Christen Cunningham to Cordia

[PurplePride92]

This makes me think of a school like Burgin. It's an independent school and kids from the Mercer County school system end up there all of the time and these kids play immediately and everyone in the region still defeats Burgin more often than not when they play Burgin. I can only imagine the uproar if a few kids transferred in and are playing immediately and Burgin starting legitimately competing for the region title. People would lose their minds.

 

 

This seems like the same kind of scenario.

[BigVMan23]

This is...well at least was, the mission of the school. Taken from their own website:

 

A Response to Education Inaccessibility

 

As a response to inaccessibility of learning settings, Lotts Creek Community School (LCCS) was founded in 1933 by Alice H. Slone. LCCS began as a residential settlement school. The school’s first classes were conducted in a location provided by the Masonic Junior Lodge. In 1952 a three-story classroom building was constructed. A gymnasium was added in 1967 and the present modern school building opened in 1998. The new school building was entirely funded by private donations. Sadly, Alice Slone did not live to see the completion of the new showplace.

 

It was built because kids in that area weren't being educated and many couldn't get to school. I believe the dorms were built so kids...FROM THE AREA, could stay there for the week and not worry about getting back and forth to school. It helped facilitate their education and give them opportunities that at that time many kids in the Appalachian area didn't have when compared to other parts of the state.

[BigVMan23]

This makes me think of a school like Burgin. It's an independent school and kids from the Mercer County school system end up there all of the time and these kids play immediately and everyone in the region still defeats Burgin more often than not when they play Burgin. I can only imagine the uproar if a few kids transferred in and are playing immediately and Burgin starting legitimately competing for the region title. People would lose their minds.

 

 

This seems like the same kind of scenario.

 

If Burgin started suddenly getting kids from TX, NJ, Canada and who knows where else, "moving" to the area without parents, living in dorms or with coaches or other players...you are exactly correct PP. But of course that's not happening at Burgin. They get the handful of kids in their district and maybe a kid here and there that couldn't play at Mercer slides over there, but they are at least from the neighborhood. if they were doing what seems to be going on at Cordia, then I would be questioning them as well, but as we both know it's far from the same.

[FRONT OF THE RIM]

After doing some research, it appears that Cordia was founded as kind of a philanthropic venture. Apparently, way back when, the area didn't have a school and dorms were added around the 50's. It's just a big deal now that players who can win basketball games are living in them (link below). The second link (below) has even more details about the school's history.

 

Also, have to admire the determination of the woman who went to college in the 20's and 30's, then opened a school. I'm guessing that in that era, women didn't exactly have the easiest routes to college, so kudos to her.

 

Another tidbit, in 2006, Cordia sent 100% of it's students on to pursue higher education (third link below). Nice accomplishment.

 

 

With Cordia, it seems like you can go to a school that's cheaper than a prep school, play for a coach who was one of the biggest recruits in his class (so he's been through the recruiting process) and played in the NBA. I can see why it's an attractive option for kids. Progressive thinking by an Eastern Kentucky community to give Rhodes the chance to coach there. I'm guessing that, as far as competition goes, they saw the writing on the wall and knew they had to differentiate themselves from the competition and enjoy a "first mover" advantage. They made their own breaks. Can't fault them for that.

 

I'm guessing that they aren't the only 14th Region school to benefit from a "transfer" who could play. Why hate one them when they beat the traditional powers in the game and under the rules they've played by for so long?

 

 

As has been somewhat alluded to already though, I do think that if Cordia's ascent continues, they will end up being a "prep school" who plays separate from the KHSAA. Nothing wrong with that if that's the route they go, but for now, I think staying put where they are is fine.

 

 

How many years has it been since a 14th Region team has won the state tournament? How long has it been since one's been to the Semi's even? Changing the status quo isn't necessarily bad, and life will go on. I'd rather see a competitive 14th Region team play than one get completely blown out (unless of course they draw another weak region). Change isn't always bad.

