Baker critics don't let facts get in the way...

[letabrotherspeak]

1. How do you know Dunn is a bad clubhouse guy? From what I hear is not at all.

 

2. How do you know they haven't tried shopping Griffey for years and found no takers? From what I hear they have.

Never said he was a bad clubhouse guy. Heck he could be everyone's best friend. However, I think it is very clear he is not a leader. Dusty said in his presser he was going to sit and observe and hen pluck his leaders. If he chooses Dunn or Griff, the culture in the clubhouse will not change.

They have shopped him a few times, heck they had him traded for Phil Nevin once. With him being so close to 600 and in last year of a contract, many would just assume have him here and break the record. If they are definitely shopping him, it make their decision not to promote Jay Bruce that much more ignorant. What did the Ellison character do that Bruce couldn't do over the last month?

Many wondered why Dusty wouldnt bring up Ryan Theriot when he was there and play him over impotent Nefi Perez..

[Under the Lights]

Gametime, you're taking your usual superficial view on things. Wins and losses don't always tell the whole story.

 

Again, those of us that have watched Baker closely know better.

 

If Krivsky establishes some guidelines and makes Baker follow them, maybe things can work out. Dusty, left to run things as he sees fit, will do more damage then foster success in the long term.

 

Simply put, with the Reds, there is no long term. The same is true for most "small market" teams. They usually have a brief run of success followed by a rapid decline and fire sale. Marlins (twice), Dbacks, Colorado?

 

I think that "building for the future" is out the window at this point. Fans are turned off from the lack of a competitive team on the field. No fans in the seats = no team on the field in the long run.

 

So in this case, yes, wins and losses do tell the whole story. They hired someone that has a track record of coming in and winning right away. Right now that is what this franchise needs. How many years were the Reds "building for the future"? Exactly when is the future? Is it some indefinite point that is definately not today? At some point you have to take your shot.........

[malachicrunch]

Simply put, with the Reds, there is no long term. The same is true for most "small market" teams. They usually have a brief run of success followed by a rapid decline and fire sale. Marlins (twice), Dbacks, Colorado?

 

I think that "building for the future" is out the window at this point. Fans are turned off from the lack of a competitive team on the field. No fans in the seats = no team on the field in the long run.

 

So in this case, yes, wins and losses do tell the whole story. They hired someone that has a track record of coming in and winning right away. Right now that is what this franchise needs. How many years were the Reds "building for the future"? Exactly when is the future? Is it some indefinite point that is definately not today? At some point you have to take your shot.........

 

Brief run of success?? I guess 80-82 is a qualifier for the Reds.

Thats as close as they have come in a while:cry:

[Under the Lights]

Brief run of success?? I guess 80-82 is a qualifier for the Reds.

Thats as close as they have come in a while:cry:

 

My point exactly. The Reds HAVEN'T had that run of success, the comment was directed towards statements that Baker would "do more damage than help in the long term". Most small market teams are not competitive year in and year out, they have 1 or 2 up years, sell the farm, and start from scratch.

 

This is exactly why they needed to make a hire of a Baker, etc. instead of another Narron, Miley, Mackanin. Personally, I'm tired of the same old song and dance, the "building for the future" mantra. The future has to come sometime..... Hey, Baker may very well come up in here and blow things up entirely. But it will still be better than the slow, painful death we've been dying over the last decade...........

[malachicrunch]

My point exactly. The Reds HAVEN'T had that run of success, the comment was directed towards statements that Baker would "do more damage than help in the long term". Most small market teams are not competitive year in and year out, they have 1 or 2 up years, sell the farm, and start from scratch.

 

This is exactly why they needed to make a hire of a Baker, etc. instead of another Narron, Miley, Mackanin. Personally, I'm tired of the same old song and dance, the "building for the future" mantra. The future has to come sometime..... Hey, Baker may very well come up in here and blow things up entirely. But it will still be better than the slow, painful death we've been dying over the last decade...........

 

You're going to have a lot of posters disagree with you on this.

I am not one of them.:thumb:

[westsider]

Lots of small market teams can remain competitive in the long term ... it takes good personnel decisions, good cost-effective management and a little luck. Three of the last four teams standing were in the lower third of payroll at the start of the season. Cleveland (in the 90s) and Oakland (until this season) are prime examples of franchises that managed to stay consistently competitive for several years without huge payrolls.

 

Baker inherited a team in Chicago with four good young starting pitchers ... a lot of guys would have won in that situation, and some of them would have sustained it longer. I don't know that he's going to be able to work with that kind of talent base in Cincinnati.

[The Scribe]

Baker has one fan in Chicago. Not sure I agree with everything he said (especially the Murton reference).

 

LINK

[2sports]

OK Reds Fans is this really about Dusty Baker or is it about the ineptness of the Reds front office over the past several years ? If they won't spend the money, unload the baggage and allow the manager input into the roster what do you expect ?? Until the Reds unload Griffey JR. teach Dunn how not to strike out and give the manager the ability to effect the roster they can't win. Baker's not my favorite and I'm not a Reds fan but unfortunately he will improve the team because his ego says if he doesn't get the power he will move on.

[saint4]

It is up to their bull pen, not the manager. They would have won 90 games this year if it was not for their bull pen. And Narron would still be the manager. Different story totally if they had had a good bull pen.

[oldrambler]

Pass me a toothpick and lets rock...

 

:lol::lol::lol:

[oldrambler]

Wayne changes his story a lot :lol:

 

Just a thought and question.... Judging fro one very memorable appeearance Wayne had:scared: with the T.V. crew on one Reds game ....Is Wayne ever sober enough to make a decision? :eek: