30 minutes ago, B-Ball-fan said:

Are there still some districts that still don't seed?

https://bluegrasspreps.com/forums/topic/224933-39th-district-draw/

If, as you have in the districts, both the winner and runner-up advance...then, yes, you need to seed.  In most instances, this is easier to do because of actual head to head competition during the regular season.

But, if you are looking for one, ultimate winner...then a blind draw is the only way to do the bracket without any bias.  (And yes, computers have a bias...because they've got to be programmed by someone.)  As has already been said, to be the best, you've got to beat the best.  Doesn't matter if that's in the first game or the fourth game.

The only reason to advocate for seeding, is from the fan's standpoint.  And that's a selfish view to have, in my opinion.

1 hour ago, CincySportsFan said:

If, as you have in the districts, both the winner and runner-up advance...then, yes, you need to seed.  In most instances, this is easier to do because of actual head to head competition during the regular season.

But, if you are looking for one, ultimate winner...then a blind draw is the only way to do the bracket without any bias.  (And yes, computers have a bias...because they've got to be programmed by someone.)  As has already been said, to be the best, you've got to beat the best.  Doesn't matter if that's in the first game or the fourth game.

The only reason to advocate for seeding, is from the fan's standpoint.  And that's a selfish view to have, in my opinion.

Almost ever major tournament, played in almost every sport, uses some sort of seeding system. Is the KHSAA the only sports body who has this whole tournament thing figured out?

On 3/10/2021 at 1:01 PM, The Double Deuce said:

14 vs 5

10 vs 8

11 vs 7

4 vs 2

 --------------

12 vs 15

13 vs 16

6 vs 1

9 vs 3

If one goes by the KHSAA RPI this will be the winners. I think it will hold true for the majority of the regions. A few regions are close, such as the 14th where I live. Hazard is a slim favorite but Knott Central, Breathitt County (regional site), Leslie County,  Wolfe County, and Perry Central are factors too. Second region is a difficult pick IMO because this is unfamiliar territory for favorite Lyon County. The  6th, 10th and 12th are also tough picks. 

Hazard vs Elizabethtown

Mason County vs Oldham County

Lexington Catholic vs Ballard

 Bowling Green vs Lyon County

Boyle County vs Johnson Central

 North Laurel vs Ashland Blazer 

DeSales vs McCracken County

Covington Catholic vs Muhlenberg County

2 hours ago, CincySportsFan said:

If, as you have in the districts, both the winner and runner-up advance...then, yes, you need to seed.  In most instances, this is easier to do because of actual head to head competition during the regular season.

But, if you are looking for one, ultimate winner...then a blind draw is the only way to do the bracket without any bias.  (And yes, computers have a bias...because they've got to be programmed by someone.)  As has already been said, to be the best, you've got to beat the best.  Doesn't matter if that's in the first game or the fourth game.

The only reason to advocate for seeding, is from the fan's standpoint.  And that's a selfish view to have, in my opinion.

I can think of another reason to seed:  money.  The reason to seed would be to create a matchup that would attract a lot of fans to the later rounds, especially the title game.  It doesn't do any good from a financial perspective to have the top teams knock each other out early, which is what happened years back when Dunbar and Mercer County had to face each other in round one.

4 hours ago, brooksville said:

https://bluegrasspreps.com/forums/topic/224933-39th-district-draw/

I definitely agree that all districts should seed. Your season, and how you fared head-to-head with the teams in your district should count for something. I wonder how many districts still do the blind draw?

Not every team will be fortunate enough to make it to the Sweet 16, but at least each region should try as close as they can to have their best 8 in their respective regional tournaments. 

Some districts are super strong, and that is not going to happen, but in general a team like Augusta who clearly is better than Bracken or St. Pat’s, and have already proved it should have a clearer path to the regional tournament. 

With the current structure of having the best from each region make it to the Sweet 16, we’ll never have the true top 16, and if they tried to do that, each year the state tournament will be loaded with teams from the 6th, 7th, 9th, and 11th, and I personally wouldn’t want to see that. I like seeing every area of the state being represented. 

