Do you think 7th and 8th graders should play up?

[ladiesbballcoach]

First, some of you may be talking about a situation in which you don't have the full picture.

 

MS basketball in NKY is played in the winter at the same time as HS basketball.

 

In a good portion of the state, that is not true.

 

In the lower portion of the 10th region, south of Pendleton County, they play MS basketball in the fall. August through early November/late October.

 

So a MS basketball player can move up and not miss their MS season. Most of the programs do that and the ones that don't (Pendleton, Campbell, Brossart, Scott, Silver Grove, Calvary) are at a distinct disadvantage.

 

Let's take Mason County for an example.

 

Their 7th/8th grade played 20 to 25 games this fall on a 7th and an 8th grade schedule.

Most of their good to very good players has continued to play this winter at the freshmen level. ANother 20 to 25 games on the freshmen level. So, the players at Mason County have been with a qualified coach in practice and games for approximately 8 months (not including what they do in the spring/summer with them) and played 40/50 games.

 

Players at Pendleton County have been with a qualified coach for approximately 4 months and played about 20 games.

 

And the coach at Pendleton is told to be competitive in that manner when the players are much further behind than every other school in their district.

 

Very unfair to ask that of the Pendleton coach.

 

So, to help balance that out, the Pendleton coach would ask for players to be moved up to jumpstart their development at the high school level. NOT TO SIMPLY compete against girls that are older than them but to try and get them more on the level of the girls that ARE IN THEIR GRADE LEVEL.

[Lunatic1]

Yes if they are good enough, then let them play. Many do not see much time on the court but they can at least continue practicing and working on their game with qualified coaches.

[cincy firestorm]

What does this have to do with it? Why should a student be penalized because their parent is the coach?

 

Sometimes, the coach/parent brings their 8th or 7th child up to the high school level, and they aren't ready to play to that level and most likely the high schoolers quit! :ohbrother:

[32minutesofpressure]

I agree with if they are good enough to play and the rules allow it to happen legally, then the Varsity should be represented by the best of the best!

 

I will say that having 13/14 year olds mixing it up with 17/18 year olds is an interesting situation. Because even as advanced as today middle school students are, that is quite an age range of maturity (physically, mentally, socially, and emotionally).

[ColonelMike]

This has been already covered in multiple revious threads, but I'll weigh in anyway...

 

For the sake of argument, let's assume that either the girl in question IS that good or the program is that bad where a seventh or eight grader will play varsity.

Point: In a school such as Beechwood or Holmes where the High School extends below 9th grade ( 7th at BW and 8th at HHS), I have no problem with those students who are in that high school playing on Freshmen, JV or Varsity teams. In other schools, where the middle school is offsite or totally separate on another part of the campus (ie Connor or Ryle), I am absolutely against it.

 

Here is my reasoning:

1)Social Ramifications:

By allowing a student up to 6 years younger than the senior class, who doesn't deal with older kids on the same scale, to spend significant time with older students, you've exposed the younger to things they may not or should not be ready for. We all know that things happen in the high school setting that do not in Jr High.

Additionally, you're taking time away from the younger's normal social development with friends ther own age. It is hard enought to make it when you spend the normal extra curricular hours with your peers, but when you change that to travel to another team right after school, its a stress these youngsters do not need.

Finally (on this point) the younger student may (will) face increased resentment from the other Frosh / Soph / Juniors that she will pass up. This will not help with normal social interaction once that child reached high school.

 

2) Academic Problems:

While it is not practice in most schools to give homework breaks for big games, students are expected to have developed the necessary study skills to handle the job. An eight grader at Turkeyfoot may not have the teacher's understanding when Dixie travells to Pendleton County for a game that night. In fact, if the students are travelling together, The younger cannot even work with the traditional athlete as they have differring work. Most middle school teams do not travel as far as high school teams.

 

3) Physical Problems:

Especially with girls, teen athletes' bodies are being taxed too much already. It is a shame to see the number of girls on the floor each night with ankle braces, knee problems and shin splints. Allowing young women to wait another year or two before enduring the more stressful routines will allow their bone and joint structures to catch up with the (typical) weight gain from puberty. It has been written over and over that over involvement at younger ages is leading to these chornic injuries in young women.

 

I welcome any other opinions, but this is why I feel the way I do.:thumb:

 

Perhaps one of the most thought-provoking posts I've ever read on BGP.

 

As a general rule, I totally agree with everything you said. And these SHOULD be the primary concerns, NOT the secondary concerns. School is for education first, and the physical/emotional/mental maturity of the child is extremely important.

 

As a GENERAL RULE, I feel kids should play in their school...however, I think it generally is OK for 8th graders to get a taste of HS sports on freshmen teams, and certainly, at some schools, (i.e., Eminence, Ludlow, etc.), it may be necessary to dig deep to field a varsity team. But then again, many of those independent schools actually house the "middle school" kids, anyway (what we referred to as "junior high school" in my day).

 

It's not an issue of fairness, or allowing the kid to pay to the level of their ability. It's a recognition of the fact that kids need to mature - physically, mentally, and emotionally, and those issues too often get overlooked in the interest of getting a 6'7" physical anomaly of a 7th grader playing on the front line of a varsity basketball team...

[hoopgirl40]

That's the key issue...they may be physically mature enough to play JV or varsity, but a 12 or 13 yr old isn't as mature in other ways. If the middle schooler is really that good, she will have four years of high school to prove it. If she needs to be challenged, play up a year or two in AAU. Those are the kids she'll be competeing with when she is in high school. It builds a stronger program from the bottom up, and keeps the older girls playing.

