2017 Louisville Invitational Tournament

[All Tell]

LINK

 

I'm going to throw it out there. How absurd is it that Fern Creek got the one seed in this thing over Trinity?

 

Both only have 1 loss (to each other) but Trinity has faced and beaten better competition. Trinity was ahead of Fern Creek in the SETH ranking (the ranking system made up by JCPS director of athletics) after the KOB tournament but lost ground because they played in and won a better tournament out of state after that then what Fern Creek played in.

 

Also is it a coincidence that with Trinity in the 2 seed spot the stage is set for a Trinity/St. X game (and a big gate) early on?

 

► Monday, Jan. 9: Jeffersontown (19) vs. Central (14), 3:30; Manual (20) vs. Christian Academy (13), 5; Moore (18) vs. St. Xavier (13), 6:30; Western (17) vs. Fairdale (16), 8:15.

 

►Tuesday, Jan. 10: Male (10) vs. Waggener (7), 3:30; Eastern (9) vs. Butler (8), 5; DeSales (11) vs. Valley (6), 6:30; Pleasure Ridge Park (12) vs. Bullitt East (5), 8:15.

 

►Wednesday, Jan. 11: Jeffersontown-Central winner vs. Doss (3), 3:30; Western-Fairdale winner vs. Fern Creek (1), 5; Manual-Christian Academy winner vs. Ballard (4), 6:30; Moore-St. Xavier winner vs. Trinity (2), 8:15.

 

►Friday, Jan. 13: Quarterfinals at 4, 5:30, 7 and 8:45.

 

►Saturday, Jan. 14: Semifinals at 10 and 11:30 a.m.; final at 8.

[Wireman]

Happens every year in this tournament. At this point, I think they do this to stir up controversy and get people talking about their event.

[Rez]

Trinity and Fern Creek have established themselves as the top 2 teams in the state currently. While I agree that Trinity should be #1 and Fern Creek #2, it isn't a stretch to have it the other way around. Fern Creek has more high quality in state wins, and even adding in Trinity's win in TN, the gap is relatively narrow either way.

[Wireman]

This is like the 4th year in a row the No. 1 team in the state has been No. 2 or 3 in the LIT.

[THS2011]

I actually think Trinity has an easier path as the #2 seed. I do hope FC and Trinity rematch in the finals for a rubber match.

[Smallhoops]

I love the LIT and I will make it out to see some of it next week, as I do every year.

 

I think the Trinity v. Fern Creek issue is a fair debate. However, what I really don't understand is how Manual got into the field while Louisville Collegiate and Kentucky Country Day did not. At the time of selection, Manual was 2-9, with its two wins being against Portland Christian and Lexington Sayre. Collegiate was 11-4 with perhaps no great wins, but its wins generally were comparable to Manual's wins. All 4 of Collegiate's losses were to teams in the LIT field (St. X, DeSales, Western and Christian Academy. It lost again last night to Male).

 

KCD was 4-6 at the time the field was selected, and had what might be considered a bad loss to Atherton, who didn't make the LIT field. But it also had a very good 57-53 win against Bullitt East, the number 5 seed in the LIT. A much better win than either of Manual's wins.

 

I know the selections were based on the SETH ratings, but it again raises in my mind whether the SETH ratings are a useful tool.

[cols]

Dose anybody know when the girls LIT seeding comes out?

[Wireman]

I love the LIT and I will make it out to see some of it next week, as I do every year.

 

I think the Trinity v. Fern Creek issue is a fair debate. However, what I really don't understand is how Manual got into the field while Louisville Collegiate and Kentucky Country Day did not. At the time of selection, Manual was 2-9, with its two wins being against Portland Christian and Lexington Sayre. Collegiate was 11-4 with perhaps no great wins, but its wins generally were comparable to Manual's wins. All 4 of Collegiate's losses were to teams in the LIT field (St. X, DeSales, Western and Christian Academy. It lost again last night to Male).

 

KCD was 4-6 at the time the field was selected, and had what might be considered a bad loss to Atherton, who didn't make the LIT field. But it also had a very good 57-53 win against Bullitt East, the number 5 seed in the LIT. A much better win than either of Manual's wins.

 

I know the selections were based on the SETH ratings, but it again raises in my mind whether the SETH ratings are a useful tool.

 

It's definitely a tool.

[All Tell]

You're not going to ever convince me that school size and potential match-ups don't play into the selection. I don't have an issue with that if they are upfront and honest about it.

[Wireman]

You're not going to ever convince me that school size and potential match-ups don't play into the selection. I don't have an issue with that if they are upfront and honest about it.

 

This. Just explain it that way and it's all good.

[HoopJunkie]

I actually think Trinity has an easier path as the #2 seed. I do hope FC and Trinity rematch in the finals for a rubber match.

 

 

Trinity has a much bigger advantage. Fern Creek, PRP, Bullitt East, Butler, and Ballard all in the other half.

[coachlee]

You're not going to ever convince me that school size and potential match-ups don't play into the selection. I don't have an issue with that if they are upfront and honest about it.

 

You can argue with the methodology, but to suggest there is a puppetmaster behind the curtain pulling strings indicates something that simply does not exist. An AD in 6th & 7th region get updates on a regular basis and there is a scoring key that spells out every scenario that you add or subtract your points. It is impossible to rig the seedings. You can argue the logic of the scoring key, but you can also plan your schedule to maximize the potential to score points if you really want to. The biggest issue many have is that last season's team performance has a direct tie to where you start out in the new year's ranking. In the case of Fern Creek, they picked up several points the last week for a win over an undefeated South Oldham team on South Oldham's home court. That is an example of how points are awarded and beating a team with a highly rated designation on their home court awards multiple points. I do not know the exact scoring key, but it is made known to the schools.

[All Tell]

You can argue with the methodology, but to suggest there is a puppetmaster behind the curtain pulling strings indicates something that simply does not exist. An AD in 6th & 7th region get updates on a regular basis and there is a scoring key that spells out every scenario that you add or subtract your points. It is impossible to rig the seedings. You can argue the logic of the scoring key, but you can also plan your schedule to maximize the potential to score points if you really want to. The biggest issue many have is that last season's team performance has a direct tie to where you start out in the new year's ranking. In the case of Fern Creek, they picked up several points the last week for a win over an undefeated South Oldham team on South Oldham's home court. That is an example of how points are awarded and beating a team with a highly rated designation on their home court awards multiple points. I do not know the exact scoring key, but it is made known to the schools.

 

Still not convinced

[coachlee]

Some 400 ib guy in his bedroom probably hacked in.

[dawgs83]

Also Trinity did not get much from winning vs out of state teams. Last year teams got no points for playing out of state teams. They changed it this year to where I believe you got an equivalent of a win over a "C" level team. The argument is there is no real way to rate out of state teams. Fern Creek probably got more points for their three wins in the KOB vs "A" level teams than Trinity did. Like was mentioned before, ADs are given weekly SETH rankings that show the movement based on wins and losses. There is no real way to do this unless you get a selection committee and you will still have the same arguments. Past LIT using the lit ratings had the same arguments. At least with the SETH ranking the teams know where they stand when the season starts.