Coronavirus

[Tigerpride94]

I have not seen any proof the virus was here before January. Seeing what happens once the virus arrives some place, it is very very difficult for me to believe it was here last fall. Just way too contagious and deadly for it to be here last fall and not be discovered. When someone produces facts and proof it was here last fall, we can entertain that discussion. Until then, I will let that discussion perculate on falsebook and other places where speculation and conspiracy rule more than facts.

 

I read from some virologists that looked at genetics of virus and they said it started in November in China so potentially in US by late December with speed of air travel.

[JDEaston]

I have not seen any proof the virus was here before January. Seeing what happens once the virus arrives some place, it is very very difficult for me to believe it was here last fall. Just way too contagious and deadly for it to be here last fall and not be discovered. When someone produces facts and proof it was here last fall, we can entertain that discussion. Until then, I will let that discussion perculate on falsebook and other places where speculation and conspiracy rule more than facts.

 

Last fall was the worst "flu" outbreak I've ever seen in my lifetime as far as shutting schools down over and over, etc. No one could figure it out, kids as well as adults were being tested for both types of the flu as well as strep, yet results were negative for both in a lot of cases. So doctors wrote it off as a respitory infection.

 

Is it possible that this virus was here for a while due to China hiding it for so long? If doctors and others in the medical field didn't know it existed back then they would diagnose it as the closest thing they can relate it to.

[JDEaston]

I read from some virologists that looked at genetics of virus and they said it started in November in China so potentially in US by late December with speed of air travel.

 

Or even November. Given how quickly people can travel it could have been here the same day it was there if patient zero traveled, or infected people that do travel.

 

My entire family was sick off and on from November thru February, some worse than others. My mother for instance could barely breath but tested negative for the flu and strep in November. Her doctor said it was a respitory infection and prescribed her a z-pack. She coughed all kinds of stuff up but it did get her well.

 

What I'm getting at with my last two posts is that no one knows how long it has been around, here or anywhere else. So using shutdown numbers to say it worked isn't a good measure when claiming it would be worse if we didn't shut down.

[Voice of Reason]

I read from some virologists that looked at genetics of virus and they said it started in November in China so potentially in US by late December with speed of air travel.

 

That I can buy. Most likely not in US till January though, which has been confirmed. Stanford did a big backtest of flu samples and found no CV19 before January.

[JDEaston]

That I can buy. Most likely not in US till January though, which has been confirmed. Stanford did a big backtest of flu samples and found no CV19 before January.

 

So you buy that it was in China in November, but didn't reach the USA until January? It could be here in a day, a few days or a week. It taking two months to reach us is a stretch though, imo. You can fly from China to the west coast of the USA in a matter of hours.

[Voice of Reason]

So you buy that it was in China in November, but didn't reach the USA until January? It could be here in a day, a few days or a week. It taking two months to reach us is a stretch though, imo. You can fly from China to the west coast of the USA in a matter of hours.

 

I buy it in China because there is proof. The cycle for infections starting to full fledged outbreak seems to be two months. November infections in Wuhan become rampant spread two months later in January. January infections in US become rampant spread in March. That is the pattern seen across the world. Those facts say no infections in the US in November. I just follow the facts.

[JDEaston]

I buy it in China because there is proof. The cycle for infections starting to full fledged outbreak seems to be two months. November infections in Wuhan become rampant spread two months later in January. January infections in US become rampant spread in March. That is the pattern seen across the world. Those facts say no infections in the US in November. I just follow the facts.

 

So you believe what China is telling us? They still haven't said when patient zero occurred and they have backtracked a couple of months already as far as when it hit there. But you trust their numbers?

[STPB]

Let’s be honest hear, nothing we hear anymore should be taken as fact. I don’t care where you say you get your news from there are falsehoods everywhere, in every article. No one knows if Chinese doctors knew about this virus for a couple of months before the US found out but I can tell you that I believe they did. We also cannot say for certain if this was here in November. We didn’t have schools being shut down because of the flu, doctors couldn’t figure out what it was. I believe that it was here in November. It’s my belief. There are some stories out there that carry the same belief but I cannot say they are facts because there is no real proof. Stop throwing the word FACT around all the time. For the most part these are things that you believe are true, that doesn’t make them factual.

