All A State Tournament---Should True All A Schools withdraw from Tourney??

[*Wooderson]

If I coached at a small school and all of a sudden all the other schools in the 14th region were in the All A, I would boycott it. Why not just wait and play them all in the regular regional tournament.

[Hearsay]

Guys, no matter where you set the line, you are always going to have teams at the top edge of Class A who flirt with being over the top to AA once in a while. Bardstown is a good example. I doubt very seriously whether schools are artificially "limiting" their enrollment numbers just so they can stay down and qualify (or "weasel" as some have put it) for the All A tournament. This is a nice tournament. You may have some arguments for public-private, but school size is getting pretty far afield. That dog won't hunt.

[Buck Master]

The All A tournament has a larger enrollment number than the KHSAA. The All A is run by Touchstone Energy and have their own guidelines. Larger 2A schools will not meet their criteria. Not participating in it would rob your children of a Lifetime experience. My son at a true All A school, Pikeville, has played in it both years in baseball. It is not an invitational as someone mentioned. It is the same format as the regular state tourney. It is different from the 5/3 rd in that it is an invitational not a play-in tournament by region. Until 2 years ago it was an invitational tournament and didnt have the same flair. My son would not take anything for the experiences he has had in that tournament. It was awesome. We were in the Final Four both years.

 

In the mountains their is usually very little difference in a A and AA schools. Dont boycott this tournament it is FIRST CLASS all the way.

[Theoldguy]

The All A tournament has a larger enrollment number than the KHSAA. The All A is run by Touchstone Energy and have their own guidelines. Larger 2A schools will not meet their criteria. Not participating in it would rob your children of a Lifetime experience. My son at a true All A school, Pikeville, has played in it both years in baseball. It is not an invitational as someone mentioned. It is the same format as the regular state tourney. It is different from the 5/3 rd in that it is an invitational not a play-in tournament by region. Until 2 years ago it was an invitational tournament and didnt have the same flair. My son would not take anything for the experiences he has had in that tournament. It was awesome. We were in the Final Four both years.

 

In the mountains their is usually very little difference in a A and AA schools. Dont boycott this tournament it is FIRST CLASS all the way.

 

 

I really don't think Touchstone Energy runs the Tournament, but they do sponsor it and do a great job of it. You are correct in that it is not a invitiational tournament as you must win to get in. I guess my complaint is that this was started by a group of small Northern Kentucky Schools who were willing to put up the time and money way back when, and now that it has gotten successful, a bunch Johhny come latelys want to chance it to suit them. Btw I think it was a lot longer than just two years ago that it switched from a invite to the present system, but I am not for sure......

 

The All Class "A" is a great little tournament and should stay in the same format, and in fact I am hoping that it comes homes to Northern Kentucky for a least a year when the new Bank of Kentucky Arena at NKU opens up, if for no other reason to say thank you to the men and schools who started this tournament years and years ago......

[kissinger]

I really don't think Touchstone Energy runs the Tournament, but they do sponsor it and do a great job of it. You are correct in that it is not a invitiational tournament as you must win to get in. I guess my complaint is that this was started by a group of small Northern Kentucky Schools who were willing to put up the time and money way back when, and now that it has gotten successful, a bunch Johhny come latelys want to chance it to suit them. Btw I think it was a lot longer than just two years ago that it switched from a invite to the present system, but I am not for sure......

 

The All Class "A" is a great little tournament and should stay in the same format, and in fact I am hoping that it comes homes to Northern Kentucky for a least a year when the new Bank of Kentucky Arena at NKU opens up, if for no other reason to say thank you to the men and schools who started this tournament years and years ago......

The All A IS an invitational. Russellville and others, opted not to enter the regionals years ago. It is their choice. Now the State event is not an invitational, but the region is. Frankly, Touchstone doesn't manage it, a former AD in Northern Kentucky does. And he doesn't want to change the numbers. Historically, 425 was the cutoff for Class A football the year the All A basketball started, that's why they used the number. Then the KHSAA went to 9-12 numbers and the Class A never changed, they stayed with 425 for grades 9-12. Seems to me like you could simply say that the top boundary for A is the highest enrollment of a Class A football school and let it go at that. But that probably makes way too much sense.

 

btw,

boycotts don't work and only penalize kids while adults take their ball and go home. Just ask the Lexington public schools (or the W KY schools in the mid 1990s).

[Pat Man]

In the 14th region, word has it that knott central is eligible to be in the tourney next year......possibly Leslie, Breathitt and Estill is close.

My question is this.....Should and will True all A schools withdraw from the tournament? Is it doing what it should be designed to do?

Knott Central has a total enrollment of 650. If they are eligible, under the current guidelines, they would have to have a freshman class of 226 or more.

Certain schools hide some of their sophomores into the freshman class first semester to get eligible because they only count grades 10-12 for a total enrollment of 425. 2nd semester these so called 2nd year freshman then bump up to their true status of sophomores.

 

If a school has 226 freshman they are NOT an All A school.

