Rowan County 59 Ashland 56

[ballbrain]

I see your point, that was a pretty subtle "had" and it got by me. I wouldn't take back anything in my post though. I've seen rough play allowed to go a bit before a foul was called. The strategy I called out was a game ending strategy option used by the defense. The grabbing was intentional but the second foul was the fail safe, the ref might could take the position he didn't see the grab, but no way can he say he couldn't see the foul on the shooter.

[wire]

I see your point, that was a pretty subtle "had" and it got by me. I wouldn't take back anything in my post though. I've seen rough play allowed to go a bit before a foul was called. The strategy I called out was a game ending strategy option used by the defense. The grabbing was intentional but the second foul was the fail safe, the ref might could take the position he didn't see the grab, but no way can he say he couldn't see the foul on the shooter.

 

 

 

So you want to ignore one foul to get to the other, simply because it give you 3 tries at the line rather than 2?

[ballbrain]

So you want to ignore one foul to get to the other, simply because it give you 3 tries at the line rather than 2?

 

Not at all, but two wrongs don't make a right and like you said they were trying to foul. Something should have been called. It was a viable strategy and I said I didn't have a problem with it as long as the shooter gets a chance at the free throw line. When the final horn sounded it was Rowan 59 and Ashland 56. All I'm saying is there are legal ways to stop the shot and anything outside of that the rules say free throws should be given.

[wire]

Not at all, but two wrongs don't make a right and like you said they were trying to foul. Something should have been called. It was a viable strategy and I said I didn't have a problem with it as long as the shooter gets a chance at the free throw line. When the final horn sounded it was Rowan 59 and Ashland 56. All I'm saying is there are legal ways to stop the shot and anything outside of that the rules say free throws should be given.

 

I agree free throws should have been shot, but seems like most on this thread think it should have been three instead of two......that's where I differ

[ballbrain]

I agree free throws should have been shot, but seems like most on this thread think it should have been three instead of two......that's where I differ

 

I can certainly understand you're position. Trying to understand what may have been going on in the ref's mind. If he thought, "ah well, I'm not going to call a hold because it wouldn't change anything". If he saw the grab and decided not to call it maybe that was the reasoning. But then, you get the foul that radio stations, TV and sports writers from places all over our region feel is worthy of mentioning as the biggest no call, or one of the no calls they've seen. If the ref is looking at the ball coming in because he is anticipating a shot and doesn't see the grab but sees the foul on the shot, & still doesn't call either one what is his excuse then? I think the two shot foul was the plan but, when it wasn't called and the three shot foul was committed what are we claiming at that point, it's just too confusing and I'm bailing the heck out of here?

[HAMMERMAN]

If the high school officials were any good they would be calling somewhere else. I watched several games this year and didnt see one game,again one game that was even close to being called well. They must get the credentials from a cracker jack box.I was sitting with a KHSAA officials judge courtside at one of the games in a holiday tourny. One official came over during a time out and laughed and he said he was going to T a certain coach up. This was in the 4th quarter, just as he said he would,he did. The call came at a time that completely changed the game and led to a 2 point loss.The coach didnt do anything to deserve the T. I watched the official and the bench after he said that. I couldnt believe it,dont know the guys name but im sure he never played before. He is a short guy with slicked backed, dyed black hair and calls around Lexington.Oh and who asked Trivette to come back,my goodness.

[gold sunrise]

From Mike Fields Notebook:

 

 

My favorite moment from the region tournaments: Rowan County's Adam Wing and Ashland Blazer's Corey Gregg chatting amiably at mid-court 45 minutes after the Vikings beat Ashland 59-56 in the 16th Region finals. Two talented, physical players who had gone nose-to-nose not only in the region title game, but throughout their careers. The mutual respect was obvious.

Read more here: Mike Fields' notebook: Southwestern's Wright has two proteges in state tournament | High school basketball | Kentucky.com

[wire]

From Mike Fields Notebook:

 

 

My favorite moment from the region tournaments: Rowan County's Adam Wing and Ashland Blazer's Corey Gregg chatting amiably at mid-court 45 minutes after the Vikings beat Ashland 59-56 in the 16th Region finals. Two talented, physical players who had gone nose-to-nose not only in the region title game, but throughout their careers. The mutual respect was obvious.

Read more here: Mike Fields' notebook: Southwestern's Wright has two proteges in state tournament | High school basketball | Kentucky.com

 

Thanks for sharing Gold...... I think they each have general respect for each other.... Gregg and Wing are both great competitors and class acts

[gold sunrise]

Thanks for sharing Gold...... I think they each have general respect for each other.... Gregg and Wing are both great competitors and class acts

 

My pleasure. So many times these little things go unmentioned. Always like to point out the positive in our student athletes.

[Michael Corleone]

I agree free throws should have been shot, but seems like most on this thread think it should have been three instead of two......that's where I differ

 

I think it's fair to say that Ashland would have had a better chance to force overtime if anything was called rather than letting Rowan tackle the shooter. Fair enough?

