Does success in football drive increased revenue in independent school programs? Do you think tuition enrollments would be as high if football did not exist? Would the same level of donations be there if football did not exist?

 

There are a ton more kids that pay tuition to go to HHS for academics than football.

Does success in football drive increased revenue in independent school programs? Do you think tuition enrollments would be as high if football did not exist? Would the same level of donations be there if football did not exist?

That is a great question!

I do know for some schools the revenue was there long before the football program for instance was succesful. Beechwood for instance has as long as I can remember always been one of the best academic schools in the area. I went there although at the time I was a freshman would rather of gone to CCH where all my friends were going. But once there I wouldn't of traded those 4 years for anything. Great education and was the donations were there before success of sports although once the football program started wininng titles I'm sure donations were increased lol. Unfortunatley for me the Football program didn't see their 1st state championship until the year after I graduated when the team went undefeated in 1984.

 

 

I think enrollment is more affected by academics rather than sports. I would wager that more out of ddistrict kids go to CCH for example for the acedemiccs than they do for sports.

Okay, so they do it with numbers then, right? No other choices to go anywhere else. And aren't they pretty close to Lexington?? HHS isn't close to SK (15-18 miles away) and they complain about HHS taking players. Wouldn't some of SC's district border on or near Lexington schools?? Also, explain Boyle Co's success then? There are plenty of other programs with the same examples.

 

I'm not aware of SK losing any players to HHS. I bet CC has lost plenty though. Scott County is pretty rural and isolated from the Lexington area schools. It is what Kenton Co. would be if there was only one High School. Scott has the enrollment of SK and Dixie combined and no one there to compete with. Now, if you are not competing for your own talent, enrollment becomes more significant.

You're talking to the wrong guy about money. I went to HHS, played football and lived in an apartment all my life. Not because I was a transfer, but because my mom was a single parent. We didn't have a car and had to make sure we lived on a bus line so my mom could get to both her jobs to allow us to stay at HHS. (and yes I walked up hill both ways to school). I'm telling you things because there are countless examples of that at HHS. It's not all sunshine and rainbows for all the kids that go to HHS. Yes, there is some money in the city, but there are very well off families in every school. Just like there are MANY families that struggle...yes, even in Ft Thomas! They do what they have to do because they want to be a part of the community and create the best enviroment for thier children. Get off the money things. Drives me nuts!

 

RRC9 is not lying, because when he dated my sister guess who had to drive them to the movies? :irked: :lol:

RRC9 is not lying, because when he dated my sister guess who had to drive them to the movies? :irked: :lol:

You didn't drive me to the movies when I dated your sister :sssh:

 

 

j/k

don't kill me

Actually Danville is far better than that vs. Highlands. In my memory Danville defeated the Birds in '77, '86, '87 and '03.

Highlands is 4-4-1* against Danville.

 

*Ironic number, ain't it?

ALL things being equal Size DOES matter!

 

but ALL things are not equal. Coaching and support matter more than size.

 

If Highlands, Mayfield, Belfry and plenty of others suddenly had 1400 boys in their school to choose from to go with current support and coaching they would be side by side with Trinity and X

but if "Struggling County High School" (didn't want to call any bad schools out) suddenly had 1400 boys with current coaching and support they would still be a struggling program.

 

It has more to do with Quality of The Program than the size of the programs.

It matters at the top 6A and at the bottom 1A more so than any of the other classes IMO because that's where you'll see the greatest disparity in the numbers.

I get your private school reasoning, but have never understood your independent school argument. Seems like you always attach independent schools to good schools that have an advantage over others. Yet I see Newport, Ludlow, Bellevue, Dayton,Erlanger Lloyd out there. Why don't you ever bring up those INDEPENDENT schools when making this argument??

 

Because that would prove that being an independent school system means nothing when it comes to being good at football. Independent school systems have district boundaries, just like county schools. All schools take tuition students. Fort Thomas schools actually closed its doors this year to tuition students. There is a major difference between independent and private schools.

ALL things being equal Size DOES matter!

 

but ALL things are not equal. Coaching and support matter more than size.