 

The lowest attended state final in what I would consider the "modern era" (i.e., since the 3 point line in 1988) was 1992 between Lexington Catholic and University Heights. Have two private schools met in the Finals since? These things have a way of "working themselves out" (not saying that's right or wrong... just saying).

 

 

School History

 

History | Lotts Creek Community School

 

Cordia School | Lotts Creek Community School

The point of other schools getting transfers is that they come from KENTUCKY. I'm sure the other 14th region schools you are talking about didn't "RECRUIT" kids from Mississippi, Canada, etc. A very large difference. And don't begin to say these kids were not recruited from out of state because unless they were "approached" there is no way in hell they find out about Cordia.

[FRONT OF THE RIM]

This makes me think of a school like Burgin. It's an independent school and kids from the Mercer County school system end up there all of the time and these kids play immediately and everyone in the region still defeats Burgin more often than not when they play Burgin. I can only imagine the uproar if a few kids transferred in and are playing immediately and Burgin starting legitimately competing for the region title. People would lose their minds.

 

 

This seems like the same kind of scenario.

You are completely missing the point. If they come from Mercer Co. fine. They still are from KENTUCKY, not Mississippi, etc. I know some kids from Indiana play in Louisville but I don't approve of that either. No out of state kids should be allowed to play for a Ky. school. Period

[JokersWild24]

I understand that the scope of "getting kids who transfer in" from a wider area at Cordia, but it seems that historically, the better players in Eastern Kentucky counties were more likely to find their way to say, a Perry Central, Hazard, or Knott Central. Transfers are transfers to me. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

 

Ryan and Jeremy Anderson came from somewhere like Montana or Wyoming to Warren Central. The 6'11 Adams kid that played at Bryan Station following Shelvin Mack came from Wisconsin. Carlos Hurt came from Houston, Texas to Moore. Raekwon Long came from Charlotte, North Carolina to Scott County. Boris Siakam came from Cameroon to Caverna. Chane Behanan came from Cincinnati to Bowling Green. EJ Floreal came from Palo Alto, California to Paul Laurence Dunbar. Daniel Dillon came from Australia to North Laurel. Ray Kasongo came from Canada to Pikeville. Andre Woodson came from Fort Lewis, Washington to North Hardin. Curtis Pulley came from Laurens, South Carolina to Hopkinsville.

 

Can I stop now???

 

Just seems very ethnocentric to just narrow it down to Kentucky and the "surrounding" areas, however those are defined.

[JokersWild24]

You are completely missing the point. If they come from Mercer Co. fine. They still are from KENTUCKY, not Mississippi, etc. I know some kids from Indiana play in Louisville but I don't approve of that either. No out of state kids should be allowed to play for a Ky. school. Period,

 

Please define an "out of state kid" after you've read my post above.

 

Where do you draw the line?

 

How do you enforce it fairly?

 

What makes Kentucky so special that, "No out of state kids should be allowed to play for a Kentucky school, period?"

[PurplePride92]

You are completely missing the point. If they come from Mercer Co. fine. They still are from KENTUCKY, not Mississippi, etc. I know some kids from Indiana play in Louisville but I don't approve of that either. No out of state kids should be allowed to play for a Ky. school. Period

 

 

I still feel the same. As long as they are losing nobody cares. Once the Ws start piling up folks get sensitive and take notice.

[BigVMan23]

I understand that the scope of "getting kids who transfer in" from a wider area at Cordia, but it seems that historically, the better players in Eastern Kentucky counties were more likely to find their way to say, a Perry Central, Hazard, or Knott Central. Transfers are transfers to me. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

 

Ryan and Jeremy Anderson came from somewhere like Montana or Wyoming to Warren Central. The 6'11 Adams kid that played at Bryan Station following Shelvin Mack came from Wisconsin. Carlos Hurt came from Houston, Texas to Moore. Raekwon Long came from Charlotte, North Carolina to Scott County. Boris Siakam came from Cameroon to Caverna. Chane Behanan came from Cincinnati to Bowling Green. EJ Floreal came from Palo Alto, California to Paul Laurence Dunbar. Daniel Dillon came from Australia to North Laurel. Ray Kasongo came from Canada to Pikeville. Andre Woodson came from Fort Lewis, Washington to North Hardin. Curtis Pulley came from Laurens, South Carolina to Hopkinsville.

