possible, but it's a thought that passed around a couple of years ago with the split vote. I think that the idea if the Private schools left the KHSAA and formed thier own association, they could become "Oak Hill like"- which I don't think is a good idea. But when that idea is tossed around, I'm not sure if people understand that you couldn't just play other teams without going through the rules of National Federation, and how you must be a member of the state association to play someone from out of state. Leaving the KHSAA is not a way that Private schools can "get back" at the Publics if there was a split. Just not possible.

 

I think the exposure can come to BOTH public and private schools, but not with a split. I think someone earlier mentioned that if it happend, the public championship wouldn't mean as much. I kinda agree, but more in the sense that the perception from outside our state would see the Private division as the legit or upper division, because (at least in Football- how it is in other sports I claim ignorance) it seems to work that way in other states.

 

The ONLY place the meaning of the championship is important is to the kids that are playing in it. I don't think the kids on the A state football championship teams think less of their championship because they weren't on T's team. And I don't think that those kids who would win a public school championship would think less of their championship.

 

I submit Highlands fans as Exhibit A. They sure seemed to be proud of their championships despite the fact they weren't won by a "perceived" best competition of T and X.

[TonyDanza]

So your belief is that football, cross country and track should be one class?

And life is filled with actions to level the playing field. There are gender and racial hiring quotas. There are rules and guidelines placed on businesses on what competition that they can actually participate in. There are special levels in school for resource students and G & T students. There are tariffs and taxes placed on items to allow American businesses to compete against foreign businesses and call for even more to be done as American businesses are struggling to compete against them. Look at the present income tax system.

 

Heck, politics is nothing but one person trying to sell a mass audience that their plans to level the playing field is the best one and vote for them.

 

 

 

Ugh...don't think I said that :confused::confused::confused::confused:

 

I am just going to laugh on the other part :lol::lol::lol:....because I picture you sitting there typing and that brain of yours going 100mph...and you know I don't mean that as a dig. :thumb:

 

Here is my opinion plain and simple. I believe that there is no limit to what someone can accomplish. I believe that regardless of where you live, rich, poor, color yada, yada (you get what I mean)...you can become what you want. I believe the day that you settle for something less just because you think you can't win...you have quit. If I am wrong in thinking this way so be it....just my opinion.

[ladiesbballcoach]

Ugh...don't think I said that :confused::confused::confused::confused:

 

I am just going to laugh on the other part :lol::lol::lol:....because I picture you sitting there typing and that brain of yours going 100mph...and you know I don't mean that as a dig. :thumb:

 

Here is my opinion plain and simple. I believe that there is no limit to what someone can accomplish. I believe that regardless of where you live, rich, poor, color yada, yada (you get what I mean)...you can become what you want. I believe the day that you settle for something less just because you think you can't win...you have quit. If I am wrong in thinking this way so be it....just my opinion.

 

I know you didn't but some of the newer ones would jump on that and wanted to clarify.

 

20 years ago, it might have gone that fast but now, I now I feel that I am the old guy wearing a hat going 45 in the fast lane.:lol:

 

I agree in principle to the last but would add that each has different paths and some paths are short and simple while others are long and complex. Some of the turns and obstacles on our paths are put in place by things that we have no control over. Some of the turns and obstacles on our paths have been put there by ourselves.

 

The life of the child born to a crackmother with no father in their life does not have the same path that the child of Bill Gates will have.

[PepRock01]

20 years ago, it might have gone that fast but now, I now I feel that I am the old guy wearing a hat going 45 in the fast lane.:lol:

 

So that's you! :irked:

[TonyDanza]

I know you didn't but some of the newer ones would jump on that and wanted to clarify.

 

20 years ago, it might have gone that fast but now, I now I feel that I am the old guy wearing a hat going 45 in the fast lane.:lol:

 

I agree in principle to the last but would add that each has different paths and some paths are short and simple while others are long and complex. Some of the turns and obstacles on our paths are put in place by things that we have no control over. Some of the turns and obstacles on our paths have been put there by ourselves.

 

The life of the child born to a crackmother with no father in their life does not have the same path that the child of Bill Gates will have.

 

Don't disagree with that extreme.

[Covercorner]

The ONLY place the meaning of the championship is important is to the kids that are playing in it. I don't think the kids on the A state football championship teams think less of their championship because they weren't on T's team. And I don't think that those kids who would win a public school championship would think less of their championship.

 

I submit Highlands fans as Exhibit A. They sure seemed to be proud of their championships despite the fact they weren't won by a "perceived" best competition of T and X.

