Who are the top volleyball programs in the Bluegrass State?

[dallaslaredo]

The only sport worse than volleyball in regards to championships is boys swimming.

 

While it is is true that more girls are playing club volleyball I'd be curious to see how those numbers are dispersed throughout the entire state. You need population and that limits much of the state for strong club programs.

 

I don't see the Louisville dominance with the occasional NDA strong effort from ending any time soon.

 

It won't end anytime soon, if at all, without rules changes...like moving to classes from a single class.... or limiting the number of players from the same club team that can be on the same HS team (Ohio does this). Rules changes are hard to push through.

 

The State Championship would require an overhaul... The easiest place to start would be to let both the Regional winner and runner-up advance and then play 1 extra round before state to trim it from 32 to 16 teams. That would eliminate the weakest of the weak and allow for 2 teams to go to State from the deeper Regions. Would instantly make the level of play at the State Tourney better, and would likely raise attendance.

[Oldbird]

The only sport worse than volleyball in regards to championships is boys swimming.

 

Girls swimming isn't much if any better.

[Jim Schue]

Something else to consider is that the metro areas of Ky — L'ville, Lex and NoKy — have been playing volleyball for decades longer than most other schools in Ky. When most Ky schools started VB, or started taking it seriously, they were already decades of development in the hole.

 

Same phenomena that afflicts Ky HS FB. Schools that have been doing it for 100 or more years are naturally going to have a leg up over schools that have just been doing it for 45 years. In VB's case, it's schools that have been playing for 35 years opposed to those playing for 15-20.

[VBallBlue]

Until the rest of the state takes the sport seriously, they will never be able to compete with the Louisville/NKY/Lexington schools. Club volleyball--really good club volleyball--is practically non-existent outside these three areas. These girls live, breathe, and eat volleyball year round from 1st and 2nd grade. School ball, lessons, club ball, lessons, rinse, repeat. The play is entirely at another level. If you don't believe it, or experienced it, you should go to a major club tourney somewhere and watch an Open class match. That is the level most of these girls have played since the start. Go online and watch video of the state tourney and watch Assumption or Mercy's bench dismantle an opponent.

 

I've had daughters playing club for years, and have seen it time and again. Clubs outside of the major metropolitan areas of KY just don't compete at the same level. 10/11 year old Louisville teams killing 12 /13 year old teams from clubs out in the state. School volleyball is about the same. I too have watched as an opponent team couldn't get underhanded serves over the net. They then proceed to get drilled--It isn't pretty. This is true when they are playing one of the Big 4, or one of the many other decent schools from the same areas.

 

People say lets go to classes, but then, more than likely, your class winners are going to be the smaller private schools that can't get past the Big 4--Presentation, St Henry, CAL, New Cath, Brossart, Bethlehem... Heck, based on enrollment, Mercy would probably be a 2A. Losing makes people unhappy and classes won't make those people happy. Adding regional runners-up would make them even unhappier.

 

The end result, I believe, is that the rest of the KHSAA will eventually vote to split. It's been on the table before and it'll be there again. Then you'll have a private tourney winner, and a public winner who now has a shiny trophy that represents not that they were the best, but that the rules were changed because they couldn't compete.

 

Not trying to belittle anyone or be mean--just stating the facts as I've seen them over the years.

[Sandman32]

Lots of great points in this thread. I agree with most of them. Club volleyball drives high school volleyball, and Club volleyball starts in elementary school. Until a large public school district's parents are willing to approach sports with the same intensity and emphasis that Louisville does at those ages it will be rinse and repeat for the state championship. Educators are not sports visionaries, at least not in the sense of creating sports dynasties like the Ron Kordes's of the world. Their goal is to create increased participation and parity in all sports so that kids stay in school and out of trouble. They measure reputable seasons by district, region or conference championships.

 

The "All A" state championship that the little schools like Saint Henry and Holy Cross love to claim when they win is probably the closest thing to a class system of volleyball we will get and as long as that tournament keeps being held I don't see any changes by the KHSAA to anything.

[VBallBlue]

Speaking of the All A Classic--here's the list of winners since inception. 7 champions so far--6 private Catholic schools.

 

2009 Lou Holy Cross

2010 Caldwell Cnty

2011 Cov Holy Cross

2012 St Henry

2013 St Henry

2014 St Henry

2015 Presentation

[dallaslaredo]

Speaking of the All A Classic--here's the list of winners since inception. 7 champions so far--6 private Catholic schools.

