Gridiron Dynasties

[2 Humped Camel]

I am tired of hearing that Highlands, Trinity, St. X, all practice so much more and work so much harder than everybody else. The majority of the high school teams in Kentucky all do offseason programs that are very similar. They do weight lifting, conditioning, plyometrics, drills work, chalk talk, etc. Everybody needs to get off their high horse and quit talking about how these select teams (Highlands, Trinity, etc) work so much harder and do so much more. Now, do some teams not do as much? I am sure, but there are no secrets in off season conditioning. There are no secret practice methods that they utilize. No secret plays they use. Put Highlands, Trinity, St X coaches at other schools and they don't win state championship or even have winning seasons.

 

As a somewhat impartial observer I will have to disagree with you. I can only speak to Highlands because I haven't seen T & X practice but HHS puts in alot more time than we ever did as players, and when I played I didn't think you could be worked any harder. Sure it doesn't hurt that they get a fair amount of transfers to come in but they put their work in about 48 weeks a year. Also when they are done with thier organized activities alot of thier guys will go back and lift more. Culture is a big part of it but so is hard work.

[FamilyTradition]

No offense to South Oldham but I highly doubt any team in KY currently runs an offense quite like Trinity's to the same level of efficiency. That is one of the things that has separated us from teams of equal size and greater talent on a number of occasions. We don't often have tons of D1 athletes. This past season was definitely an exception with Jordan Whiting and Tim Phillips.

I have to agree with the level of difficulty of covering the Rock's passing attack. I got to see it this past summer up at Highlands during a 7 on 7.

[footballhd]

No thanks, would be a waste of my time.

 

I didnt want a step by step work out, but rather was trying to make the point that a lot of teams in Kentucky do a similar offseason program. It is more than just working harder or doing more. It has more to do with the players/talent, tradition, and culture of the school. As someone previously noted being a highlands football player starts when a kid is 10 years old or younger. That doesnt happen at most places. Also, highlands has several players that can start on any team in the state of kentucky. Not many places can make that claim. Yes, other teams might have more students in the school, but how many of them are football players? If you dont have talent, its hard to win at a high level. You cant take a 5'5" kid that cant bench 100 pounds or break a 7 flat 40 and turn him into a 6'1 kid that benches 350 pounds and runs a 4.5 40. All you can do is take that 5'5" kid and have him get better.

 

Also 75 Center, I am not saying Mueller is not a great coach. You have to know a thing or two to accomplish what he has, but you stick him someplace like Bracken County, Jenkins, Phelps, Atherton, Iroquois, Owen County, etc.. He wouldnt have a winning season, at least not for several years.

[NamecipS]

I am tired of hearing that Highlands, Trinity, St. X, all practice so much more and work so much harder than everybody else. The majority of the high school teams in Kentucky all do offseason programs that are very similar.

 

Different levels of committment and dedication at those schools than most of the other schools in KY.

[PAPA PIGSKIN]

I have been associated with several different successful football programs over the past few years. A couple of which have made deep runs in the playoffs. 2 Teams were more talented than any team they played as around 6 or 7 players went D1. However, when we got deep into the playoffs we were beaten by one of these so called dynasties. I can tell you after losses in the semis you start wondering what you have to do to win. I have met with coaches from Trinity and Highlands. The difference is clear. The committment to excellence they demand on every rep, every day is unparralleled. The term "hard work" is relative. If i haven't exercised in a year and walk on a treadmill at 3 mph for 20 minutes i might think that is hard work, but for someone who runs 5 miles a day they would consider that a warm up.

 

These programs also they don't follow some cookie cutter off-season program they sit down and design fun, but demanding drills that make the kids develop skills that are scheme and goal specific for their offense and defense. To sum it up they worry about getting the most out of the fundamentals of football and don't worry about x' and o's as much.

 

I can think of a guy who focused on fundamentals instead of scheme at Boyle County and he won 5 state championships and I know he didn't have the most talent in the state.

 

It is just hard as a football staff to totally sell out to simplicity of scheme so you can concentrate on the fundamentals. The aforementioned teams know this is high school football and you win with great fundamentals. They have sold out to this committment.

Edited January 13, 2009 by PAPA PIGSKIN
Rule 13

[leatherneck]

For one, I am pretty sure Highlands and South were in the same district a couple of years ago. My son only started playing 2 years ago, so I am not exactly sure, but I did see that south only lost to Highlands by 1 point several years ago. Now, the biggest thing I see as a parent is the culture of the school and parents. My son would come home complaining about how tired he was and didnt know if he wanted to keep playing and I would tell him to keep working and he would get paid back later. I saw it over and over, parents going to the coaches basically saying they were working their sons too hard. The school itself promotes no sports. My son was talking about a the 1 pep rally they had, so I asked him what they did to get pumped up about the game and he said that it was a school wide pep rally. Everybody from football, soccer, band, cross county, etc were honored. What a joke! Also, the most talented player on Souths team probably would only start special teams and be a back up on O or D. Talent makes a difference. Having 1 or 2 division 1 players really helps out also. I am not on here trying to knock Highlands or other great teams, but actually just wanting their fans to understand that there are hundreds of other teams working just as hard as their team during the offseason, summer, and season and it doesnt always relate into the success the dominant power have year in and year out. It has a lot to do with the culture of the school, parents, and talent. Its not about the X's and O's as much as the Jimmys and Joes.

 

That culture that you mention does indeed enable the Highlands coaches to demand more from their players and motivates Highlands players to push themselves harder. Recently, there was a kid from out of district that moved to Ft. Thomas due to family reasons. Out of respect, I won't mention names. The long and the short of it was the young man didn't stay on the team long. In talking with his father, he said that his son couldn't believe how much time and work was required of Highlands football players (way more than what he had previously experienced at his former school which was not a bad program by the way) and his son simply did not want to invest that much time and work in football. Hence, he hung it up. But Highlands kids, growing up with all the talk of state championships surrounding them, are willing to do all that the coaches demand, and hence the Highlands coaches can demand more and practice harder and longer. That culture also attracts and keeps kids that at some programs might not even come out for football. There are a couple of very good players that I can think of, but will not name, that in my opinion would not even play football if they attended another school. But playing football at Highlands means so much, that they elect to play, to do what is required to be a Highlands football player and are not just "walking the halls" as they say.

 

I've spoken with several head coaches in N. Ky who have told me that they don't practice near as much or near as hard as Highlands does; that they wish they could; but if they did, they might not be able to field a team; and hence they do not. So obviously, unless those coaches are lieing to me, not all programs practice as much, have as tough of an off season conditioning program, etc. And the culture that you give credit to Highlands for having, is a large reason why that exists.

 

I know that such is something that fans/parents/supporters of other programs do not want to hear, and I fully understand why. But in my opinion it is true.

 

And as for the D-1 players issues, we've had more than a lot of other schools no doubt, but in comparison to the number of state championships, less than one would expect. In our current senior class, which just lead us to a state championship, as of this point there are zero kids with D-1 offers. Some may pick them up yet or walk on, but as of now, there are zero D-1 offers, so its not like we fielded a team full of super athletes this year. If anything, year in and year out, Highlands is a team comprised of smaller than expected players that are superbly conditioned, superbly coached and extremely disciplined across the board. We rarely have the better athletes, yet because we have no weak link in the chain we beat the teams that have the better athletes. That is a direct result, in my opinion, of all the time and work put into practice and conditioning that programs like Highlands require. Heck, my senior year, a championship season, we only had two kids even play college football and those were both at the D-III level, so we certainly didn't win state with a bunch of superior athletes, yet we beat teams that did send kids to college on D-I scholarships.

 

And stating that we believe the Highlands kids and coaches work harder than at other programs is not being disrespectful to programs like South Oldham and the kids and coaches at those schools. Not at all. Highlands is blessed to have the tradition and culture that compels the kids and coaches to do what it takes to win state on a consistent basis. That culture is one of the reasons why even when Highlands has a "down" year, they are still very good and why Highlands avoids the deep cycles that a lot of other schools suffer.

 

As for how successful Mueller would be at another school, no one can know for sure, but I will tell you that if past history is any guide to the future, you may be interested in knowing that before Dale came to Highlands, he took over a very poor football program in Ohio (Withrow) and in a short time had them going undefeated in their regular season. The man knows how to coach and to motivate players how to work hard, so I wouldn't bet against him being very successful at another Ky high school.

[johnscreek]

It's not always about how often or how long teams workout... You've also got to consider what they're doing during that time. The intensity of the workouts and the type of conditioning being done is what separates these teams from the rest...

 

Give me a break!

[johnscreek]

Last two seasons 29-1. Back-back 5A State Champs. Its all luck:lol::lol:

 

They should have worked a little harder and then they would have been 30-0

[jbwill2]

They should have worked a little harder and then they would have been 30-0

Are you serious? Is this real???

[Ram]

Are you serious? Is this real???

Yes, Virgina, there is a Santa Claus, and yes johnscreek is calling Highlands out.:popcorn:

[Henry521]

Give me a break!

 

:lol:That's the problem, too many breaks.:jump:

[FootballisKing]

I will not comment to South Oldham as not to offend anyone. I will comment to the climate. Places like that want to compete with these schools probably have more kids playing mutiple sports. If a coach turns his back on a kid because he is not at this sports conditioning so that he can be at the one coming up, then they lose that kid and not get him back. Most schools cannot afford to lose kids. The elite programs in the state CAN tell a kid that they do not need him. X, T, Highlands and such have enough dedicated athletes that want to continue that tradition that they can reload. Have a starting DB get hurt at one of these schools and you may never see him again. His replacement took over and is just as good. There are a lot of BIG kids walking the halls in a lot of schools, not playing football because their coach ran them off. The problem is that most do not have another BIG kid to replace him.

 

I saw all three schools in the county play this year. You said SO best player couldn't play for these other schools? I would say that all three schools had a couple of skill positon kids that would be well known and would have scholarships if they played for some of the elite teams.

 

Most schools want to beat the elites, they want to be like the elites. Yet they cannot afford to... they can't afford to lose the kids.

 

Kids have to buy into your system, your program and your vision. If you cannot sell those things to your kids, then a team will be marred in mediocrity.

 

I know that in the smaller communities, the football tradition brings people to the games, encourages kids to prepare to be a "insert your Team Mascot", and it is all people talk about. Around Louisville, no one really cares. Go to a game, not a big game just a regular game. Go to Oldham county vs J-Town. Maybe 500 people. Most people there are Football parents, Cheer Parents, Dance Parents, and Band Parents. Where are the teachers, administrators, and members of the community?

 

Go to a highlands, t or x game. All of the above are there, along with students, and community folks and even larger still......ALUMNI.

 

Culture, none of the elite teams would be elite if their administration did not help encourage them to become elite. You must have that support, and that expectation to become elite from the top down. Most folks talk the talk, but there is not any walkin.

 

It is a climate, that is inspired by Coaches, Tradition, Administration, Parents, and Success.

 

Nothing more...Nothing Less.

 

Hope I did not say anything wrong, just would love to see more teams in the championships. Tired of rewinding.

[tdyballgame]

Hope I did not say anything wrong, just would love to see more teams in the championships. Tired of rewinding.

 

You have. Remember two years ago, Ky. went to 6 classes. But I get what you are saying. In all reality, there are only about 10 teams throughout the state that have a chance of winning state.

[Commander 25]

You have. Remember two years ago, Ky. went to 6 classes. But I get what you are saying. In all reality, there are only about 10 teams throughout the state that have a chance of winning state.

 

Since they have went to the 6 classes the only team that has won a state title that didn't win one it the old 4 was Central and now they have won it back to back all of the other teams have won at least one state title in the old 4 class system.

[ft bronc]

I have met with coaches from Trinity and Highlands. The difference is clear. The committment to excellence they demand on every rep, every day is unparralleled.

 

To sum it up they worry about getting the most out of the fundamentals of football and don't worry about x' and o's as much.

 

The proficiency of football fundamentals at Highlands, and how that leads to a level of execution that I believe is unsurpassed in this state, and maybe any other state, just simply cannot be overemphasized in discussions such as this. We can debate about how they and a few other schools achieve this level of execution, but the bottom line is they do, and if you do not, and your athletes are not better by a significant margin, you're going to loose.

 

I’ll give just one example. I watched about 12 Highlands games this year. In those games, their QB was in the spread shotgun formation for all but maybe 2 or 3 plays. Off the top of my head, I don’t know how many total plays Highlands offense ran in those 12 games, but I do know this: I saw exactly ONE bad snap, and ONE late snap by their starting offense. Their center’s rate of proper execution must have been something like 99.999999%. You’d be hard pressed to find a college, or even NFL center that executes with that level of efficiency. And what is that worth? Apparently a state championship.