This is high school ball, and the majority of these kids will never play past this level, so why should we make it such a big deal that the Sweet 16 is seeded with only the Top 16 when the charm that has been historically in effect makes for spreading those dreams more evenly around the state, and who doesn’t love to see Cinderella at the dance, and see if she can rise to the occasion and make some noise. Sure Cindy doesn’t always win all the marbles, but she sure has had a history with making the Sweet 16 interesting, and downright emotionally moving. 

I like the blind draw of the Sweet 16, and the best 16 from each region from a traditional standpoint, but I do agree that districts should be seeded so that each regional tournament is truly filled with the best of that region, and giving those kids what they deserve, because while the Sweet 16 is always the big dance and the dream and goal of every team, the regional tournaments are undeniably a super big deal with so many. 

 

7 hours ago, The Professor said:

If one goes by the KHSAA RPI this will be the winners. I think it will hold true for the majority of the regions. A few regions are close, such as the 14th where I live. Hazard is a slim favorite but Knott Central, Breathitt County (regional site), Leslie County,  Wolfe County, and Perry Central are factors too. Second region is a difficult pick IMO because this is unfamiliar territory for favorite Lyon County. The  6th, 10th and 12th are also tough picks. 

Hazard vs Elizabethtown

Mason County vs Oldham County

Lexington Catholic vs Ballard

 Bowling Green vs Lyon County

Boyle County vs Johnson Central

 North Laurel vs Ashland Blazer 

DeSales vs McCracken County

Covington Catholic vs Muhlenberg County

One things for sure there's always a few upsets.

DeSales is very capable of winning the 6th Region, but they have a to to play 3 straight tough opponents to get there. They have to play Doss, who is quite good, but haven't gotten to play very many games this season. If the Colts beat Doss, the will have to play Butler who just beat DeSales March 8.  If they win both of those games they still have to play an excellent opponent probably either PRP or Fern Creek.  Not an easy pass to the State Tournament, but doable with a little bit of luck!! 

 

I don't get why the kids even need to play. Sounds like the people on here have already picked every regions winner. Some need a reminder that these are kids and that the unthinkable can happen. Some of these "top" teams may lose. 

2 hours ago, BigRob said:

I don't get why the kids even need to play. Sounds like the people on here have already picked every regions winner. Some need a reminder that these are kids and that the unthinkable can happen. Some of these "top" teams may lose. 

"I'm shocked! Shocked to find that 'predicting' is going on here!"

5 hours ago, BigRob said:

I don't get why the kids even need to play. Sounds like the people on here have already picked every regions winner. Some need a reminder that these are kids and that the unthinkable can happen. Some of these "top" teams may lose. 

Exactly.  You look at the thousands upon thousands of hours of tape/broadcasts we have for the college basketball regular season, and the hundreds of eyes of "experts" who look at it to do their seeding process, and what do we get?  A best guess.  Heck, in all the years, I think we've only had one time where all four #1 seeds made it to the end.  But, even in that year, you had 2 #13 seeds and 2 #12 seeds with upsets in the first round, and a #10 seed that advanced to the Elite Eight.  So, there were still upsets before you got to the finals.

My point is, we don't have anywhere near the eyes on high school basketball.  Most people look at box scores, and then go with some preconceived bias about which district/region HAS to be better than another, just...because.

The Sweet 16 is not about getting the 16 best teams to play each other.  Or even having the top 2 teams play in the final.  It's about representing your area (region) of the state, and seeing how you stack up against the rest of the state.  Take what will always be a flawed human element out of it, and just draw.  Because we've already seen that things never go chalk when you seed it.

6 hours ago, BigRob said:

I don't get why the kids even need to play. Sounds like the people on here have already picked every regions winner. Some need a reminder that these are kids and that the unthinkable can happen. Some of these "top" teams may lose. 