 

2009 Lou Holy Cross

2010 Caldwell Cnty

2011 Cov Holy Cross

2012 St Henry

2013 St Henry

2014 St Henry

2015 Presentation

 

That shows that classes won't change things, private schools will just dominate in any class.

 

Also shows how weak of a tournament the All A is every year. The only team to win their KHSAA Region from that list was Caldwell County in 2010.

[Sandman32]

That shows that classes won't change things, private schools will just dominate in any class.

 

Also shows how weak of a tournament the All A is every year. The only team to win their KHSAA Region from that list was Caldwell County in 2010.

 

I don't know if it shows how weak the tournament is. It does show that the purpose of the tournament is being fullfilled. It's hard to argue that small schools should be placed on the same playing field for state playoffs as large schools, especially when you consider the public/private debate of it. Here's the enrollment figures of the big 4 as they pertain to the winners of the All-A Classic.

 

Assumption 861 girls

Sacred Heart 842 Girls

Mercy 547 Girls

Notre Dame 588 Girls

 

St. Henry 288 Girls

Holy Cross Cov 174 Girls

Holy Cross Lou 91 girls

Caldwell County 297 girls

Presentation 253 Girls

 

Villa Madonna 88 girls, (I'd like to have seen the group of girls play who won state for them. True David and Goliath stuff.)

 

You can make a mcu easier argument against the bigger public schools IMO

Ryle 907 girls

Cooper 610 Girls

Conner 677

SK 847

Scott 451

Dixie 664

CC 778

Highlands 498

[Thor of Asgard]

I don't know if it shows how weak the tournament is. It does show that the purpose of the tournament is being fullfilled. It's hard to argue that small schools should be placed on the same playing field for state playoffs as large schools, especially when you consider the public/private debate of it. Here's the enrollment figures of the big 4 as they pertain to the winners of the All-A Classic.

 

Assumption 861 girls

Sacred Heart 842 Girls

Mercy 547 Girls

Notre Dame 588 Girls

 

St. Henry 288 Girls

Holy Cross Cov 174 Girls

Holy Cross Lou 91 girls

Caldwell County 297 girls

Presentation 253 Girls

 

Villa Madonna 88 girls, (I'd like to have seen the group of girls play who won state for them. True David and Goliath stuff.)

 

You can make a mcu easier argument against the bigger public schools IMO

Ryle 907 girls

Cooper 610 Girls

Conner 677

SK 847

Scott 451

Dixie 664

CC 778

Highlands 498

 

For volleyball in the state of Kentucky, enrollment means nothing. It's all about the club teams and where their handlers/parents send them in Louisville. The state champion is determined during the Louisville regionals, the Sweet 16 is nothing but a chance to crown one of the two Louisville schools. Notre Dame has also lost ground because of all the coaching turmoil/parental interference in recent years that cost them a very good coach.

 

Huge schools like Henderson County are not competitive in volleyball because no one in that part of the state takes the sport seriously. If you have attended the state tournament, you have no doubt seen the mountain schools which have players still serving underhand to get it in play, and that's just an easy spike for the Louisville schools. There is no way to fix a sport when only two and a half regions (the 9th is the half because of Notre Dame) take it seriously. I would say forget the idea of a Sweet 16 statewide tournament and make it a 8-team Governor's Cup type of deal and invite the top 3 teams from each Louisville region, Notre Dame, and one at-large team from the state based on their overall record and strength of schedule. That at-large team will still get trounced by the Louisville schools, but at least they were invited.

[bip]

Cost them a good coach? Lost ground?

 

They went to the state finals in the new coach's first year and the semis the next year. They finished ranked in the top 20 nationally both years under his tenure. Most schools in the nation would like to lose that kind of ground.

[FeelingGood]

Cost them a good coach? Lost ground?

 

They went to the state finals in the new coach's first year and the semis the next year. They finished ranked in the top 20 nationally both years under his tenure. Most schools in the nation would like to lose that kind of ground.

 

NDA I will agree had some very high caliber players over the last few year and I would have to say, even a mediocre coach could have done that well with they talent they had.

 

I think the turmoil has a lot to do with coaches from one particular club trying to turn their high school teams into breeding grounds for their club programs. Pretty ingenious if you ask me.

[VBallBlue]

 

I think the turmoil has a lot to do with coaches from one particular club trying to turn their high school teams into breeding grounds for their club programs. Pretty ingenious if you ask me.