 

Can I stop now???

 

Just seems very ethnocentric to just narrow it down to Kentucky and the "surrounding" areas, however those are defined.

 

Each and every example you just gave...at least on it's face individually, is completely irrelevant. No body...well, at least most, is saying a school can't have a transfer show up from some far away parts and play ball. People move and relocate all the time. My family moved three or four times to a different state or different parts of the same state when I was growing up, it just so happens all those moves happened before I was in high school. Schools get foreign exchange students all the time, I'm sure sometimes they are good enough to play a sport. My Sr. year we had a guy from Germany who was a soccer player, but we didn't have soccer at my high school then, nor did many other schools where I grew up. But Frank discovered he could kick a football, so guess what? He was our starting kicker for the football team because he was better than anyone else we had. Couldn't play a lick of basketball though.

 

Bad behavior also can't be justified by others bad behavior. So, if what's going on as Cordia is "bad behavior", then one can't point to PCC or WC or BG or (add name) and point out their supposedly "bad behavior" to justify it. Wrong is wrong.

[AHSPanther23]

I still feel the same. As long as they are losing nobody cares. Once the Ws start piling up folks get sensitive and take notice.

 

I still don't get it. If there are kids going from Mercer to Burgin, they live in the same county and it is not nearly as perplexing as kids going from Texas to Cordia. I could understand a kid going from a county school to an independent school but going from somewhere like Texas to the middle of no where is a bit odd.

[PurplePride92]

I still don't get it. If there are kids going from Mercer to Burgin, they live in the same county and it is not nearly as perplexing as kids going from Texas to Cordia. I could understand a kid going from a county school to an independent school but going from somewhere like Texas to the middle of no where is a bit odd.

 

 

I was just using that as an example. And I guarantee if Burgin was using Mercer kids to beat Mercer then Mercer would shut that down really quick. Same for if they were coming from out of state or wherever. Nobody cares about Burgin at all. Let them start winning with kids from anywhere in the world but Burgin and they'll shut it down. Let them get some foreign exchange students from Africa that are 7 foot tall and can play soccer and basketball and they start winning and people will shut it down. The mindset is let the losers stay the losers. At the end of the day these kids coming to Cordia are coming from all walks of life, they are receiving a quality education and their athletic ability may allow them to receive an even higher education that they might not have received had they not came to Cordia. I have zero problem with any kid or family putting themselves in a position to succeed. It amazes me that people feel the opposite.

[JokersWild24]

Each and every example you just gave...at least on it's face individually, is completely irrelevant. No body...well, at least most, is saying a school can't have a transfer show up from some far away parts and play ball. People move and relocate all the time. My family moved three or four times to a different state or different parts of the same state when I was growing up, it just so happens all those moves happened before I was in high school. Schools get foreign exchange students all the time, I'm sure sometimes they are good enough to play a sport. My Sr. year we had a guy from Germany who was a soccer player, but we didn't have soccer at my high school then, nor did many other schools where I grew up. But Frank discovered he could kick a football, so guess what? He was our starting kicker for the football team because he was better than anyone else we had. Couldn't play a lick of basketball though.

 

Bad behavior also can't be justified by others bad behavior. So, if what's going on as Cordia is "bad behavior", then one can't point to PCC or WC or BG or (add name) and point out their supposedly "bad behavior" to justify it. Wrong is wrong.