[Voice of Reason]

So you believe what China is telling us? They still haven't said when patient zero occurred and they have backtracked a couple of months already as far as when it hit there. But you trust their numbers?

 

I don't trust China. But I have read in a couple of places that the first infections there happened in mid November.

 

There are many other countries where the pattern is the same. Two months after infections start, rampant spreading and deaths start. If it were here in November, the cases and deaths we saw in March would have been here in January.

 

In addition, backtesting has been done in a couple places here in the US and so far no evidence it was here before January. If you have facts or proof it was here, I am all ears. Rumors and speculation aren't facts. Just because a lot of people had a bad cold last fall doesn't mean CV19 was here.

 

Here is my question to you and to others. Why do you want to buy in to these rumors? What is gained by saying it was here in October or November? Why do people want to claim there really are only 45,000 deaths instead of 100,000? What does avoiding the truth accomplish? I would rather know the truth, follow the facts and learn from them.

[JDEaston]

I don't trust China. There are many other countries where the pattern is the same. Two months after infections start, rampant spreading and deaths start. If it were here in November, the cases and deaths we saw in March would have been here in January.

 

In addition, backtesting has been done in a couple places and so far no evidence it was here before January. If you have facts or proof it was here, I am all ears. Rumors and speculation aren't facts. Just because a lot of people had a bad cold last fall doesn't mean CV19 was here.

 

I think your missing my point. If it was around before we knew it was, or any other country for that matter it would have been misdiagnosed at that time, since there was no diagnosis for it.

 

So as far as facts go, no, I don't have any and no one one this website can claim they do either, its all hearsay. No one knows when it originated nor when it made its way here. Which makes it impossible to say the shutdown worked or didn't work.

 

Edit: Another thing to think about is the vapor cartridge illnesses, the symptoms were quite similar. It was here last fall and I did some research on it. Whether the cartridges are filled in the USA/Canada or elsewhere, most were actually manufactured in Wuhan, China. Imagine that, a respitory issue that killed people and no one could really figure out what was causing it, but the actual cartridges were being made in the same area this virus was discovered at a later date.

[catholicdude]

Just a question about the flu outbreaks last fall that some think was COVID: If that was COVID, why did it have such a drastic effect on the school aged kids but from what we've seen with COVID from February on, there has been very little effect on school aged kids?

[JDEaston]

Just a question about the flu outbreaks last fall that some think was COVID: If that was COVID, why did it have such a drastic effect on the school aged kids but from what we've seen with COVID from February on, there has been very little effect on school aged kids?

 

It has effected school age kids, they're just not as likely to die from it.

[Voice of Reason]

I think your missing my point. If it was around before we knew it was, or any other country for that matter it would have been misdiagnosed at that time, since there was no diagnosis for it.

 

So as far as facts go, no, I don't have any and no one one this website can claim they do either, its all hearsay. No one knows when it originated nor when it made its way here. Which makes it impossible to say the shutdown worked or didn't work.

 

Edit: Another thing to think about is the vapor cartridge illnesses, the symptoms were quite similar. It was here last fall and I did some research on it. Whether the cartridges are filled in the USA/Canada or elsewhere, most were actually manufactured in Wuhan, China. Imagine that, a respitory issue that killed people and no one could really figure out what was causing it, but the actual cartridges were being made in the same area this virus was discovered at a later date.

 

There are facts. We have proof now there were a couple cases in January. Actual scientific proof. We have proof from across the world that there is about a two month ramp up from cases of infection to full fledged outbreak with people hospitalized, ICU's and deaths. Those are proven facts. None of the other stuff you are mentioning are scientifically proven.

[TheDeuce]

Here is my question to you and to others. Why do you want to buy in to these rumors? What is gained by saying it was here in October or November? Why do people want to claim there really are only 45,000 deaths instead of 100,000? What does avoiding the truth accomplish? I would rather know the truth, follow the facts and learn from them.

 

Because they want to use that to justify opening things back up. If they can "prove" it was here months before we knew it, then it must not have been that bad and the shutdown was an overreaction.

[TheDeuce]

Imagine not believing in science. :lol2: