6 is too many...a FIVE class system solves the problem

[stickymitts]

Then they would have been on the list then in one class or another -- either the BIGGEST school in 2A or the SMALLEST school in 3A.

 

I didn't use "arbitrary enrollments" as divisions. I split it by the number of schools left after parsing out the 16 1A and 5A teams.

 

So there are some natural "gaps" that occur between the largest school in one class and the smallest school in the next one up.

 

If, on the next enrollment calculation, a school has 642 students, where they would fall would depend on the NUMBER of schools in the class above and below them.

 

I figured. I was just giving you a hard time.

[CoachJ]

I'm not diagreeing with you. I know it has Catholic with 600 kids, that was true 2yrs. ago, but things and tuition has gone up. Enrollment is down.

 

Well-noted.

 

This is just a draft for now to give people an idea. I would definitely want to use the most recent numbers taken to determine the actual set-up if this were to be something that passes.

 

Until then though, had to use something. And the KHSAA site was the only place I could find any type of enrollment figures (would MUCH rather have used "Male-Only" enrollment for each school!).

 

I'm sure there are several other schools who's enrollments have changed dramatically since the KHSAA published the list I used...the top and bottom numbers here could serve as a sort of "guideline" as to where your favorite school would be then if this plan were to be adopted.

[Watusi]

He has them in 3A. My guess is that he's using #'s from the last split of the classes. They would always be changing.

 

My bad, I didn't see them. Thanks, sticky.

[stickymitts]

My bad, I didn't see them. Thanks, sticky.

:thumb:

 

Some CEO you are. Nice try, BTW. :lol:

[LSURock]

I suggested something similar on another thread. What would be the 16th school in 5A? I really think they should require a minimum number of students to be in 5A, maybe 1,600 or 1,700. If that means there aren't 32 teams in 5A so be it.

[Watusi]

This is interesting to say the least and on the surface looks equitable.

 

Have you given any thought to district structure? How would you handle that in the 1A and 5A divisions? With only 16 teams in each class spread out statewide, it would almost make sense to do away with traditional districts in those classes and then seed them for playoff pairings.

 

Also, I assume this would encourage more small schools to field a team and that would push the larger of the 16 small schools into 2A. Would that hurt the plan?

 

Thoughts?

 

If you wanted to go to 5 classes and still eliminate the problem of having some schools playing against schools more than double their size, would it make just as much sense to set enrollment limits for each class instead of splitting them in thirds? For instance what if you went with ...

 

1A 001-300

2A 301-700

3A 701-1100

4A 1101-1500

5A 1500+

 

How would that shake down?

[02Ram54]

So, for 5A, you'd have to have 4 districts: 1 West of Louisville, 2 Louisville districts, and 1 East of Louisville.

 

But it wouldn't work. There'd be 3 schools west of Louisville, and one of those is ALOT closer to Louisville than it is to Henderson Co. You'd have 8 for the 2 Louisville districts, and then 5 in the East/Lexington district. It's imbalanced geographically.

[WoodyJr]

Im not in favor of the public/private split but,

 

one of the arguments is an all boys school of 500 is basically equivalent to 1000 students for anyone else - No?

 

Thats why in my post on the other thread I brought up the idea of assigning a point value to things like same sex, open boundaries, free tuition, # ot transfers per year(or something similar to catch the publics getting advantages), and other issues to take into account. As a school accumulates a cetain # of points they would be bumped up a class - whether its 5 or 6. (I didnt take time to do calculaions)

 

Just an idea to keep everyone together :thumb:

 

Cheers, Woody Jr

[Booge]

(Hail) Pikeville

 

:jump:

[02Ram54]

1200 and up would be about the 36 largest schools in the state.

[Booge]

Paintsville would love this scenario as they would win Class A 9 out of every 10 years.

Seriously, I like this idea though.

[CoachJ]

Good questions, Watusi. I'll do my best (remember, I just took an idea from a couple of things I saw today from other people smarter than me -- TrinityAlum and LSU -- and just crunched some numbers to see how it would look), so it's still a work in progress in my brain.

 

This is interesting to say the least and on the surface looks equitable.

No division could ever be completely "equitable." But my goal is to figure out some way to take out the GROSS INEQUITIES that exist -- I think with the CURRENT way of doing things, those inequities are BUILT-IN...and when you look at the HISTORY of what virtually ALL the teams in 1A and 4A that have made the finals have in common, I think it becomes obvious.

 

Have you given any thought to district structure?

Nope. It took a lot of cutting and pasting just to get the schools from the KHSAA site (Adobe) to this one.

 

However, just off the top of my head, I would think there would be MORE geographical flexibility within the 2A, 3A, and 4A classes because they have MORE teams in them.

 

How would you handle that in the 1A and 5A divisions?

In 1A and 5A, limiting those to only 16 teams would allow them to basically not HAVE to play in a district -- all of them would make their playoffs. They would have the flexibility to play whomever they want in the regular season.

 

And to answer someone else's concern about there only being 3 western teams in 5A, since they'd not be REQUIRED to play each other in the regular season, this would limit that travel down significantly -- I would venture to say putting North Hardin and one of the western Louisville schools (PRP?) in with Henderson, Daviess for the first round of their playoffs would actually be not that much different than what they have to do now travelling to Marshall County and Graves County.

 

And remember, overall travel would be dimished for these schools (and the ones in 1A) since they have a "bye" in their 1st round -- very often a BIG trip for the #4 and #3 seeds, AND they have more regular season flexibility in whom they schedule due to the lack of "required" district competition.

 

With only 16 teams in each class spread out statewide, it would almost make sense to do away with traditional districts in those classes and then seed them for playoff pairings.

Exactly. Though I'm not a fan of seeding through the "computerization" of sports, it may be good. I could see more of a traditional "geographic" seeding of the first rounds for these two divisions (that would help on travel costs as well).

 

 

Also, I assume this would encourage more small schools to field a team and that would push the larger of the 16 small schools into 2A. Would that hurt the plan?

Could... in the future. But that's a POSITIVE to me! The more kids in this state exposed to the most DEMANDING sport there is (and thus, the one with the most LIFE-LESSONS), the better.

 

I never thought of that eventuality originally, but now that you've brought it up, I think it actually is a BENEFIT of doing such a thing at the 1A level!

 

If you wanted to go to 5 classes and still eliminate the problem of having some schools playing against schools more than double their size, would it make just as much sense to set enrollment limits for each class instead of splitting them in thirds? For instance what if you went with ...

 

1A 001-300

2A 301-700

3A 701-1100

4A 1101-1500

5A 1500+

 

How would that shake down?

I think that would be actually, the BEST way...and that's how they used to do it...but some complained that it was too arbitrary in the past ("who determines that '700' is the "right" cutoff for 2A/3A?"). So they went to the "Even out the numbers in the classes" (as if THAT wasn't even MORE arbitrary!!! ).

 

I like your type of thinking on it...I think there is EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that proves at CERTAIN school sizes, there are natural breaks in competitiveness (like the fact that I believe only TWO schools under 1600 enrollment in HISTORY have even MADE IT TO the state FINALS -- let alone WIN it all).

[Watusi]

For the record, CoachJ, I wasn't trying to pick at your idea. Actually the opposite, I liked the idea and I was kicking it around in my head and brainstorming about the possibilities. Some of what I typed I'm sure could be easily dismissed, and some may be worth looking at. Either way, I think the idea of looking at new solutions to a problem can only bring positive results, even if it just makes more people think about it.

[RNCSportsaholic]

Paintsville would love this scenario as they would win Class A 9 out of every 10 years.

Seriously, I like this idea though.

 

Although I would love to see Pikeville stay as well. Then our little rivalry would step up about 10 fold!

[Sandman32]

Ok, this makes sense, but who's gonna tell the rest of the super 16 about it?