 

If Highlands, Mayfield, Belfry and plenty of others suddenly had 1400 boys in their school to choose from to go with current support and coaching they would be side by side with Trinity and X

but if "Struggling County High School" (didn't want to call any bad schools out) suddenly had 1400 boys with current coaching and support they would still be a struggling program.

 

It has more to do with Quality of The Program than the size of the programs.

Bingo!!!!! We have a winner!!!!!!!!!

 

Quality of program is the key!

I know that HHS draws a lot from a great pee wee football league from the Red Devils. Beechwood and Cov Cath used to have a great stream of athletes from the Spartan program etc. When High Schools work and are involved with the little leagues then the program with good coaches will succeed more times than not.

 

In Boone County in the last couple years Ryle and Cooper started their own teams to compete at the 7th and 8th grade levels for example and are encouraged to run similar schemes so when they get to HS level they are familiar with the program.

This can only help those teams in the future.

Enrollment doesn't near as much as the make up of the community(s) that feed the schools.

 

Take some of your 1A-4A "county" schools. A vast majority of them don't really draw from the county as much as they do the county seat/town the school is located in.

 

So, with saying that, you essentially have a school of let's say 700 total (w/ a 3A boys enrollment) with the following demographic information:

-County Seat/Biggest town in the county has 2,500 people

-Total county population is 13,000

-90% of your roster is made up of kids who live within 5 miles of the county seat (where the school is located)

-You have an enrollment of 700 total kids w/ a boys enrollment that makes you 3A, yet you only draw kids from the main town.

.....you are essentially a 1A Football program playing in 3A.

 

There is a reason that your Independent schools have been and always will be your best football schools (not counting Privates), and I'm not counting Jefferson County and/or Fayette County schools, even though they are basically like Independents due to the make up of their communties.

 

Think about it (from West to East):

 

Paducah Tilghman

Mayfield

Murray

Owensboro

Bowling Green

Glasgow

Bardstown

Beechwood

Highlands

Frankfort

Danville

Somerset

Corbin

Middlesboro

Pikeville

Ashland

 

I know I left some off.

 

But, I guess what I'm getting to is that merger/consolidation of some of these smaller communities years back hurt a lot of football programs across the state. They took all of the little schools in the county and merged them with the one school who actually had football. In general, the non football playing schools in the county didn't care about it then, and they don't care about it now (thus, causing these new county schools to not get any kids from these areas; still probably due to them being heavy farming communities and/or travel being an issue).

 

Now, you take the likes of:

Scott County HS (Georgetown, KY w/ 29,000),

Henderson County HS (Henderson, KY w/ 28,000),

Warren Central HS, Warren East HS, Greenwood and South Warren HS (Bowling Green, KY w/ 59,000 and Warren County w/ 113,000 as a whole)

John Hardin HS, North Hardin HS, Central Hardin HS (Elizabethtown, Radcliff and Ft. Knox with all close to 30,000 in each)

...not to mention the Jefferson County, Fayette County and NKY (Boone, Campbell and Kenton County Schools which has become it's own Metropolitan type area itself) and you have a whole different situation on your hands.

 

Granted, I know, there are exceptions to every rule, but these type of statistics in my mind are a huge reason behind the haves and have nots. Quite honestly, more than most of us want to actually admit.

Edited October 29, 201213 yr by Harry Doyle

Highlands is 4-4-1* against Danville.

 

*Ironic number, ain't it?

 

Thanks. I knew I could count on you for the record numbers.

So the answer to the question is yes, no, maybe, a little bit.

In the end, coaching and tradition has more to do with the success of a program than anything else. Why do kids want to play for HHS? Simply because of the success rate. If they didn't have great coaching then kids would look elsewhere if they could.

 

You can have the largest groupd of athletes in the area but without good coaching you will not draw much from outside the school district.

It all starts with coaching.

 

Just in the area, who are the top programs? Last i checked, 6A in NKY were among the weakest of teams this year, who were the best teams? from smaller schools, 4A and 5A. Numbers are the among the smaller criteria for being succesful.

Harry - If you have a 3A boys enrollment, you're a 3A school. Where they come from doesn't make any difference. You talk about this sprawling NKY metro area as if it's the suburbs of New York. And you're forgetting that our little metro area here is divided among 21 football schools.