Taxes

[Michael Corleone]

The White House and their hit men (Harry Reid) seem to want to focus on Mitt Romney's taxes or lack there of. I have asked this question in other thread but never get a response. I would like someone to please tell me one person who has voluntarily paid more taxes than required by law. Please feel free to list all you know.

[75center]

Chirp Chirp.

[Run To State]

Chirp Chirp.

The silence is deafening. :lol:

[Habib]

The government isn't a charity so it would be futile for someone to donate their money to the government without the rest of the country doing so as well. This is the point of having a tax policy that applies to everyone; it limits the number of "free riders." The same would apply to any other law if made voluntary. The biggest losers in that system would be those who did it. Could you imagine if speed limits were only unenforceable recommendations? No one would drive 35, just as no one makes charitable contributes to the treasury. Again, it's policy for a reason.

[2 Humped Camel]

I think everyone knows that the pressure from Democrats on Mr. Romney to release his tax returns isn't to catch him violating some tax law. They want them out there as black and white evidence to show what anyone with a brain already knows. Mitt Romney is rich and executes all of the loop holes and tax havens that very wealthy people like to use rich. I think specifically they would illustrate that in 08-09 he probably paid zero taxes due to write offs from loses while the middle class absorbed losses in their 401k's and other investments but still paided their usual rate. There is nothing legally wrong with doing what he does but it will simply highlight the differences in the system as to how the ultra wealthy avoid paying anywhere near the rate of their income brackets. Mr. Romney obviously doesn't want this "proof" out there in this election that may serve as an indictment on the current tax system, bush tax cuts and tax proposals from the republican ticket.

[woodsrider]

I think everyone knows that the pressure from Democrats on Mr. Romney to release his tax returns isn't to catch him violating some tax law. They want them out there as black and white evidence to show what anyone with a brain already knows. Mitt Romney is rich and executes all of the loop holes and tax havens that very wealthy people like to use rich. I think specifically they would illustrate that in 08-09 he probably paid zero taxes due to write offs from loses while the middle class absorbed losses in their 401k's and other investments but still paided their usual rate. There is nothing legally wrong with doing what he does but it will simply highlight the differences in the system as to how the ultra wealthy avoid paying anywhere near the rate of their income brackets. Mr. Romney obviously doesn't want this "proof" out there in this election that may serve as an indictment on the current tax system, bush tax cuts and tax proposals from the republican ticket.

Every single person in this country takes advantage of the loop holes, not just the rich. If you qualify for the EIC and take it isn't taking advantage of loop holes? What about someone in the middle class that claims the child credit? Isn't that taking advantage of the loop holes? Your example of Romney not paying tax in 08-09 because of losses when the middle class absorbed losses in thier 401K's doesn't seem to be an apples to apples comparison. Romney could only claim actual losses. Just like anyone in the middle class could claim actual losses. My 401K went down 25% or something like that, however I didn't cash it out so it really wasn't a loss.

 

There is no different in the system as to how ultra wealthy avoid paying tax. There are loop holes and ways to lessen your liability at all levels. In 2011 my wife and I were in the 25% tax bracket. We paid an effective rate of exactly 5%. Thank god for loopholes.

[2 Humped Camel]

Every single person in this country takes advantage of the loop holes, not just the rich. If you qualify for the EIC and take it isn't taking advantage of loop holes? What about someone in the middle class that claims the child credit? Isn't that taking advantage of the loop holes? Your example of Romney not paying tax in 08-09 because of losses when the middle class absorbed losses in thier 401K's doesn't seem to be an apples to apples comparison. Romney could only claim actual losses. Just like anyone in the middle class could claim actual losses. My 401K went down 25% or something like that, however I didn't cash it out so it really wasn't a loss.

 

There is no different in the system as to how ultra wealthy avoid paying tax. There are loop holes and ways to lessen your liability at all levels. In 2011 my wife and I were in the 25% tax bracket. We paid an effective rate of exactly 5%. Thank god for loopholes.

 

How many people in this country can structure their salary so that if comes in the form of stocks and dividends so that they only have to pay capital gains tax which puts them at the same tax rate as someone making less than $35k a year? Very fair, especially when they can claim a loss in other areas and pay 0%.

[Clyde]

If you want to find out where this is heading I would suggest you find articles on the tax strategy known as "equity swap."

[2 Humped Camel]

If you want to find out where this is heading I would suggest you find articles on the tax strategy known as "equity swap."

 

I wiki'd that and I had never heard of it before but while I'm sure is effective, it doesn't sound like something Bob working 3rd shift at UPS is likely to take advantage of.

[Clyde]

I wiki'd that and I had never heard of it before but while I'm sure is effective, it doesn't sound like something Bob working 3rd shift at UPS is likely to take advantage of.

 

If it's legal (which sounds like that's being debated now by the IRS) I'd do it too if I had that kind of money.

 

This type of investment and tax strategy is exactly what the campaign does not want others to see despite it being legal. It has nothing to do with tax rate paid.

[rockmom]

What is the effect of deferred compensation packages? For instance, millions can be deferred tax free in that manner, while ordinary individuals can only defer a maximum of $22k, if meeting certain conditions.

[woodsrider]

How many people in this country can structure their salary so that if comes in the form of stocks and dividends so that they only have to pay capital gains tax which puts them at the same tax rate as someone making less than $35k a year? Very fair, especially when they can claim a loss in other areas and pay 0%.

Irrelevent to the discussion. The point is there are loopholes at every level. Also no one making $35,000 is paying 15%. While that makes a good sound bite for Buffet it simply isn't true.

[Jim Schue]

Irrelevent to the discussion. The point is there are loopholes at every level. Also no one making $35,000 is paying 15%. While that makes a good sound bite for Buffet it simply isn't true.

 

Perhaps. But the loopholes available to the uber-wealthy are not realistically there for middle-class folks. Not without retaining an expensive phalanx of tax accountants, anyway. People like Romney file tax returns that take up whole shelves. Pretty sure there's more going on in those returns than the basic 1040A I and most everybody else uses.

[woodsrider]

Perhaps. But the loopholes available to the uber-wealthy are not realistically there for middle-class folks. Not without retaining an expensive phalanx of tax accountants, anyway. People like Romney file tax returns that take up whole shelves. Pretty sure there's more going on in those returns than the basic 1040A I and most everybody else uses.

There are plenty of things that are available to the uber-wealthy that aren't realistically there for middle-class. So what? I also agree with the rest which shows how screwed up our entire tax system is. Pick a %, everyone pays it and lets move on. Or implement the fair tax. The fact that the IRS employees over 100,000 people should make everyone sick.

[75center]

Unemployment claims ticked up this week. Gasoline is approaching $4. You can be sure the Democrats will be doing everything they can to keep the focus on distractions like this to play off the class envy rather than have the debate turn to this administration's performance over the past 4 years. It's their only hope to squeaking by this election.