Why can't the publics compete?

I know that in Jeff Co and I believe it is the same throughout the state. Each school gets in their budget over $90.00 a day for each students that shows up. That in a school year is almost $16,000 nearly double that of mosty tuitions in Jeff Co. Where does the money go and why can't they have better things? Blows my mind.

From my perspective it is not about funds. As I mentioned in another post, I had read somewhere that Lex Catholic has athletes from 10 or 12 different counties. A private school HAS to be set up to draw from a large area to get the students they want. A public school is and should be set up to draw from one community. When you have a school that is going to be able to draw the best and brightest from mutiple counties vs. a school that is drawing from a small community, there is going to be a unlevel playing field.

I do not know the numbers but I do believe that most of the school systems are more like the latter example I gave than the example of a school drawing from mutliple counties.

Now, one solution might be to make the call that EVERY public school should have open enrollment. I disagree with that stance because I don't think it is in the mission of the public schools to draw from outside of their communities. But that call would make public schools more like a private school.

From my perspective it is not about funds. As I mentioned in another post, I had read somewhere that Lex Catholic has athletes from 10 or 12 different counties. A private school HAS to be set up to draw from a large area to get the students they want. A public school is and should be set up to draw from one community. When you have a school that is going to be able to draw the best and brightest from mutiple counties vs. a school that is drawing from a small community, there is going to be a unlevel playing field.

 

I do not know the numbers but I do believe that most of the school systems are more like the latter example I gave than the example of a school drawing from mutliple counties.

 

Now, one solution might be to make the call that EVERY public school should have open enrollment. I disagree with that stance because I don't think it is in the mission of the public schools to draw from outside of their communities. But that call would make public schools more like a private school.

You live in a small community taht may never compete based on what you say. We live in large city where every school gets the funding and has open erollment to compete but through various reasons they don't. Maybe there should be even more championships for open enrollment schools and non open enrollment schools.

From my perspective it is not about funds. As I mentioned in another post, I had read somewhere that Lex Catholic has athletes from 10 or 12 different counties. A private school HAS to be set up to draw from a large area to get the students they want. A public school is and should be set up to draw from one community. When you have a school that is going to be able to draw the best and brightest from mutiple counties vs. a school that is drawing from a small community, there is going to be a unlevel playing field.

 

I do not know the numbers but I do believe that most of the school systems are more like the latter example I gave than the example of a school drawing from mutliple counties.

 

Now, one solution might be to make the call that EVERY public school should have open enrollment. I disagree with that stance because I don't think it is in the mission of the public schools to draw from outside of their communities. But that call would make public schools more like a private school.

How big of a radius is that? I can't imagine kids driving over twenty miles or so every day for school. Do they? Do you know? Are they driving past other Catholic schools to get to LexCath? That county thing may be a fact, but it also may mean nothing. The KHSAA investigated LexCath with a fine tooth comb and came up empty. So the cry-babies voted to kick them out anyway. Not really the American way is it?

It would be interesting to know how many students (many athletes) who live outside the normal boundaries of the schools who "pushed" for these changes attend those schools. I would submit that you would find a lot of hypocracy.

When you have a school that is going to be able to draw the best and brightest from mutiple counties vs. a school that is drawing from a small community, there is going to be a unlevel playing field.

Public schools offer "Full Scholarships" to every student. Public schools provide "Free Transportation" to many students. Public schools are 100% funded by government (our tax) dollars. Public schools are legally free to accept students from anywhere in Kentucky, including out-of-staters wanting to attend a Kentucky school. The only restriction on district boundaries are self-imposed by each local school board. It would seem that public schools have every advantage.

Instead of bashing private schools, it would make good sense for public school supporters to ask why parents would willingly choose to invest the extra money and spend the extra time transporting their kids to a private school that is less convenient in every way?

Now, one solution might be to make the call that EVERY public school should have open enrollment. I disagree with that stance because I don't think it is in the mission of the public schools to draw from outside of their communities. But that call would make public schools more like a private school.

This argument is like a person who has made a personal decision to give up eating meat, and then turns around and insists that everyone else quit eating meat too.

Thanks, but I prefer freedom. :thumb:

From my perspective it is not about funds. As I mentioned in another post, I had read somewhere that Lex Catholic has athletes from 10 or 12 different counties. A private school HAS to be set up to draw from a large area to get the students they want. A public school is and should be set up to draw from one community. When you have a school that is going to be able to draw the best and brightest from mutiple counties vs. a school that is drawing from a small community, there is going to be a unlevel playing field.

 

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And with that unlevel playing field of 10 to 12 different counties to draw from its no wonder that LexCath is so dominant in 3A football and just thumps Highlands and Boyle County every year while winning al those multiple championships.....................hey wait a minute someones pulling the wool over my eyes.

