Poverty in Eastern Kentucky

[strike-3]

Nobody is pretending it isn't there. People are acting like there aren't people existing in appallingly primitive conditions in other parts of the state.

 

There is poverty everywhere, but just take a look at the map in the link posted by Rockmom. The disparity is very evident.

[spindoc]

So therefore, is farming as a whole important to the E. KY economy?

Well, since tobacco has been widely known as the cash crop of the region, I'll say this. I recently bought a farm in EK and it had X amount of tobacco base on it. My neighbors had the same, both of which had been reduced due to the fact that the govt. paid them "not" to farm it, and tobacco subsidies made it silly to go through the work of it all. ( If you have to google tobacco base then you really have no idea about farming in EKY) So, farmers who relied on the sale of their tobacco in towns like Maysville at the end of the summer had to do something else to make ends meet. Same could be said for dairies, bean farmers and the like. So, I'll say that farming has become less important to the economy of EKY.

[strike-3]

Well, since tobacco has been widely known as the cash crop of the region, I'll say this. I recently bought a farm in EK and it had X amount of tobacco base on it. My neighbors had the same, both of which had been reduced due to the fact that the govt. paid them "not" to farm it, and tobacco subsidies made it silly to go through the work of it all. ( If you have to google tobacco base then you really have no idea about farming in EKY) So, farmers who relied on the sale of their tobacco in towns like Maysville at the end of the summer had to do something else to make ends meet. Same could be said for dairies, bean farmers and the like. So, I'll say that farming has become less important to the economy of EKY.

 

I'm familiar with the tabacco woes, it is / was big business in parts of W. KY as well. I was refering more to the farming in which the Vick brothers might be interested.

[Booge]

I didn't say you were arrogant, I said you were ignorant (of the facts.) Big difference. You think E. Ky. depends on farming, and you still think you are qualified to discuss the economy or anything else pertaining to the area, or even be taken seriously??? Too funny! :sssh:

 

Just to be clear, of course I didn't mean I thought you were an ignorant person cshs...I just think you have bought into the negative stereotypes without knowing the facts...and no I don't mean there aren't poor people in Eastern Ky...

I'm done here, I knew this thread was a bad idea... :thumb:

[Birdsfan]

:lol: :jump:

You're unable to understand that? :eek:

 

I think you need to do some research. :thumb:

[Hasbeen]

Just to be clear, of course I didn't mean I thought you were an ignorant person cshs...I just think you have bought into the negative stereotypes without knowing the facts...and no I don't mean there aren't poor people in Eastern Ky...

I'm done here, I knew this thread was a bad idea... :thumb:

 

I'm the one who called him arrogant.

[The Professor]

I've decided to make a separate thread to avoid getting too far off topic in the one concerning Edward's "poverty tour".

 

Eastern Kentucky is a beautiful place. Wonderful scenery, fascinating history, blessed with an abundance of natural resources including coal, timber, natural gas and oil, most of which is still here. How can an area with so many opportunities be considered one of the poorest places in all of the United States? I have a theory and I would like to tell a little story to illustrate.

 

I have an acquaintance who owns a large piece of property, near two hundred acres. This property has timber, gas, and coal. A while back he was approached by an out of state gas company about exploring and drilling for natural gas on the property. The gas company researched the deed and discovered that the property owner did not own the mineral rights to a large tract of his land, more than half. This came as a complete surprise to my friend as there was no mention of it on his deed. However there is a handwritten agreement on file at the courthouse dated to 1902 where a previous owner had sold the mineral rights for two dollars per acre. This amounted to selling probably hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of coal and natural gas for the tidy sum of $200.00. Now, over a hundred years later, the fleecing of a poor, uneducated widow (I'm assuming uneducated, the widow part actually appears on the agreement) is still valid and will make a tidy sum of money for an out of state corporation while the residents of the area continue to struggle.

 

The above is repeated over and over in this area and illustrates my theory on

why this region is so poor. If a politician wants to alleviate poverty, he should begin with voiding all these rediculous documents.

 

Here's where I get controversial. Why is this area so poor? Because our ancestors were at best gullible or at worst just outright stupid. Our politicians are supported by the big oil and coal companies and are not going to bite the hand that feeds them. Face it, fellow East Kentuckians, in spite of our colorful history of long rifle hunters and Indian fighters, we are decended from people who arrived in this country when England decided to empty the slums and deptor's prisons and send them to the New World to work as servants on the plantations of North Carolina.

 

Opinions?

 

I'm not sure, and maybe Heresay or some of the other lawyers on here can explain further, but I believe the state of Kentucky ruled these turn-of-the-century Broad Form Deeds invalid a few years ago. I don't think they will hold up in court anymore.

[Hasbeen]

I'm not sure, and maybe Heresay or some of the other lawyers on here can explain further, but I believe the state of Kentucky ruled these turn-of-the-century Broad Form Deeds invalid a few years ago. I don't think they will hold up in court anymore.

 

I actually started this thread hoping to get some imput from some of our lawyer friends.

 

I just read the part of cshs81's post that he edited asking if we had a solution. I have and was going to state the problem, get some responses, and then start working toward a resolution but I got sidetracked when told basically to quit whining about being "jobbed" and just suck it up and improve myself. I did indeed take that as arrogance and an insult to both my community and myself from an outsider who has no idea about our backgrounds, education, or current status. I made my first post in this thread not to make excuses but to explore what brought us to where we are so that we might examine ways to right the ship. It is extremely difficult to fix a problem treating only the symptoms and not the actual disease.

