Stronger division over that last 10-15 yrs, A or AA

[westsider]

I agree, Watusi. The top echelon of A rivals that of 2A, but the advantage is with 2A the farther you travel down the list ... as it should be, with the enrollment disparity.

 

The bottom line ... 2A is probably weaker than it should be. It's closer to A than 3A, and that's what many people that staunchly defend 2A don't realize. The mere fact that we have an A-2A debate every year is a strong indication of that.

[Devilologists]

When Russell was AAA we had around 1200 kids in school. Ashland Oil moved out, CSX declined in workers, Armco steel sold to Kawasaki. We now have around 650 kids in school. Same doundries as before, all sided by Greenup Co., Raceland, Fairview,Boyd Co. and Ashland. Yea we are stuck in the middle of county schools, Independent schools and The City school of Ashland Blazer. The school boundries are like a pocket on a map around Flatwoods and Russell.

To say it best-McGlone said that "When you loose half of your students, it is hard to keep the same amount of athletes you had before, they are just not there."

But to say that AA is weaker now, is like apples to oranges. It is just different.

Why did these other schools change classifications. Student enrollment down, reclassification,,,, what. We have the same coaches and the same facilites as we did 29-30 years ago. Russell competed the same in both classes.

When I played you could not loose a regular season game to Belfry or Johnson Central or you would not make the playoffs. The system has changes to allow teams to get into the playoffs, not like when we were AAA, Does that make it weaker now,, whos to blame???? The system- Apples and Oranges, I say....

[Hatz]

I just don't understand how you can say A is better because of the fact that Danville and Mayfeild was in control of AA! During that period of time most of the recent AA winners were in AAA! It is hard to say that any class has been a power over the other based on the amount of movement in the different classes! A has changed so much in 10 to 15 years! Like wise with AA and AAA! I do feel as if AAAA may have less change than most, but I would have to researched that! All classes have changed so much! I wasn't trying to discredit you! I just think 10 or 15 years is a large period of time to compare!

 

 

I'm not sure why you are shouting at me (use of ! with every sentence).

 

All I did was point out some of my take. I'm not saying you have to agree.

 

You say "during that period of time most of the recent AA winners were in AAA." If your understanding of "recent" is the last 3 years then you are correct. If it's the last 10 or 15 (as the thread began with) then I'm not sure.

 

AA Champs

2005 Russell

2004 Belfry

2003 Belfry

2002 Breathitt

2001 Bardstown

2000 Boyle

1999 Boyle

1998 Caldwell

1997 Bourbon

1996 Breathitt

1995 Breathitt

1994 Danville

1993 Mayfield

1992 Danville

1991 Danville

1990 Fort Knox

 

Now I could be wrong but I only see two teams on this list (3 if you count Danville) that were once AAA. Bardstown was A at one time. Since Russell joined AA at least in '95 and Belfry in '99 it's interesting that neither played in a state title game in AA or won at title until Boyle, Lex Cath, Danville, and Mayfield were gone.

 

Just an observation.

[Hatz]

But to say that AA is weaker now, is like apples to oranges. It is just different.

 

 

Why did these other schools change classifications. Student enrollment down, reclassification,,,,

 

 

I agree with your first statement above. :thumb:

 

In answer to your last statement above the KHSAA mandated in '87 you could only play "up" one class from acutal enrollment. (Danville was AAA but really closer to an A sized school until '87.) In '99 KHSAA Mandated that everyone had to play in the class their enrollment actually was.

[BelfryJustice]

You still have to qualify what we are talking about before you can make a case either way in this debate.

 

Are we comparing the top 5 from each class? Top 15? The whole class? It makes all the difference in the world. Anyone who argues the case without knowing that is going into battle unarmed, IMO.

 

We have an anomaly in this state where, IMO, at least half of the time the Class A winner has been stronger than the Class AA winner. But to say that the entire class is stronger because their winner is stronger is a huge miscue if you ask me. There is just nothing to suggest that would be true and it is an illogical conclusion to assume it so.

 

I was looking at the entire class, but also used some data from the top 2 teams in each class! This is a thread that comes up every year and we will never have the answer unless they play! All things look good on paper but change once they are on the field! Most in AA will support AA and most in A will support A! I guess it make for good debate after the season is over and we have nothing else to talk about!

[Devilologists]

What is the cut-off for the classes now. I dont know that one.

[BelfryJustice]

I'm not sure why you are shouting at me (use of ! with every sentence).

 

All I did was point out some of my take. I'm not saying you have to agree.

 

You say "during that period of time most of the recent AA winners were in AAA." If your understanding of "recent" is the last 3 years then you are correct. If it's the last 10 or 15 (as the thread began with) then I'm not sure.