 

 

Why is it irrelevant? I was just making the point that Cordia is doing the same thing many of other schools have done (receiving out of state kids) when someone else had said they didn't think "any out of state kids should be eligible". I was just saying that we start splitting hairs when trying to determine what an "out of state" kid actually is and it becomes really difficult to define.

 

One instance of this is EJ Floreal moving to Lexington from California when his Dad was named the track coach at UK and being spoke of in the Lexington paper as basically "deciding" on a school to enroll in once he got into the area.

 

I don't think any of the schools receiving transfers is "bad behavior".

 

What's good for the goose is good for the gander though, and I think that all schools should be able to receive transfers. You, yourself, admitted that you moved a number of times in high school. How would it have felt if you were a good athlete and people were crying out against you playing because you were out of state? It also seems that, in your example, you are saying that you were glad the kid you went to high school with who was a foreign exchange student was able to play as well. What's the difference between you and/or him and a kid at Cordia?

[JokersWild24]

I still don't get it. If there are kids going from Mercer to Burgin, they live in the same county and it is not nearly as perplexing as kids going from Texas to Cordia. I could understand a kid going from a county school to an independent school but going from somewhere like Texas to the middle of no where is a bit odd.

 

Not as odd when you consider you are going to an isolated area where you can solely focus on school and basketball, without much else to distract you, and you're going to play for a guy whose been through the recruiting process as a star recruit himself, then played in the NBA, and now coaches at the college level as well.

[BigVMan23]

Why is it irrelevant? I was just making the point that Cordia is doing the same thing many of other schools have done (receiving out of state kids) when someone else had said they didn't think "any out of state kids should be eligible". I was just saying that we start splitting hairs when trying to determine what an "out of state" kid actually is and it becomes really difficult to define.

 

One instance of this is EJ Floreal moving to Lexington from California when his Dad was named the track coach at UK and being spoke of in the Lexington paper as basically "deciding" on a school to enroll in once he got into the area.

 

I don't think any of the schools receiving transfers is "bad behavior".

 

What's good for the goose is good for the gander though, and I think that all schools should be able to receive transfers. You, yourself, admitted that you moved a number of times in high school. How would it have felt if you were a good athlete and people were crying out against you playing because you were out of state? It also seems that, in your example, you are saying that you were glad the kid you went to high school with who was a foreign exchange student was able to play as well. What's the difference between you and/or him and a kid at Cordia?

 

Joker, I don't think you got the point of my post at all. I'm not "against" transfers, never have been. I said your individual examples were irrelevant because they were just that, individual examples that as far as I know were completely legit, above board transfers, which I am ok with and used my schools German exchange student as an example. What I have a problem with is recruiting and actively seeking certain kids to come to X school to play basketball, or whatever sport. That is against the rules and absolutely not in the sprit of high school sports. Hey, if Cordia wants to do that fine...then they are a prep school and can't play in the KHSAA, at least call it what it is.

 

PP, in his post, also mentioned the kids getting a "quality education". Now, I haven't looked, BUT, I would say if that was the priority of the kids, then I think there would be many many other schools that would have topped their lists before Cordia would have ever shown up, and schools a lot closer to where they live too.

 

Now, do I blame the kids? No, their just kids and they are gonna go where told or steered to. But there is definitely a problem in the process that allows something that is supposed to be against the rules to overtly go on.

 

Also, you misread my post (bolded). I said all my moves were BEFORE high school. But they could have easily been during high school, point being that legit moves and legit transfers happen all the time.

[JokersWild24]

Joker, I don't think you got the point of my post at all. I'm not "against" transfers, never have been. I said your individual examples were irrelevant because they were just that, individual examples that as far as I know were completely legit, above board transfers, which I am ok with and used my schools German exchange student as an example. What I have a problem with is recruiting and actively seeking certain kids to come to X school to play basketball, or whatever sport. That is against the rules and absolutely not in the sprit of high school sports. Hey, if Cordia wants to do that fine...then they are a prep school and can't play in the KHSAA, at least call it what it is.