I would call for all true all a schools to withdraw from the all AA tournamnet (pun intended for AA).

Maybe we could rent Morehead state and have a true state tournament for the all A schools.

 

 

First of all Knott Central has an enrolment of 618 students....second KCC dids not ask to be considered as an All A school, We were told we were eligible to play in the ALL A 14th Region Tournament: SO WE WILL! As far as insinuating we hid students WE DID NOT and I challange you to prove it! Evidently you must have experience in juggling numbers!

[Buck Master]

The All A IS an invitational.

The All A is not invitational. Go to the website http://www.allaclassic.org and you will get the information you guys are confused on. Get the facts straight. They have their own numbers for eligibility, not KHSAA numbers. You can opt not to participate but you cant opt to play, you must meet their criteria.

 

Patman, you should play if you are eligible and good luck.

[dahorn]

First of all Knott Central has an enrolment of 618 students....second KCC dids not ask to be considered as an All A school, We were told we were eligible to play in the ALL A 14th Region Tournament: SO WE WILL! As far as insinuating we hid students WE DID NOT and I challange you to prove it! Evidently you must have experience in juggling numbers!

 

 

 

 

From everything I have heard, that is exactly what happened. The All A powers that be look over all of the numbers every year and this year, they discovered that KCC did, in fact, qualify and they contacted KCC about playing. So, they approached Knott.

 

Once again, being from Buckhorn, we would prefer to play schools our size in the All A, but we don't make the rules. All we can do is go by them and play whomever we have to play. Do, I think it's fair? Not necessarily. Should our team be punished by boycotting such an outstanding event? Definitely not, in my opinion.

 

Again, and i have said this before, my problem lies in the fact that the 14th region winner will have to play 3 - 4 games just to get to Richmond, while other regions are only required to play two. I would like to see some type of regulation that would balance out all of the regions to fix that problem. I may be way off base with that thought, but that's my feeling on it.

[1owlzfan]

Absolutely agreed!! If there are potentially only 4 schools in the 14th region withheld, what's the point with the All A Tourney at all? Seems pretty pointless to me to have 2 regional tourneys at just different times of the year. True All A schools should should take a stand!!

 

 

Exactly!!! Why would you do this! With this amount of teams you would have to go to district tournaments first. If they do this, and the true all a schools have the guts to do it, they should pull out of the all a tournament and tell them to shove it!!!!

[Theoldguy]

If you don't like what they are doing meaning the All "A" then make up your own Tournrament. Of course that won't happen, because it is easier to sit on the sidelines and complain then to step up to the plate and do the work using your own money and working for free for years to do something just for the kids of the Commonwealth.

 

BTW before the All "A" what did the small/middle schools have in the line of a basketball tourenament. The answer is simple NOTHING............

[statmanhensley]

I think something is totally wrong when a school the size of Owensboro Catholic gets into the tournament. They have enrollment figures of over 700 students. I just wonder how in the world is that "small school" material.

 

Please note that this is not a knock on OCHS. If a team is given the option to play in then they should. I am just stating that the guidelines for who qualify are a little fishy.

[HDE]

You must remember that the KHSAA has nothing to do with this event except to approve of it. The All "A" Tournament was started by some AD's from Northern Kentucky and they made up the rules as to what they thought the "A" school should be and have never used to the best of my knowledge the KHSAA Football "A" numbers.

 

If I am wrong about any of this sorry, but I truly believe I am correct.

 

 

We've been through this many times before.

 

The All "A" Classic started as a statewide tournament in 1990. The Class A numbers for high school football teams at that time, according to the KHSAA, was 425 students in grades 10-12. The All "A" Classic people used those same numbers for the All "A" Classic.

 

The KHSAA has made numerous adjustments since then, including using 9-12 numbers, but the All "A" Classic has made no adjustments.

[westsider]

I think something is totally wrong when a school the size of Owensboro Catholic gets into the tournament. They have enrollment figures of over 700 students. I just wonder how in the world is that "small school" material.

 

Please note that this is not a knock on OCHS. If a team is given the option to play in then they should. I am just stating that the guidelines for who qualify are a little fishy.

Owensboro Catholic's enrollment is in the 500s in four grades, and has been for at least two or three years. If memory serves, Owensboro Catholic hasn't been over 700 for several years.

[westsider]

The All A is not invitational. Go to the website http://www.allaclassic.org and you will get the information you guys are confused on. Get the facts straight. They have their own numbers for eligibility, not KHSAA numbers. You can opt not to participate but you cant opt to play, you must meet their criteria.

The All A Classic is a giant invitational tournament at the regional level. You have to be invited to play in the tournament to participate.

[BGGreen]

Owensboro Catholic's enrollment is in the 500s in four grades, and has been for at least two or three years. If memory serves, Owensboro Catholic hasn't been over 700 for several years.

 

Thanks for clearing that up westsider! I was sitting here trying to figure how they had somewhere in the vicinity of 300 freshmen at a 700 student school??