[ladiesbballcoach]

That's the key issue...they may be physically mature enough to play JV or varsity, but a 12 or 13 yr old isn't as mature in other ways. If the middle schooler is really that good, she will have four years of high school to prove it. If she needs to be challenged, play up a year or two in AAU. Those are the kids she'll be competeing with when she is in high school. It builds a stronger program from the bottom up, and keeps the older girls playing.

 

And what if the older girls are not as good or as tall or as productive?

[ladiesbballcoach]

Thought this was pertinent to this discussion.

 

http://www.bluegrasspreps.com/showthread.php?t=174096

 

The Ladyhounds were led by 8th grader, Alexis Tye. She was named the games MVP with a career high 14 points. When Paris was shooting blanks in the first half, Tye came off the bench to keep them in the game. Paris trailed 38-30 with less than 3 minutes to go and closed the game on an 11-0 run. Morgan Crain finished with 9 points and 15 rebounds. Emily Hinkson, who had no points and no rebounds at the half finished with 8 points and 9 rebounds. Paris never led in this game until one minute to go when Kendall Cassity hit her second three point goal in the 4th quarter.

[Lunatic1]

That's the key issue...they may be physically mature enough to play JV or varsity, but a 12 or 13 yr old isn't as mature in other ways. If the middle schooler is really that good, she will have four years of high school to prove it. If she needs to be challenged, play up a year or two in AAU. Those are the kids she'll be competeing with when she is in high school. It builds a stronger program from the bottom up, and keeps the older girls playing.

 

Most girls in small towns do not have access to AAU teams and most can not afford it. Playing up is the only alternative to continue playing.

 

 

If a high school Coach in a small town wants to develop a team they have to bring the girls up and keep them practicing after their season. There is limited access to gyms and they need to be able to use the time most effectively.

[C6H0-83]

I don't agree with kids who are not in HS (grades 9-12) playing HS sports. I may be old fashioned but having gone to HS in Ohio where this is not permitted, and having coached Basketball in Ky I still feel that HS sports are for HS student-athletes. Yes the kid may have the physical talent to compete with older athletes at their school, but what about the talent at their opponents school? And I don't think it is just about talent. You have the emotional side to deal with as well, and as a society pushing kids to grow up earlier than they should.

 

I don't want my middle school daughter being forced into the teenage world any sooner than she needs to be. Let them enjoy being kids, there is still 4 years of HS to be exposed to the play and social side. I would be very surprised if there were any kid out there that missed out on a scholarship or chance to go to the next level because they only played 4 years of HS sports and not 5-8!

[cincy firestorm]

I don't agree with kids who are not in HS (grades 9-12) playing HS sports. I may be old fashioned but having gone to HS in Ohio where this is not permitted, and having coached Basketball in Ky I still feel that HS sports are for HS student-athletes. Yes the kid may have the physical talent to compete with older athletes at their school, but what about the talent at their opponents school? And I don't think it is just about talent. You have the emotional side to deal with as well, and as a society pushing kids to grow up earlier than they should.

 

I don't want my middle school daughter being forced into the teenage world any sooner than she needs to be. Let them enjoy being kids, there is still 4 years of HS to be exposed to the play and social side. I would be very surprised if there were any kid out there that missed out on a scholarship or chance to go to the next level because they only played 4 years of HS sports and not 5-8!

Well said. Edited February 2, 2009 by Ram
Rule 13

[magicfan217]

If you're a middle school kid and you are good enough to compete at the high school level then you should be allowed. Can you imagine Kendall Noble from Breathit County not being allowed to play? She was regional player of the year....as a 7th grader! She led her team to the state tournament and made the all-tournament team as an 8th grader. Breathit most certainly would not have had the success they have had over the last few years if it weren't for her. To deprive her of playing would not only be unfair to her, but to the other kids on the team and the community that supports the program. The best should play, period.

[magicfan217]

I don't agree with kids who are not in HS (grades 9-12) playing HS sports. I may be old fashioned but having gone to HS in Ohio where this is not permitted, and having coached Basketball in Ky I still feel that HS sports are for HS student-athletes. Yes the kid may have the physical talent to compete with older athletes at their school, but what about the talent at their opponents school? And I don't think it is just about talent. You have the emotional side to deal with as well, and as a society pushing kids to grow up earlier than they should.

 

I don't want my middle school daughter being forced into the teenage world any sooner than she needs to be. Let them enjoy being kids, there is still 4 years of HS to be exposed to the play and social side. I would be very surprised if there were any kid out there that missed out on a scholarship or chance to go to the next level because they only played 4 years of HS sports and not 5-8!

 

 

 

Then as a parent you don't have to let your kid play, although I would imagine that if you had a kid that was good enough to play up you would love to see them playing at the high school level a few years early.

[STRIKE3]

Keep in mind, that when the term "play up" is mentioned it's usually not a starter but will get some playing time. I understand the argument, about different ages but often times it can help being around older kids, with regards to maturity.

 

Practicing against bigger, faster and stronger will also help your development of a better overall player. I've seen 8th graders play both Basketball and Baseball, in certain positions and do very well against some teams.

[catfan08]

If you're a middle school kid and you are good enough to compete at the high school level then you should be allowed. Can you imagine Kendall Noble from Breathit County not being allowed to play? She was regional player of the year....as a 7th grader! She led her team to the state tournament and made the all-tournament team as an 8th grader. Breathit most certainly would not have had the success they have had over the last few years if it weren't for her. To deprive her of playing would not only be unfair to her, but to the other kids on the team and the community that supports the program. The best should play, period.

 

Very well said!!! I agree