What is it that any private school has to offer that makes it worthwhile for parents to sacrifice to get their kids there?

 

Public schools offer "Full Scholarships" to every student. Public schools provide "Free Transportation" to many students. Public schools are 100% funded by government (our tax) dollars. Public schools are legally free to accept students from anywhere in Kentucky, including out-of-staters wanting to attend a Kentucky school. The only restriction on district boundaries are self-imposed by each local school board. It would seem that public schools have every advantage.

 

Instead of bashing private schools, it would make good sense for public school supporters to ask why parents would willingly choose to invest the extra money and spend the extra time transporting their kids to a private school that is less convenient in every way?

 

Again, the only enrollment restriction public schools have under the law is what each school district/board has chosen to voluntarily impose upon itself. They are free to take any students they want from anywhere. The problem is, they don't have students knocking down their doors to get in.

 

This argument is like a person who has made a personal decision to give up eating meat, and then turns around and insists that everyone else quit eating meat too.

 

Thanks, but I prefer freedom. :thumb:

To answer your two points, I have bolded them.

1)I believe that would be the school aligns more closely with the parent's personal religious beliefs. Of course, public schools are not allowed to address this in any way, shape or form. Even to the point, people want the pledge of allegiance removed from the school system. I applaud the private school parents for staying true to their faith.

2)I applaud the school board members in staying true to their mission of educating youth in their community and not opening up the doors to field stronger athletic teams. Public schools have a different focus than privates. Publics are designed to educate youth in a community. Privates are designed, in most cases, to educate youth whose parents have some interest in a specific faith.

LBBC, if you don't know it already, I do respect you very much. We do not see eye-to-eye on every issue, but we do agree on what counts the most, and you are always able to debate civilly on the points we disagree. :thumb:

In regard to your "Point 1" I agree that religious (and patriotic) values are a piece of the puzzle, but I think the reasons go much deeper that that point alone. It would benefit public school engineers in the long run, to examine all of the things that private schools are doing that may be more successful.

2)I applaud the school board members in staying true to their mission of educating youth in their community and not opening up the doors to field stronger athletic teams. Public schools have a different focus than privates. Publics are designed to educate youth in a community. Privates are designed, in most cases, to educate youth whose parents have some interest in a specific faith.

All this bluster about “leveling the playing field” means nothing in terms of preparing our kids to succeed in the real world. Like it or not God does not grade on a curve… neither does the world. By continually watering things down to make them "fair" we are IMO doing more harm than good.

This strikes me as making adults appear to be doing better in their jobs than it is to actually educate and prepare our children to succeed themselves.

IMO, the publics CAN compete IF:

1) They realize that teaching the fundamentals of a sport begins when the child begins school. If your goal is to have a great athletic system, you begin a system at the grade school level.

2) Stop using Title IX as an excuse. I understand that the monies must be distributed equally. So, do it. Don't stop trying to raise money just because it's going to be shared. Isn't the well-being or your female students as important as your male students? Why all this flack and animosity over revenue sharing? Why do people refuse to fundraise for their school?

Who knows, maybe your girls team in some sport is the sport that brings fame to your school, and creates intrest in your athletics!

3) Create a level of interest in participation among your students. Work the halls, generate enthusiasm, get your students to buy in to the benefits of playing sports.

4) Create enthusiasm among your alumni, parents, other students and the community for your school and it's programs. Involve them, and the volunteer efforts and fundraising will follow.

5) Create a sense of community within your school. Make it more than just a place a kid has to go for 6 hours a day. Make it a place they WANT to be and WANT to represent.

I realize all of the above may not apply to all schools. But, those are the 5 core things that I think public schools need to address to compete. The problem is that it's hit or miss among schools, and then those that don't have any/all of the 5 are stymied by their competition's success.

LBBC, if you don't know it already, I do respect you very much. We do not see eye-to-eye on every issue, but we do agree on what counts the most, and you are always able to debate civilly on the points we disagree. :thumb:

 

In regard to your "Point 1" I agree that religious (and patriotic) values are a piece of the puzzle, but I think the reasons go much deeper that that point alone. It would benefit public school engineers in the long run, to examine all of the things that private schools are doing that may be more successful.

 

If that is indeed the public school mission, then why all the venom toward private schools over extracurricular sports? I personally think the answer is bigger than athletics. There is genuine resentment from public educators toward private educators for removing students from the public system.

 

All this bluster about “leveling the playing field” means nothing in terms of preparing our kids to succeed in the real world. Like it or not God does not grade on a curve… neither does the world. By continually watering things down to make them "fair" we are IMO doing more harm than good.