[Michael Corleone]

And that's the whole point of the tactic of fouling the shooter at the end of the game. The rationale is the odds make it much harder to drop in 3 free throws as opposed to one three point shot. So the defense conceeds the free throws and committs a good hard foul on the shooter, who then must toe the line and face all the spotlight that goes with it. I have no problem with the coaching wisdom of doing that, or of Egan's effort to execute that strategy. My problem is with referee Bo Queen's failure to act. You don't just deny due process out there on the court like he did. Think of all the sensational highlights of buzzer beater shots in high school tourrnament play to come yet in this season. By the standards of this particular ref the team on defense could just tackle the shooter and celebrate their win. You can't deny a team the opportunity to shoot by using means that are clearly outside the rules of the game and not award the free throws. And that standard would apply even if the shooter was way out near half court. In this case the shooter was just past the 3 point line and well positioned for the shot. Saying that, I fully realize Whetsel would have had to make all three free throws and then the game would have gone into overtime, but as Spindoc mentioned Rowan would have had to play 4 minutes without Egan. No offense meant at all to Rowan fans here but I liked Ashland chances in the OT they fully deserved a chance to try for at the free throw line. Major travesty

 

Paragraphs are your friend.

[ballbrain]

Paragraphs are your friend.

 

 

In 2003 as 10 yr olds, 4th graders Whetsel and Bush were in Orlando Florida competing at the AAU basketball national tounament. The same thing holds true for each consecutive year thereafter up through the 8th grade. Preparing to compete at that level meant traveling weekends to various cities around the midwest participating in AAU tournaments and Super-Regionals. As a result they competed against some of the best players in the nation in their age group, many of which are presently playing DI ball at places like Kansas, Louisville, U of Tenn., and the list goes on. Sometime around the 6th grade Corey Gregg joined their AAU team and from that point onward he can make the same claim. Other players on our AAU team included Mike Terry, Zach Davis, Zach Hart, Austin Hunt, Connor Robinson, and in earlier days, Timmy Knipp. We often bumped into the likes of Evan and Ethan Faulkner and others out on the AAU trail. All those hundreds of AAU games, elementary school ball, middle school ball and middle school state tournaments which they either won (7th grade) or came in second (8th grade) in preparation for high school play.

 

Fast forward to March 5th, 2012 in the regional final and final seconds of these kids high school careers. Given the circumstances all have agreed on with regards to the no call in this thread. Should any ref lacking courage or conviction be in a position to deny Ashland Blazer High School, the team, or the shooter his just due and the chance to tie the game and see what he's made of? Coach Shawn Thacker- "My hats off to coach Biggs, his staff and players, They are such gutsy competitors. Guys like Gregg, Withrow and Whetsel, a part of me feels they are more deserving of this oppportunity" Very classy IMO. Thanks coach Thacker for the kind words, hope you all do well at state.

Edited March 10, 2012 by ballbrain

[Michael Corleone]

In 2003 as 10 yr olds, 4th graders Whetsel and Bush were in Orlando Florida competing at the AAU basketball national tounament. The same thing holds true for each consecutive year thereafter up through the 8th grade. Preparing to compete at that level meant traveling weekends to various cities around the midwest participating in AAU tournaments and Super-Regionals. As a result they competed against some of the best players in the nation in their age group, many of which are presently playing DI ball at places like Kansas, Louisville, U of Tenn., and the list goes on. Sometime around the 6th grade Corey Gregg joined their AAU team and from that point onward he can make the same claim. Other players on our AAU team included Mike Terry, Zach Davis, Zach Hart, Austin Hunt, Connor Robinson, and in earlier days, Timmy Knipp. We often bumped into the likes of Evan and Ethan Faulkner and others out on the AAU trail. All those hundreds of AAU games, elementary school ball, middle school ball and middle school state tournaments which they either won (7th grade) or came in second (8th grade) in preparation for high school play.

 

Fast forward to March 5th, 2012 in the regional final and final seconds of these kids high school careers. Given the circumstances all have agreed on with regards to the no call in this thread. Should any ref lacking courage or conviction be in a position to deny Ashland Blazer High School, the team, or the shooter his just due and the chance to tie the game and see what he's made of? Coach Shawn Thacker- "My hats off to coach Biggs, his staff and players, They are such gutsy competitors. Guys like Gregg, Withrow and Whetsel, a part of me feels they are more deserving of this oppportunity" Very classy IMO. Thanks coach Thacker for the kind words, hope you all do well at state.

 

That's a great story, those kids should be proud of all of their accomplishment on the hardwood, and very kind words from Coach Thacker but what does that have to do with using paragraphs?

[ballbrain]

That's a great story, those kids should be proud of all of their accomplishment on the hardwood, and very kind words from Coach Thacker but what does that have to do with using paragraphs?

 

 

LOL, I don't know. Something about your avatar just makes me want to wax historical.