 

PP, in his post, also mentioned the kids getting a "quality education". Now, I haven't looked, BUT, I would say if that was the priority of the kids, then I think there would be many many other schools that would have topped their lists before Cordia would have ever shown up, and schools a lot closer to where they live too.

 

Now, do I blame the kids? No, their just kids and they are gonna go where told or steered to. But there is definitely a problem in the process that allows something that is supposed to be against the rules to overtly go on.

 

Also, you misread my post (bolded). I said all my moves were BEFORE high school. But they could have easily been during high school, point being that legit moves and legit transfers happen all the time.

 

 

Sorry, I realize that I did misread it now on you moving in high school.

 

I see your point about the cases with other schools being individual versus a large number of transfers and think there's some validity to that argument. I just think that splitting hairs on what constitutes an "acceptable" number of transfers in a certain time frame gets tricky.

 

Without being specific with names, I’m sure that Cordia isn’t the only school in Kentucky who miraculously ends up with a student who transfers in that happens to be a great basketball player. What makes them different from those public and private schools? It seems like you are kind of saying that if a school has 1-2 of these kids on the team, that’s okay (or at least more acceptable) than having, say, 8 of these kids. I realize the difference, but I think that plenty of schools, if given the opportunity, would take 8 kids as well.

 

 

Any boarding school has to recruit students to fill their dorms if they want to remain competitive and economically viable. This is whether or not they play a sport. It's just part of the marketing, budgeting, etc. that goes with the territory of being a boarding school.

 

One thing I think people are missing is that the true "prep" schools are pretty expensive, and are located in far more expensive areas. I think this is probably one reason that Cordia is attractive to kids—it’s basically a cheaper, scaled down version of a prep school. I would think that this is especially true considering that what we consider a traditional prep school in the Northeast where kids wear a blazer and tie to class every day only have a finite amount of scholarships/financial aid that they can offer, and their offers are going to the best of the best when it comes to talent.

 

Even some of the best basketball prep schools are struggling just to stay afloat. Look at St. Patrick's and St. Anthony's in New Jersey, where they are struggling just to keep their doors open. Between the economic recession hurting funding because less people can afford to send their kids there and less people are donating, the “scholarships and/or aid” at these places is drying up some.

 

Cordia is a part of the KHSAA right now because of economies of scale and scope. If they continue to get a large number of kids who make up a very competitive basketball team year after year, then something may change, whether it be a Rose Hill type situation breaking or them seceding from the KHSAA and starting to play a true “prep” schedule. Given their resources at this moment in time though, I don’t think the latter of those two options is very realistic. Cordia had a large number of transfers last year, but still lost in the regional tournament last year. I think it would take them thoroughly dominating the region for awhile for a Rose Hill type situation to occur. As of now though, they’ve not really won anything yet though.

 

 

Given all of those factors, it makes sense to think about why someone would be interested in going to a place that offers many of the things that makes a boarding school attractive, and does so at a much cheaper cost. For reasons that I’ve covered ad nauseam here, Rhodes has a lot of qualities that makes Cordia attractive to a prospective student-athlete in helping them reach their goals.

 

Most of the kids at Cordia aren’t going to be going to the NBA or anything, so getting a college scholarship is probably their main goal. Without knowing anything else about a kid’s situation, and not knowing anything about the situations of the kids at Cordia in general (i.e., I’m not speaking for them on this because I don’t know), I don’t see what it hurts for a kid to come there from a far away place to help him land a college scholarship if it means he’ll be the first in his family to go to college and/or be able to afford it when they would have not been able to otherwise.

 

Given that, I don’t see why the kids should be denied the opportunity to go and pursue that if it’s their goal. We wouldn’t think twice about a kid in Louisville transferring from High School “X” to DuPont Manual to be a part of a good magnet program at a prestigious school, we’d applaud it. Just like some kids may have a talent for science, others have a talent for basketball. That’s just how I look at it.