 

This strikes me as making adults appear to be doing better in their jobs than it is to actually educate and prepare our children to succeed themselves.

And I give 100% respect back. I love ready your posts whether I agree or not. Always civil and always thought-provoking.

Latest testing have shown that private school students score NO BETTER than public school students of similar socio-economic background. That private schools do not advance students any further in their educational experience than public schools when comparing similar socio-economic students. The difference of the perception of schools comes from the students that are enrolled in public schools that private schools do not have in the same quantity. That said, I don't want my children riding a public school bus either.

I been told time and time again public schools are about educating and not preparing for the real world. The real world includes final, harsh penalties for improper behavior and we don't have that in public schools. We are basically not allowed to expel students unless they are a danger to the school. Does not matter how much they act up and disrupt the education process. Special ed students can only be suspended for a max of 10 days in a year NO matter how much they misbehave. And you can't expel them without providing some sort of teaching service, no matter their behavior. That is not the real world either.

The real world includes religion and we all know that we can't touch that subject. There are unfortunately many areas that we are not allowed to prepare students for the real world. Time and time again, I am told that is the job of parents.

How big of a radius is that? I can't imagine kids driving over twenty miles or so every day for school. Do they? Do you know? Are they driving past other Catholic schools to get to LexCath? That county thing may be a fact, but it also may mean nothing. The KHSAA investigated LexCath with a fine tooth comb and came up empty. So the cry-babies voted to kick them out anyway. Not really the American way is it?

Zach Barnard drove from Henderson to Owensboro every day to go to Owensboro Catholic and that is over 20 miles.

I keep seeing all this talk of Private schools working harder and longer than the public schools, from my experience this is not the case. My son is a baseball player at LCA and they won 2005 state championship and I don't believe the reason they won was that they worked harder than public schools or worked in the off season more. I have watched the dedication of the High School atheletes both public and private for many years and all this talk of working harder is nothing but fuel to the fire for public schools. All private schools do not recruit or use their financial resources to win state championships. Private school for most people has nothing to do with sports,it has do do with what you think is best for your child. I am a graduate of public school and see advantages in the academic and athletic fields for both sides. With Dunbar winning the State baseball championship in 2003 and Lafayette finishing runner-up in 2004 no one can tell me LCA with an enrollment of 390 students had an advantage over these big schools in 2005. Sometimes winning isn't about advantages its about being in the right place at the right time.True athletes want to compete at the highest level of competition and after watching sports for many years in and around the State I see some advantages everywhere. Big schools have advantage over smaller schools, Louisville schools have advantage over other districts because of open enrollments but this does not mean they can't be beaten. LCA competes against public and private schools alike and in any given year the best school could be public or private. Even though my son will likely graduate before any change is made I hate to see any state champion not be able to say his team conquered everyone. I see in these posts and obviously from the ADs of the public schools that they believe Private schools are at huge advantages over publics. I don't believe this to be true except in maybe 4A football and hate to see championships won by any school be watered down. True fairness is not attainable in sports and this proposal only shifts the power in some sports from a couple of big 4A schools to a couple of different 4A schools. I only hope the KHSAA has the sense to stop this from ruining High School championships from every student both public and private.

Great post Lexbaseball33. :thumb:

IMO, the publics CAN compete IF:

 

1) They realize that teaching the fundamentals of a sport begins when the child begins school. If your goal is to have a great athletic system, you begin a system at the grade school level.

 

2) Stop using Title IX as an excuse. I understand that the monies must be distributed equally. So, do it. Don't stop trying to raise money just because it's going to be shared. Isn't the well-being or your female students as important as your male students? Why all this flack and animosity over revenue sharing? Why do people refuse to fundraise for their school?

Who knows, maybe your girls team in some sport is the sport that brings fame to your school, and creates intrest in your athletics!

 

3) Create a level of interest in participation among your students. Work the halls, generate enthusiasm, get your students to buy in to the benefits of playing sports.

 

4) Create enthusiasm among your alumni, parents, other students and the community for your school and it's programs. Involve them, and the volunteer efforts and fundraising will follow.

 

5) Create a sense of community within your school. Make it more than just a place a kid has to go for 6 hours a day. Make it a place they WANT to be and WANT to represent.

 

I realize all of the above may not apply to all schools. But, those are the 5 core things that I think public schools need to address to compete. The problem is that it's hit or miss among schools, and then those that don't have any/all of the 5 are stymied by their competition's success.

Rockmom..You bring up a good point.

I know Beechwood in particular does not even offer Grade school sports.

It is like everything else...the younger you learn, the better you become as you grow older.