 

I'm out of time now but I will post my ideas to "fix" this area of the state soon.

[Booge]

I actually started this thread hoping to get some imput from some of our lawyer friends.

 

I just read the part of cshs81's post that he edited asking if we had a solution. I have and was going to state the problem, get some responses, and then start working toward a resolution but I got sidetracked when told basically to quit whining about being "jobbed" and just suck it up and improve myself. I did indeed take that as arrogance and an insult to both my community and myself from an outsider who has no idea about our backgrounds, education, or current status. I made my first post in this thread not to make excuses but to explore what brought us to where we are so that we might examine ways to right the ship. It is extremely difficult to fix a problem treating only the symptoms and not the actual disease.

 

I'm out of time now but I will post my ideas to "fix" this area of the state soon.

 

Excellent post. Looking forward to hearing more.

[cshs81]

Just to be clear, of course I didn't mean I thought you were an ignorant person cshs...I just think you have bought into the negative stereotypes without knowing the facts...and no I don't mean there aren't poor people in Eastern Ky...

I'm done here, I knew this thread was a bad idea... :thumb:

 

I don't bring ignorant stereotypes.

 

I'll ask anyone , since Billybob is no longer participating, which of the following perceptions are untrue of the EKY region AS A WHOLE?

 

Poor

Not many jobs

Lower priority on education than other areas (as a whole - not individually)

Generations after generations of poverty

Waiting for someone to figure out how to fix the problem

Beautiful area of the state

 

The "AS A WHOLE" is key since there are obvious exceptions to all of the above.

[cshs81]

I'm the one who called him arrogant.

 

What was that claim based on again?

[Booge]

What was that claim based on again?

 

Your posts.

[Birdsfan]

I don't bring ignorant stereotypes.

 

I'll ask anyone , since Billybob is no longer participating, which of the following perceptions are untrue of the EKY region AS A WHOLE?

 

Poor

Not many jobs

Lower priority on education than other areas (as a whole - not individually)

Generations after generations of poverty

Waiting for someone to figure out how to fix the problem

Beautiful area of the state

 

The "AS A WHOLE" is key since there are obvious exceptions to all of the above.

All but one of these are true, and not just "ignorant stereotypes" as some would like to believe. The one I can't agree with is the idea that education is a lower priority. That may be true in some families, and that is a generational thing that is passed on from one to the next. But I believe there are people in EKY trying to improve education, through the schools and other programs. Interest in education is really more a matter of individual choice than geography. Your other points however, are rock-solid facts.

[STRIKE3]

I don't bring ignorant stereotypes.

 

I'll ask anyone , since Billybob is no longer participating, which of the following perceptions are untrue of the EKY region AS A WHOLE?

 

Poor

Not many jobs

Lower priority on education than other areas (as a whole - not individually)

Generations after generations of poverty

Waiting for someone to figure out how to fix the problem

Beautiful area of the state

 

The "AS A WHOLE" is key since there are obvious exceptions to all of the above.

Poor - there is many who live below the poverty line and many others, who are above. I'm assuming the cost of living, is different in many metropolitan areas, since a wide variety of jobs exist.

 

Not Many Jobs - There are many, related coal, schools, some industry, convenient/fast food, but not many large employers with the exception of some large towns.

 

Education - Often secondary education, is not affordable to many and/or, the resources to obtain loans, grants and other resources, is not readily known, how to obtain by many.

 

Poverty - Without question, some families and areas, are born into poverty, as that is standard of living. Many times large families, will need/rely on welfare and assistance, without a means or knowledge, how to break free.

 

Waiting - This is very accurate, as many and I mean many, don't have the means to pursue different methods of financial stability. Others, are content to have assistance and most, are hard working for hourly/salary positions.

 

Beauty - Without question. The color of fall, spring, shade of summer heat, trails and scenic by-ways. I've been to many places in the US and none, seem as friendly as EKY.

[cshs81]

I actually started this thread hoping to get some imput from some of our lawyer friends.

 

I just read the part of cshs81's post that he edited asking if we had a solution. I have and was going to state the problem, get some responses, and then start working toward a resolution but I got sidetracked when told basically to quit whining about being "jobbed" and just suck it up and improve myself. I did indeed take that as arrogance and an insult to both my community and myself from an outsider who has no idea about our backgrounds, education, or current status. I made my first post in this thread not to make excuses but to explore what brought us to where we are so that we might examine ways to right the ship. It is extremely difficult to fix a problem treating only the symptoms and not the actual disease.

 

I'm out of time now but I will post my ideas to "fix" this area of the state soon.

 

If you took anything I said as an insult (other than the part about today's problems being related to the ancestors getting jobbed) as an insult, you were seeking one.

 

YOU said that there is not much value in getting a college degree when there are no jobs to come back to. I said that education improvement can only help the region.

 

Suck it up? Is that what you read when I said that education can be a catalyst? Is that what you read when I said that you (collectively) can't spend time blaming something that happened a century ago?

 

How is deciding collectively that education improvements (in high school and beyond) not treating the problem and only treating the symptoms?

 

I must say that you and Billy throw around a lot of insults when there were none there.

 

One of us 3 actually was called ignorant yet didn't fly off the handle while the other 2 read way too much into comments. I'll let you decide where you fall.

 

If you're going to start a discussion on EKY poverty, a)don't start it with some excuse from 100 years ago and b)don't get insulted when the region as a whole is described accurately .

 

So, with that said, lets hear some common sense discussion on how to change the lot of the poorest section of the Commonwealth. Since I have family in that area, I'm all ears.