I've always found that people that are optimist are more fun to be around than those who are the constant pessimist.

Amazing how some here equate realism with pessimism ...

Great point, he hits in bunches.

 

This day and age, people want to leave the little things out of the discussion. Like batting average, stolen bases, being able to bunt, being able to hit a sac fly, having the ability to take away hits and being able to throw out runners (assist). These are all the things I think Dunn struggles with, and has not gotten any better at.

 

I love the home runs, but over a years time, the ability to do these other things better will help the team.

 

I'll give up some avg points if the guy is a run producer in both knocking them in and having a high OBP and SLG%.

 

He's not in the lineup to bunt.

 

He's not in the lineup to steal bases. Unless you're over 75%, stealing bases are not worth the risk.

 

His defense has actually been pretty solid this year.

I didn't make up the numbers either. I'm talking about you failed to mentioned that the numbers you posted were for both leagues, and not NL only.

 

I understand, but why leave out half of league, except the fact it doesn't help your position? Doesn't matter I'm not going to change your favorable position on Dunn. Nor will you change my not so favorable opionion on the guy. When they get to the playoffs, and Dunn is on the team, I will gladly succumb. Problem is you refuse to make the same concession. That doesn't seem quite right.

Amazing how some here equate realism with pessimism ...

 

:sssh:They don't get it:thumb:

I'll give up some avg points if the guy is a run producer in both knocking them in and having a high OBP and SLG%.

 

He's not in the lineup to bunt.

 

He's not in the lineup to steal bases. Unless you're over 75%, stealing bases are not worth the risk.

 

His defense has actually been pretty solid this year.

 

And you will continue to watch a losing ball club.

I understand, but why leave out half of league, except the fact it doesn't help your position? Doesn't matter I'm not going to change your favorable position on Dunn. Nor will you change my not so favorable opionion on the guy. When they get to the playoffs, and Dunn is on the team, I will gladly succumb. Problem is you refuse to make the same concession. That doesn't seem quite right.

 

Adam Dunn is not the reason Cincinnati hasn't made the playoffs in a while. Lack of pitching has been the problem in recent years. This year the offense hasn't exactly been steller. Dunn gets on base at a great percentage, simple as that. He can't help it if the guys around him don't get him in. But when all is said and done, pitching wins championships....Cincinnati is finally developing some pitching and we'll see the benefits sooner rather than later.

I understand, but why leave out half of league, except the fact it doesn't help your position? Doesn't matter I'm not going to change your favorable position on Dunn. Nor will you change my not so favorable opionion on the guy. When they get to the playoffs, and Dunn is on the team, I will gladly succumb. Problem is you refuse to make the same concession. That doesn't seem quite right.

 

 

I have no problem with you including both leages, but I was under the impression the numbers you gave were for NL only, and I'm sure others were too. What concession are you wanting me to make?

Amazing how some here equate realism with pessimism ...

 

 

So are you saying that there aren't any more Pete Rose's or Mike Piazza's out there in minor league systems? And by that I mean players that most scouts aren't high on, but yet they will still turn out be perennial All-Stars?

I have no problem with you including both leages, but I was under the impression the numbers you gave were for NL only, and I'm sure others were too. What concession are you wanting me to make?

 

That so far the Reds have failed with Dunn, and there is really no reason to think they will succeed with him. I'd throw Jr in here also, but everyone seems to agree he needs to go.

Adam Dunn is not the reason Cincinnati hasn't made the playoffs in a while. Lack of pitching has been the problem in recent years. This year the offense hasn't exactly been steller. Dunn gets on base at a great percentage, simple as that. He can't help it if the guys around him don't get him in. But when all is said and done, pitching wins championships....Cincinnati is finally developing some pitching and we'll see the benefits sooner rather than later.

 

Yes he is 24th in OBP. But when he walks down to 1st, it will now take 3 hits (barring a homer) for him to score. Thats why they walk him so much. He is no threat standing on 1st base. I do agree about the pitching. But you cannot win if you score 3 or less in half of your games. Pretty simple there.

I never said top prospects. I said a marginal prospect.

 

So are you saying that there aren't any more Pete Rose's or Mike Piazza's out there in minor league systems? And by that I mean players that most scouts aren't high on, but yet they will still turn out be perennial All-Stars?

 

I would say that it is safe to say that the odds of any "marginal prospects" (which is what you are talking about from your earlier posts) either A) Getting 4256 hits in the majors or B) Hitting 437 Homeruns and batting .308 in a career spent primarily at catcher are indeed almost nil. You are talking about once in a lifetime players there. It is rare that a trade for a player of Hairston's stature results the team that trades him getting even an everyday player out of the deal.

So are you saying that there aren't any more Pete Rose's or Mike Piazza's out there in minor league systems? And by that I mean players that most scouts aren't high on, but yet they will still turn out be perennial All-Stars?

Within a year after his signing, Rose was anything but a marginal prospect ... he hit .330 and .331 in the minors in the two years before he was promoted to the majors. Piazza had established himself as a big-hitting catcher prospect by age 21.

 

I seriously doubt that any team is giving up anyone they feel has a future for Hairston.

 

And again, it's pie in the sky thinking on your part.

:thumb:

 

 

And you will continue to watch a losing ball club.

Dunn has nothing to do with this team losing in the past. Simple as that.

Within a year after his signing, Rose was anything but a marginal prospect ... he hit .330 and .331 in the minors in the two years before he was promoted to the majors. Piazza had established himself as a big-hitting catcher prospect by age 21.

 

I seriously doubt that any team is giving up anyone they feel has a future for Hairston.

 

And again, it's pie in the sky thinking on your part.

 

 

It may be, but the Reds have already more than gotten back their investment on Hariston. Anything else is just icing on the cake.