 

AA Champs

2005 Russell

2004 Belfry

2003 Belfry

2002 Breathitt

2001 Bardstown

2000 Boyle

1999 Boyle

1998 Caldwell

1997 Bourbon

1996 Breathitt

1995 Breathitt

1994 Danville

1993 Mayfield

1992 Danville

1991 Danville

1990 Fort Knox

 

Now I could be wrong but I only see two teams on this list (3 if you count Danville) that were once AAA. Bardstown was A at one time. Since Russell joined AA at least in '95 and Belfry in '99 it's interesting that neither played in a state title game in AA or won at title until Boyle, Lex Cath, Danville, and Mayfield were gone.

 

Just an observation.

 

I hate to tell you but you are wrong! Breathitt was in our district in AAA for many years, but was one on the first to move down to AA! They go to AA and win three titles. Boyle is now AAA! I am not sure how you can say that about Danville, Mayfield and Lex Cath since they never won a AA after 94 well before most of these teams went to AA! That would make 6 times in the last ten years that a former AAA won the AA title!

 

This would be shouting!!!!!!!!!!!! I have never read any rule that says you cannot use !.

[o-line]

I was looking at the entire class, but also used some data from the top 2 teams in each class! This is a thread that comes up every year and we will never have the answer unless they play! All things look good on paper but change once they are on the field! Most in AA will support AA and most in A will support A! I guess it make for good debate after the season is over and we have nothing else to talk about!

 

:thumb: And a heated debate, no less! But I don't see the KHSAA supporting any form of an A/AA playoff system anytime soon, so I imagine we'll have to continue with agreeing to disagree.

[Admiral 4 Life]

Very good point! I also remember Belfry going to a state game after a defeat of Danville while they were both 3A in the 80's!

 

 

Which is why I also included on a neutral or "controlled" playing surface. We win that game by two TDs in any other non-tampered with surface in the state. Playing on a good field surface in 1993 was more indicitave of what that match up would normally be like

 

PS Danville was close to being a single A sized school at that time, and you had to do what you did to win. Don't beat your chest too hard.

[Hatz]

 

This would be shouting!!!!!!!!!!!! I have never read any rule that says you cannot use !.

 

 

The greatest rule of all would say you use them too much. Grammar teaches us to only use them as "exclamation points."

 

:thumb:

[Hatz]

Which is why I also included on a neutral or "controlled" playing surface. We win that game by two TDs in any other non-tampered with surface in the state. Playing on a good field surface in 1993 was more indicitave of what that match up would normally be like

 

PS Danville was close to being a single A sized school at that time, and you had to do what you did to win. Don't beat your chest too hard.

 

 

My thoughts exactly and I'm glad you brought that up. :thumb:

 

It's a trip I'll never forget.

[BelfryJustice]

Which is why I also included on a neutral or "controlled" playing surface. We win that game by two TDs in any other non-tampered with surface in the state. Playing on a good field surface in 1993 was more indicitave of what that match up would normally be like

 

PS Danville was close to being a single A sized school at that time, and you had to do what you did to win. Don't beat your chest too hard.

 

The 1993 game was the worst team that Belfry has had in 25 years and was the best Danville team of all time! It was the first game of the year also and Danville was load! You don't need to act as if it was any other way! Belfry would have given a good game to Danville the last three years on any field! You need to get ove rthe field thing! Belfry and Danville both had a great team in 85!~

[Hatz]

The 1993 game was the worst team that Belfry has had in 25 years and was the best Danville team of all time! It was the first game of the year also and Danville was load! You don't need to act as if it was any other way! Belfry would have given a good game to Danville the last three years on any field! You need to get ove rthe field thing! Belfry and Danville both had a great team in 85!~

 

 

Actually the year was 1986.

[o-line]

Which is why I also included on a neutral or "controlled" playing surface. We win that game by two TDs in any other non-tampered with surface in the state. Playing on a good field surface in 1993 was more indicitave of what that match up would normally be like

 

PS Danville was close to being a single A sized school at that time, and you had to do what you did to win. Don't beat your chest too hard.

 

 

So you mean that real football is only played on an artificial surface, inside a dome that's climate controlled? :lol: Let's hope that Arena football retains it niche, and the sport we love is still played outdoors in all weather conditions for many years to come! :thumb: It will be a sad day when it becomes a touch game played only in good weather conditions or indoors. :cry: I only hope our children can prevent that from happening, although I realize there is a lot of support from parents who believe their children will suffer injuries if the game, as played today, isn't changed to a non-contact sport! :irked:

[Watusi]

Allow me to elaborate, o-line. OSA was referring to a game played at Belfry during the 86 playoffs where the field was very sloppy and muddy and it is widely believed that it was not a result of Mother Nature.