 

How do you suppose the HS coaches supplement their income? "Well you know, if you don't play at XYZ Club, of might have a more difficult time competing for a roster spot at ABC High School......".

It's a fact that a new coach at a certain school in the Louisville area flat told his players that they could not take private lessons with anyone not connected to a certain club that might have been struggling in the last few years. Most aren't as blatant as that, but it happens everywhere. Note the rise of TriState at the expense of NKYVC at the younger ages. Some of the older kids showed some loyalty to the old club, but the younger ones will follow the coach--whether coerced or just influenced. I'm really surprised though at the number of parents/players that fall into that trap. If you're that good, the smart coach will not cut you. And, if they're dumb enough to do so, what's the effect? Nothing. If you're good enough to play at the next level, club is your ticket to a scholly--not high school ball.

But that's a thread for another day.

[VBallBlue]

Also shows how weak of a tournament the All A is every year. The only team to win their KHSAA Region from that list was Caldwell County in 2010.

 

I'd have to disagree somewhat with this. The All A is really almost a mirror image of the KHSAA tourney. You have certain schools from certain areas that dominate, and schools from other areas that look like they dressed the softball team to play volleyball to kill some time.

The good teams at All A have some good players that play at various clubs and it shows. They just don't have as many of the good players to compete with the BiG 4. If you could move these schools to other regions, they'd be going to state each year. Every once in awhile, an out in the state school will do well--Caldwell County--but once those players are gone, they will drop back down. The in constant denominators not both tourneys is private schools with club players.

[Sandman32]

I'm still waiting to hear who the good coach NDA lost is and their lackluster replacement?

 

As far as HS coaches saying silly things I heard that last year one NKY coach told their kids that all of them needed to play for Crush volleyball if they wanted to play for said coach. Needless to say I think the coach forgot about that when the season started.

 

My final series of observations this morning.... Parents are lemmings, especially parochial school parents. Most of them migrated to Tri-State on their own with very little prompting because they thought it would be good for their child's chances of making their future high school team, and because all their friends or frenemies were doing it. (Can't let someone else get a leg up on little Janie!)

 

The older kids didn't show loyalty. They had invitations to come back to their current clubs and did.

 

And speaking just on NKY, if you don't believe their is a difference between the amount of talent on a yearly basis at a school with 288 vs 588 then I can't help you. Yes it only takes 8 or 9 really good girls to win at the varsity level, but have you seen the kids playing 14-17 club levels at TSE, NKYVC, NKJV, or ? Where are all these studs going to come from when you consider the size of the region and its school districts, and the fact that a good portion of those premier players are Cincinnati kids? NKY is lucky to have the parity it does.

 

NDA may dominate the number of regional titles for our area, but there are several public schools which are going to pose a serious challenge this season. And several have posed serious challenges in the past. People may like to say that NDA walks through the 9th region, but in a normal year without a player like Morgan Hence on the roster, its a little more complicated than that.

[FeelingGood]

I'm still waiting to hear who the good coach NDA lost is and their lackluster replacement?

 

As far as HS coaches saying silly things I heard that last year one NKY coach told their kids that all of them needed to play for Crush volleyball if they wanted to play for said coach. Needless to say I think the coach forgot about that when the season started.

 

My final series of observations this morning.... Parents are lemmings, especially parochial school parents. Most of them migrated to Tri-State on their own with very little prompting because they thought it would be good for their child's chances of making their future high school team, and because all their friends or frenemies were doing it. (Can't let someone else get a leg up on little Janie!)

 

The older kids didn't show loyalty. They had invitations to come back to their current clubs and did.

 

And speaking just on NKY, if you don't believe their is a difference between the amount of talent on a yearly basis at a school with 288 vs 588 then I can't help you. Yes it only takes 8 or 9 really good girls to win at the varsity level, but have you seen the kids playing 14-17 club levels at TSE, NKYVC, NKJV, or ? Where are all these studs going to come from when you consider the size of the region and its school districts, and the fact that a good portion of those premier players are Cincinnati kids? NKY is lucky to have the parity it does.

 

NDA may dominate the number of regional titles for our area, but there are several public schools which are going to pose a serious challenge this season. And several have posed serious challenges in the past. People may like to say that NDA walks through the 9th region, but in a normal year without a player like Morgan Hence on the roster, its a little more complicated than that.

 

I'll agree with most of what you said with exception to what I've placed in bold. When you hear 1st hand from a parent that they were told their daughter wasn't going to play at NDA unless they switched, then the rest of the parents follow.