Saving pitching for the next game

[Park1221]

I agree Coop,

The thing with the 7th is that it was so wide open that nobody was going to have their #1 going in the championship.

[cooperstown]

I agree in theory. CCH was able to throw their 3 because they were playing St Henry. If they had drawn Boone first, I think the Colonels would have thrown Isler or Nutini.

 

He made a judgment call that I would disagree with IN THIS CASE. Had Beechwood drawn St Henry or Lloyd or Highlands, then you throw your #2.

 

All of this is assuming Elliott is healthy which I'm guessing he is or I'd hate to be Holy Cross.

 

:thumb: Agreed.

 

The "calculated risk" of pitching down is much better taken when facing an obviously inferior opponent. Boone was not that.

[cooperstown]

You go to the regional tournament to win the tournament, not one game. Who has the most 9th region championships? Krumps, then Myerhoff? Two guys that regularly start the tourney with their 2 or 3. If their 2 or 3 can't get you past a district loser, they're not going to get you past a district winner later in the tournament.

 

Myerhoff absolutely made the right decision not to start Elliott. If you're #2 isn't good enough to beat Boone in the first round, he's not going to be good enough to beat NC in the second and your #3 isn't going to be good enough to beat CCH in the finals. Or vice-versa

 

Maxwell threw his best in the first game two years in a row and went 1-1. If he takes a chance with his #2 versus HHS and has Nichols for CCH, he's in the finals tomorrow.

I'm a firm believer in saving your best for the best, because that gives you the best chance to win the tournament.

 

IF Dixie would have beaten HHS using their #2. You don't know what would have happened if they threw less than #1. Dixie made sure they advanced to the next game - a game that they could/should have won. Actually, I think this makes a better case for using your #1 in a first-round game (against a solid opponent).

[stickymitts]

Of course, in past years CCH and Beechwood did not always have to play a first-round opponent the quality of Boone. Boone was not a district loser. It's a much easier decision to drop down below your #1 if you a playing an obviously weaker opponent.

 

You have to advance if you want to win the whole thing. Period. And you do whatever is necessary to advance. You can save your "best for the best", but if you don't get to that game, the "looking ahead" theory was rather pointless. One of the reasons it is more than worth the risk to use your #1 to advance is that your next opponent(s) will likely have done the same thing. I'm quite certain BHS would have been more than happy to have been throwing their #2 or #3 - both very nice pitchers - against NCC last night, who also didn't have their #1 to throw.

I'm a firm believer that when I get knocked out of a tournament I want to know that the best team I could field (pitch) for that particular game was on the field. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

 

And another point about not throwing Elliott, Beechwood had their best team on the field with him in centerfield.

[Lefty6]

Danville pitched 3 of their pitchers (including their #1) in the opening game of the 12th. They played game 1 on Monday and the remainder of the games on Monday were rained out and pushed to Tuesday. No games Wednesday due to Danville graduation. So the Semi's are now today (Thursday) and I think Danville has all pitchers available based on the amount of rest required.

[stickymitts]

IF Dixie would have beaten HHS using their #2. You don't know what would have happened if they threw less than #1. Dixie made sure they advanced to the next game - a game that they could/should have won. Actually, I think this makes a better case for using your #1 in a first-round game (against a solid opponent).

 

Yet they're sitting at home like the rest of us. There's no way that they're happy they won a game in the region. The goal is to win the whole thing and IMO, you have to have your #1 later in the tournament.

 

And no one can predict the weather, that's just luck...good or bad.

[cooperstown]

Yet they're sitting at home like the rest of us. There's no way that they're happy they won a game in the region. The goal is to win the whole thing and IMO, you have to have your #1 later in the tournament.

And no one can predict the weather, that's just luck...good or bad.

 

So you sit at home after being eliminated using a lesser pitcher, but console yourself by saying that "If only we would have advanced, we would have had our ace ready to go"? Can't buy it.

 

If you're facing an obviously lesser opponent, then fine, it is worth the risk. But BHS vs. Boone and HHS vs. Dixie are not lesser opponents for any of the involved teams. I want my team on the field for the next game with a chance to win - albeit with less than my #1 - than go home with him never having thrown. You have a CHANCE to win if you're in the game. You have no chance if your team is watching from the bleachers.

[cooperstown]

And another point about not throwing Elliott, Beechwood had their best team on the field with him in centerfield.

 

Isn't it your contention that BHS was correct in saving Elliott for the finals because this gave them the best team to win the big game? So if Elliott in CF is their best option to win, why the need to save him for the finals? Why not pitch "down" using him and then use your "best team" (with obviously someone other than Elliott pitching) for the later tournament games?

[stickymitts]

Isn't it your contention that BHS was correct in saving Elliott for the finals because this gave them the best team to win the big game? So if Elliott in CF is their best option to win, why the need to save him for the finals? Why not pitch "down" using him and then use your "best team" (with obviously someone other than Elliott pitching) for the later tournament games?

 

That works both ways. You're saying that you have to have your best pitcher on the mound, which doesn't necessarily mean your best team.

 

I'm not going to continue to argue, bottom line is that the guys that have won more regions than any of us have saved their 1's numerous times and benefitted from it more often than not. I'll take there opinion...

[thsrocks]

Tricky business saving a pitcher for a game that you may never get to play.....:thumb:

[Baseballguy]

Tricky business saving a pitcher for a game that you may never get to play.....:thumb:

 

 

We have a winner!!:dancingpa

[stickymitts]

Tricky business saving a pitcher for a game that you may never get to play.....:thumb:

 

Even trickier considering the #2 that was throwing didn't win a quarterfinal game and you're relying on him to win a semifinal game.

 

As they say, sometimes it's better to be lucky than good...

[gchs_uk9]

Danville pitched 3 of their pitchers (including their #1) in the opening game of the 12th. They played game 1 on Monday and the remainder of the games on Monday were rained out and pushed to Tuesday. No games Wednesday due to Danville graduation. So the Semi's are now today (Thursday) and I think Danville has all pitchers available based on the amount of rest required.

 

Worked out well for Danville, but they were playing Wayne County...a game they should win with #1 or #2, and probably #3 on the hill. Rain and graduation helped get everyone rest. Perhaps it wasn't great planning for the Ads, but rather good fortune.

[cooperstown]

Even trickier considering the #2 that was throwing didn't win a quarterfinal game and you're relying on him to win a semifinal game.

 

As they say, sometimes it's better to be lucky than good...

 

But it wasn't his fault. Haven't we heard over and over that he and BHS' other pitchers pitched well enough to win? (Which, of course, they didn't, since they didn't win. )

 

Guess it all comes down to personal preference. I'm not at all against saving your #1 in the right situation (i.e., facing a clearly weaker opponent that should in no way require use of your ace). I just don't think Boone was that opponent. And I believe that sometimes coaches "outthink" themselves. Just because a strategy has been successful in the past doesn't mean it is the right strategy to apply at the present.

[stick1]

I understand others logic but I'm with Sticky in this one. At some point you HAVE to be able to win a game with your #2 if not eve your #3. If I'm playing a team I should beat pretty easy in the 1st round but play one of the best teams in the state the 2nd round then I have 2 options:

1. Start my best vs the bad team and hope my #2 beats the great team

or

2. Start my #2 against a team he should beat and throw my ace for the great team.

It depends on the competition you are playing IMO. This scenerio I'm saving my ace for game 2!