 

I think that within the state, and on teams, any championship won is going to be the best thing ever, for the kids, coaches, fans, community, no matter how many classes or divisions we have in the state. I just feel that the perception outside our state could be hurt, and it might have some(maybe not much) impact in the recruitment our in-state athletes get from colleges. At least in Football, Kentucky has been climbing the ladder for some time now, but when all things are equal between recruits, the state that they are from still can make a difference to some college coaches(I think its BS). When I was a HS senior, I was told by a college coach that I'd "look better" if I played in a different state. I just worry that a split could hurt that perception of how we are viewed, more for public school kids like I was.

[leatherneck]

The ONLY place the meaning of the championship is important is to the kids that are playing in it. I don't think the kids on the A state football championship teams think less of their championship because they weren't on T's team. And I don't think that those kids who would win a public school championship would think less of their championship.

 

I submit Highlands fans as Exhibit A. They sure seemed to be proud of their championships despite the fact they weren't won by a "perceived" best competition of T and X.

 

 

As to the comment about Highlands fans: I don't dare say that I represent the view of all Highlands fans, but I wouldn't think our championships would mean as near as much if we weren't playing the best schools our size regardless of whether they are public or private. True that we win our championships while not playing X and T, but anyone who knows spit about football realizes that size does matter.

 

We have obviously been able to overcome certain size disadvantages, but we need to be honest about things. In most years, the size advantage of X and T, combined with their excellent coaching and committed players, would present problems for us. While we have great coaches and committed players, the size differential is tough to overcome. I think we could be competitive, but beating them would be a huge upset. Take the 06 game against X for example. We were beating them at half. In the second half their depth and our lack thereof (made even worse due to the injuries from Elder the week before and the non injury loss of two starters) was the difference in that game. I believe that if we had to pick our best 22 vs their best 22 we'd more than hold our own against them. Our championships are not lessened by not playing X or T. Our championships would be lessened if we did not play privates our size.

[thsrocks]

Why not split? After seeng the hatred and slander on the LCA thread I think it is time for a split. My question is why not? Most people I have ever read on the private side of the issue are fighting tooth and nail to avoid it. Most people I have read on the public side see it as some sort of punishment. WHY? The private schools would be able to flourish under that system in my mind. As long as they could still schedule regular season games against public schools that choose to play. I see an opportunity to end all the hatred and accusations and lies and just play ball.

 

 

If for no other reason than "we were part of the KHSAA at it's inception". Most states require that a school must be a member of their state association before they are allowed to play a team from their state. For Trinity to play Elder in Cincinnati, Elder must be in good standing with the OHSAA and Trinity must be in good standing with the KHSAA.

St. Xavier was a charter member when age was the main rule on the books.

Where someone lived was not an issue in the beginning. St. Xavier had some students who would ride a ferry boat across the Ohio River to attend their downtown location. Where a child resided was not a factor as far as the KHSAA and it's membership were concerned. Manual and Male could accept students that lived outside Louisville city limits. Students transferred all the time.

 

If the publics want to leave the arms of the KHSAA, then do so. Start your own athletic association where you can refuse to play any private school and any independent school or any school that has reciprical agreements with neighboring counties, etc. Of course, those trips to Florida and Las Vegas or even Tennessee for baseball, basketball etc. could be curtailed because your new association may or may not be recognized by the National Federation of High School Athletic Association.

 

The privates do not want to leave because it would hurt us financially. The catastrophic insuarnce is valuable. The pre-set district games in all sports and the "master schedule" in Jefferson County that helps cover the public and privates from being boycotted(some public schools have a hard time filling their schedules because they are not competitive). If the privates were not part of the KHSAA, we could not play Ballard, Male, PRP...it's against the KHSAA rules!

 

The KHSAA is not just about football, as the privates pay their dues for all sports, even those where we have not won a state title.

 

I still say we could go back to pre-1975 and the Jefferson County Champion is the automatic state champ in the highest class in football. The state at- large schools are the one's who begged to play the privates and the big, bad Jefferson County schools in football.

[Mr. Reality]

If you are going to kick out the privates for excellence in football, then kick out the publics that are winning all the boys' basketball championships!!!!!!

[ladiesbballcoach]

Just for the record, there is no thought of kicking anyone out of the KHSAA. That was not what Prop 20 was.

 

It is to split into two classes no different than what is done based on size in track/field, cross country and football.

[westsider]

I am referring to St.X as well and 6A. I just talk about Beatty because of the level of success we have reached since he started coaching at Trinity. Even so Glaser has 5 titles and been a spectacular coach at St.X. At no other level do you see comparable dominance by the private schools.

At no other level do you see private schools with such a numbers advantage, either.