I dont the @The Professor "picked every regions winner". I think he was merely giving people an idea of who could be playing who. I for one do not know which teams are doing well in each respective region, and his post allows you to see potential match ups. Sure in the 9th St. Henry or Highlands could win the region, but as a CCH fan it is interesting to see what our potential road to the championship would be if we were to make it out of the 9th region tournament.

1 hour ago, CincySportsFan said:

Exactly.  You look at the thousands upon thousands of hours of tape/broadcasts we have for the college basketball regular season, and the hundreds of eyes of "experts" who look at it to do their seeding process, and what do we get?  A best guess.  Heck, in all the years, I think we've only had one time where all four #1 seeds made it to the end.  But, even in that year, you had 2 #13 seeds and 2 #12 seeds with upsets in the first round, and a #10 seed that advanced to the Elite Eight.  So, there were still upsets before you got to the finals.

My point is, we don't have anywhere near the eyes on high school basketball.  Most people look at box scores, and then go with some preconceived bias about which district/region HAS to be better than another, just...because.

The Sweet 16 is not about getting the 16 best teams to play each other.  Or even having the top 2 teams play in the final.  It's about representing your area (region) of the state, and seeing how you stack up against the rest of the state.  Take what will always be a flawed human element out of it, and just draw.  Because we've already seen that things never go chalk when you seed it.

Seeding isn't about getting "chalk". It's about rewarding those teams who performed the best during the regular season. 

I will agree with you that the Sweet 16 isn't about getting the best 16 teams to play each other. Where we disagree, is that your state tournament should absolutely be about trying to get the 16 best teams to play for the title. I keep hearing you gotta "beat the best". Well, lets get the best to the dance.

3 hours ago, rjs4470 said:

Seeding isn't about getting "chalk". It's about rewarding those teams who performed the best during the regular season. 

I will agree with you that the Sweet 16 isn't about getting the best 16 teams to play each other. Where we disagree, is that your state tournament should absolutely be about trying to get the 16 best teams to play for the title. I keep hearing you gotta "beat the best". Well, lets get the best to the dance.

What might be your objection to the Sweet 16 being about representing your area (region) of the state? 

We have the All ‘A’ Classic to help satisfy that “classes” desire that folks have, while also allowing Class ‘A’ teams who are good enough to play in the big dance. 

We have yearly high profile tournaments such as the King of the Bluegrass or the LIT where it’s loaded with the top rated teams in the state that help to wage who is the tops. 

What’s wrong with the current structure ensuring that you have teams representing each region of the state? 

It’s high school ball, and not to devalue that, but so many of these kids will not play past high school, and what’s wrong with having a long standing treasured event that’s been in effect for over 100 years, that has always somehow unified the state in a sense of community and excitement for every area large and small, rather than destroy its charm making it all about the 6th, 7th, 9th, and 11th regions which is how it would end up if going your route, and then much of the state would then lose interest, even me who resides in the 9th Region. 

We have something unique here in Kentucky, and something of cultural value rich with tradition. Mess with that, and it’s like taking a nice old victorian house and stripping it of its natural wood, and lowering it’s cathedral ceilings, turning it into a ho-hum tasteless piece of unstylish trash. 

On 3/11/2021 at 2:32 PM, The Professor said:

If one goes by the KHSAA RPI this will be the winners. I think it will hold true for the majority of the regions. A few regions are close, such as the 14th where I live. Hazard is a slim favorite but Knott Central, Breathitt County (regional site), Leslie County,  Wolfe County, and Perry Central are factors too. Second region is a difficult pick IMO because this is unfamiliar territory for favorite Lyon County. The  6th, 10th and 12th are also tough picks. 

Hazard vs Elizabethtown

Mason County vs Oldham County

Lexington Catholic vs Ballard

 Bowling Green vs Lyon County

Boyle County vs Johnson Central

 North Laurel vs Ashland Blazer 

DeSales vs McCracken County

Covington Catholic vs Muhlenberg County

GRC in 10th.