When poverty strikes

[marvel]

Nice spin on the thread title, ace.

 

You are basically saying that if I refused to give my child anymore money and he/she offed themselves and their children it would somehow be my fault?

[bballfamily]

So you are saying that a person's circumstances NEVER cause them to murder, really? NEVER? A person's circumstances NEVER cause them to start cutting themselves, or drinking, or anything? It is all physiological, or psychological, huh?

 

The the kid who is sexually, or physically, or mentally abused for years and exhibits self destructive behavior or even lashes out at the perpetrator is not influenced by their environment. Interesting. I will take this theory to my social workers here at school and tell them how wrong we have been all along and that environmental factors have no impact on how people behave.

 

In your world no one has responsiblity for their own actions. It is always someone elses fault.

I fully understand why you and Obama get along. Why accept the fact that your at fault when you can blame someone else for the your actions?

[Know It All]

There was obviously some desperation and certainly a lack of hope.

 

While the woman is to blame, circumstances cannot be ignored.

 

The woman is completely to blame. Poverty cannot be ignored, nor can it be used as a scapegoat to murder two innocent children. If she is desparate, how is that a motive to take the lives of her children?? Obviously, something wasn't clicking upstairs for this woman.

[Know It All]

In your world no one has responsiblity for their own actions. It is always someone elses fault.

I fully understand why you and Obama get along. Why accept the fact that your at fault when you can blame someone else for the your actions?

 

It's not her fault she shot her kids. Poverty forced her to do it.

[Run To State]

It's not her fault she shot her kids. Poverty forced her to do it.

Disagree. Mental illness is likely the reason she did what she did.

[Know It All]

Disagree. Mental illness is likely the reason she did what she did.

Sarcasm. Read my previous post.

[acemona]

Apparently you guys completely ignored half of my post.

 

The woman is certainly to blame, yet circumstances cannot be ignored.

 

What led to her desperation? Where were the folks, community? that should have been working to help her out? Sometimes you can't pull yourself up by the bootstraps because you don't have any boots. Sometimes you need help. If you continually cannot get help, desperation sets in. Maybe in her state, she thought it would be better for her children to go on to heaven than to be hungry and homeless. If she was mentally ill, then the community absolutely missed the boat. If she was mentally ill she might not know to get mental health help. Who missed the signs and when. Have we become a world where there is no care about the other person, no community, no empathy and we are only worried about when someone dies and then we immediately place the blame on them and continue to have no empathy and not try to understand the circumstances.

[75center]

She might get more help if she didn't miss important appointments and followed up on a timely basis. These guys are spread pretty thin as it is, particularly over the past couple years. They can't go chasing every person who doesn't do what they need to do in applying for aid.

[UKMustangFan]

Apparently you guys completely ignored half of my post.

 

The woman is certainly to blame, yet circumstances cannot be ignored.

 

What led to her desperation? Where were the folks, community? that should have been working to help her out? Sometimes you can't pull yourself up by the bootstraps because you don't have any boots. Sometimes you need help. If you continually cannot get help, desperation sets in. Maybe in her state, she thought it would be better for her children to go on to heaven than to be hungry and homeless. If she was mentally ill, then the community absolutely missed the boat. If she was mentally ill she might not know to get mental health help. Who missed the signs and when. Have we become a world where there is no care about the other person, no community, no empathy and we are only worried about when someone dies and then we immediately place the blame on them and continue to have no empathy and not try to understand the circumstances.

 

All you're doing is making excuses for attempted murder. No one is ever responsible for their own actions with you are they Ace? Nothing better than wanting to enable murderers.

[Run To State]

Sarcasm. Read my previous post.

My bad, I have to admit I quickly skimmed through this thread.

[Run To State]

Apparently you guys completely ignored half of my post.

 

The woman is certainly to blame, yet circumstances cannot be ignored.

 

What led to her desperation? Where were the folks, community? that should have been working to help her out? Sometimes you can't pull yourself up by the bootstraps because you don't have any boots. Sometimes you need help. If you continually cannot get help, desperation sets in. Maybe in her state, she thought it would be better for her children to go on to heaven than to be hungry and homeless. If she was mentally ill, then the community absolutely missed the boat. If she was mentally ill she might not know to get mental health help. Who missed the signs and when. Have we become a world where there is no care about the other person, no community, no empathy and we are only worried about when someone dies and then we immediately place the blame on them and continue to have no empathy and not try to understand the circumstances.

What are we supposed to do? Make everyone get evaluated every six months? People have always and will always "slip through the cracks", it isn't a perfect world. It doesn't mean society doesn't care.

[UKMustangFan]

By Ace's logic, if I have a wife and two kids, am the only source of income, lose my job, and shoot up the place out of desperation, we should be placing blame with my job that fired me. :lol:

[Know It All]

Ace...

 

she thought it would be better for her children to go on to heaven than to be hungry and homeless.

 

That justifies shooting them with a gun.

 

desperation sets in.

 

When does desparation become a motive to shoot your children?

 

If she was mentally ill, then the community absolutely missed the boat.

 

Don't generalize everyone and blame it on society. That makes me sick to my stomach, what about her family and friends? That's who missed the boat.

 

Have we become a world where there is no care about the other person, no community, no empathy and we are only worried about when someone dies and then we immediately place the blame on them and continue to have no empathy and not try to understand the circumstances.

 

Bold - Family & friends. As individuals, are we suppose to search and rescue the poor?

 

Secondly, the world isn't a merry-go-round and I guarantee I can find people who have been in a worse situation than she was and they didn't shoot their kids. No one forced her to shoot her kids, everyone has problems and some people have it way worse than others. Who else is to blame than the mother holding the gun to her kids? Sure, we can try to understand poverty when some of us will never experience it. But no one is to blame for shooting her kids, other than herself. That is never ok in my book, given any circumstances.

[acemona]

Again, just so it doesn't get lost in all of my wordiness I will put it in a post all by itself:

 

ABSOLUTELY THE WOMAN IS TO BLAME

[acemona]

Now on to the other things:

 

Community - would include the friends and family.

How do you know what her situation was that you can find others who have been in worse.

Believing that the children might be better off in heaven was not a justification for the action, but perhaps some insight into a mindset.

Desperation is motive for a lot of things, it doesn't make it okay but it does help explain.

 

Yes we are suppose to search and rescue the poor and oppressed and down-trodden. I would say that is a strong characteristic of making us humans but for those who embrace the teachings of Jesus Christ - I don't know what could be considered a higher calling.

 

Do you guys not see the irony in some of your philosophy and logic:

Killing the kids is bad

Letting them suffer in a life of poverty is okay because it is their parents fault and we should cut the .01% of the federal budget that goes to WIC and Foodstamps.

There is a spectrum or scale or whatever you want to call it between death and survival.