Debunk Creationism Thread

[True blue (and gold)]

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According to the professors who have been stymied, funding is not given to any research that involves creationism. One astronomy scientists was told to remove the part about God creating the heavens and him wanting to search the heavens for such proof out. It was implied that he would receive his funding if that was not part of it.

 

Even a scientific journalists who wrote in a scientific journal, support for creationism was fired.

 

Lots of scientists get fired. This implies that is WHY he/she got fired, which may or may not have been true.

 

As Rockmom mentioned in another thread, if order for something to be scientific, there must be a test for wrongness. However, if people won't accept the data for wrongness, what will it matter? People refused to accept Galileo when he had evidence against the geocentric theory. He was put under house arrest, excommunicated and threatened with death (there's a scientist that was persecuted for you!), but 300 and some odd years later he has now been officially pardoned.

 

If there is no "scientific" study of creationism, are you saying that the creationism museum isn't really a museum? Where are they getting their info then?

 

Disclaimer: I am NOT anti-God. I completely believe that God is responsible for the creation of the universe. I have an image in my mind of the Big Bang Theory (for another topic) that meshes perfectly with my image of the creation of the universe.

 

God is not scientific and doesn't need/shouldn't be. If we had proof of God, then everybody would believe and there would be no need for faith. That would be really easy. I don't need facts to believe in God - I only need faith.

[cch5432]

You can prove historical events, you can not prove whether there is or is not a creator. That is impossible as far as I know.

The only way you can prove historical events is through hearsay, and the way you believe if it is true is if you find credibility in your source.

 

And since our Hearsay believes in God, I believe it. :lol:

[HHSDad]

I do not believe that the universe was created in 168 Earth hours. Remember that a day is however long it takes for a planet to make one revolution. Jupiter and Saturn's day lasts 10 earth hours. Venus' day lasts 243 earth days.

[halfback20]

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According to the professors who have been stymied, funding is not given to any research that involves creationism. One astronomy scientists was told to remove the part about God creating the heavens and him wanting to search the heavens for such proof out. It was implied that he would receive his funding if that was not part of it.

 

Even a scientific journalists who wrote in a scientific journal, support for creationism was fired.

 

You must be kidding. There are how many Christians in this world? If they want funding bad enough, they can get it.

[halfback20]

The only way you can prove historical events is through hearsay, and the way you believe if it is true is if you find credibility in your source.

 

And since our Hearsay believes in God, I believe it. :lol:

 

You are kidding right?

 

There is more ways than one to prove historical events. Artifacts, documents, etc...

[RowdyRedRam]

How long was God's day?

When we can pick and choose which items are metaphor, it makes all interpretation suspect.

[the mathemagician]

I do not understand how the scientific community can block all research into Creationism. It's not like they hold all the tools and are not sharing. It is quite possible for anyone who feels it necessary to do research, to do it on their own.

 

As a matter of fact, I'm sure there are people out researching it right now. This is a free country, not a dictatorship.

 

I, for one, do not need empirical evidence that God is real. I believe in God and I don't care if it is ever proven as a fact.

 

 

:thumb:

 

 

I guess it's another one of those liberal scientist community conspiracies.

[Hearsay]

When we can pick and choose which items are metaphor, it makes all interpretation suspect.

 

The 24 hour-day was not even a concept until hundreds of years after the various parts of Genesis were written. The word we translate as "day," and certain punctuation used at that time, have much more "non-metaphor" bearing on the concept of time then what we use now. Which is why I also believe the age in "years" for Methusaleh has a rational basis that is not tied to the Gregorian calendar.

[ladiesbballcoach]

I do not believe that the universe was created in 168 Earth hours. Remember that a day is however long it takes for a planet to make one revolution. Jupiter and Saturn's day lasts 10 earth hours. Venus' day lasts 243 earth days.

 

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

2 Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

 

3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

 

6 And God said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

 

9 And God said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw that it was good.

 

11 Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

 

14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

 

20 And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

 

24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

 

26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

 

27 So God created man in his own image,

in the image of God he created him;

male and female he created them.

 

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

 

29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

 

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.

 

 

 

Who says the Earth rotated around the sun at the beginning as it does now and revolved as it does now? There wasn't a sky till the 2nd day.

[ladiesbballcoach]

When we can pick and choose which items are metaphor, it makes all interpretation suspect.

 

Disagree in some instances. Jesus said he was a door. Can we agree that this is metaphorical and Jesus did not become a door with hinges?

[Hatz]

The 24 hour-day was not even a concept until hundreds of years after the various parts of Genesis were written. The word we translate as "day," and certain punctuation used at that time, have much more "non-metaphor" bearing on the concept of time then what we use now. Which is why I also believe the age in "years" for Methusaleh has a rational basis that is not tied to the Gregorian calendar.

 

The concept of day to the Genesis writers was of day and then night. 24 hours was not how they marked time but it was the concept. That concept would have to be measuered in the instruments we now have which would mean a 24 hour day.

[ladiesbballcoach]

The concept of day to the Genesis writers was of day and then night. 24 hours was not how they marked time but it was the concept. That concept would have to be measuered in the instruments we now have which would mean a 24 hour day.

 

And yet that might be how the Genesis writers conceptualized it but that does not mean the first day was a literal 24 hours.

 

In fact, the sun and moon was not created til the 4th day. And while I know the Earth going around the Sun is for a year, it still indicates that there was something different going on those first 3 days than what we presently know.

[GO CATS]

Why not teach both as possibillities, it's the only logical way to teach these subjects. After all no one really knows the truth, although many on this site will say the do know the truth.

[cch5432]

Why not teach both as possibillities, it's the only logical way to teach these subjects. After all no one really knows the truth, although many on this site will say the do know the truth.

I know I will get criticized for bringing up his name, but I want to draw the parallels between the two situations. This quote sounds similar to a quote by Al Gore:

When Mr. Stephanopoulos confronted Mr. Gore with the fact that the best estimates of rising sea levels are far less dire than he suggests in his movie, Mr. Gore defended his claims by noting that scientists "don't have any models that give them a high level of confidence" one way or the other and went on to claim--in his defense--that scientists "don't know. . . . They just don't know."

 

This is after Gore claimed there was a "consensus" with all scientists- and also disregard any evidence not supporting global warming. Just as evolution supporters claim that there is a "consensus", and it is difficult to get funds to support creationism.

 

Another contrast between the two situations- both global warming detractors and creationism supporters are NOT against continued research on the topics, whereas global warming supporters want immediate action, and evolution supporters want no mention or reference of creationism.

[GO CATS]

You can still teach both as possibillities.