Phillips, is an ideal leadoff man and not RBI producer. As for "E", I'll wait longer than 2 weeks, to anoint him a better RBI producer, than Dunn.

 

Dunn K's, no secret to any team. In an ideal world, all teams would have 40Hr's, 125 RBI's and .310 avg, but they are as seldom, as 7yr locusts. I believe Dunn is 3rd on the teams in hits, leads in 2B, RBI's and Slugging %, but yet, the Reds still struggle.

 

Is "leading the team" enough when it comes to deciding on value?

 

You're the GM. Ownership wants you to contend and not wait a few years until the young players are ready.

 

Pitching is the #1 problem.

 

How do you satisfy the owner by trying to contend now AND fix the #1 problem on the team? What options do you have?

Phillips, is an ideal leadoff man and not RBI producer. As for "E", I'll wait longer than 2 weeks, to anoint him a better RBI producer, than Dunn.

 

Dunn K's, no secret to any team. In an ideal world, all teams would have 40Hr's, 125 RBI's and .310 avg, but they are as seldom, as 7yr locusts. I believe Dunn is 3rd on the teams in hits, leads in 2B, RBI's and Slugging %, but yet, the Reds still struggle.

 

That's just it. It doesn't matter what Dunn does, whether he's in the lineup or not, whether the Reds score 9 runs or 3, they still lose. Run production is not why the Reds suck.

Is "leading the team" enough when it comes to deciding on value?

 

You're the GM. Ownership wants you to contend and not wait a few years until the young players are ready.

 

Pitching is the #1 problem.

 

How do you satisfy the owner by trying to contend now AND fix the #1 problem on the team? What options do you have?

You posted his stats, in situational hitting and comparison. I commented on his categories, in which of those stats he leads....There are plenty of spots in the Reds batting order, which are underachieving and offer little glimmer of hope.

 

I think all would agree, the problem with the Reds is not Dunn, but Pitching, or at least that is my contention, over the last several years. From starting, middle and closing, the one consistent item, is it's extremely inconsistent.

 

Trade/package some of the middle relievers and over-priced flubs, that are currently putting the uniform on. Being in the Major Leagues and being a MLB player, are two distinct differences, which I believe the Reds have more than their share of.

Yeah, I'm not terribly sure that BP and E5 won't have more RBIs than "Dunn The Slugger" by the end of the season.

 

Let me know if you want a side-bet because I'm in like flynn on that one.

Here is the funny thing about this town: everyone is saying that Junior is having a monster year, should be an All-Star, and what a shame the Reds aren't contending. Their next breath is Dunn is a "K Monster" and should be dealt for a bucket of baseballs. However, when compared, who is really having the better year?

 

Dunn leads Griffey in runs, doubles, triples, home runs, rbi, total bases, stolen bases, sluggling percentage, has fewer errors, and more outfield assists.

 

Griffey leads Dunn in walks, fewer strikeouts, on base percentage and batting average.

 

They are tied in hits.

 

So one guy is having a monster year and the other guy is a bum. I'm telling you, this town's fan base (especially the casual ones who hear "this" much of something and just run with it) is crazy.

Let me know if you want a side-bet because I'm in like flynn on that one.

:lol:

 

Of course you'll notice I didn't use more definitive descriptors.

 

Still, E5 is improving rapidly, as is BP. Heck, BP has only three fewer RBIs and five fewer runs than Dunn. The difference is not that great.

Here is the funny thing about this town: everyone is saying that Junior is having a monster year, should be an All-Star, and what a shame the Reds aren't contending. Their next breath is Dunn is a "K Monster" and should be dealt for a bucket of baseballs. However, when compared, who is really having the better year?

 

Dunn leads Griffey in runs, doubles, triples, home runs, rbi, total bases, stolen bases, slugging percentage, has fewer errors, and more outfield assists.

 

Griffey leads Dunn in walks, fewer strikeouts, on base percentage and batting average.

 

They are tied in hits.

 

So one guy is having a monster year and the other guy is a bum. I'm telling you, this town's fan base (especially the casual ones who hear "this" much of something and just run with it) is crazy.

Sounds like another group of fans, in a town called Lexington.

 

Bottom line on Dunn is, he will never be, nor has been what some criticize him for, a high batting average guy, who K's little.....He's just not that type of player. If some want to trade, the only real consistent producer, on a team that is woeful, playing in a launching pad park, be my guest but remember this....The Reds will not improve.

Here is the funny thing about this town: everyone is saying that Junior is having a monster year, should be an All-Star, and what a shame the Reds aren't contending. Their next breath is Dunn is a "K Monster" and should be dealt for a bucket of baseballs. However, when compared, who is really having the better year?

 

Dunn leads Griffey in runs, doubles, triples, home runs, rbi, total bases, stolen bases, sluggling percentage, has fewer errors, and more outfield assists.

 

Griffey leads Dunn in walks, fewer strikeouts, on base percentage and batting average.

 

They are tied in hits.

 

So one guy is having a monster year and the other guy is a bum. I'm telling you, this town's fan base (especially the casual ones who hear "this" much of something and just run with it) is crazy.

:ylsuper: :ylsuper:

Here is the funny thing about this town: everyone is saying that Junior is having a monster year, should be an All-Star, and what a shame the Reds aren't contending. Their next breath is Dunn is a "K Monster" and should be dealt for a bucket of baseballs. However, when compared, who is really having the better year?

 

Dunn leads Griffey in runs, doubles, triples, home runs, rbi, total bases, stolen bases, sluggling percentage, has fewer errors, and more outfield assists.

 

Griffey leads Dunn in walks, fewer strikeouts, on base percentage and batting average.

 

They are tied in hits.

 

So one guy is having a monster year and the other guy is a bum. I'm telling you, this town's fan base (especially the casual ones who hear "this" much of something and just run with it) is crazy.

 

HSSB you know I've been a pretty big critic of Dunn's. However, I've never said he wasn't a useful player and I just don't see a Dunn for Lidge trade to be in the best interests of the Reds unless they're trying to blow the whole roster up and think that they can spin Lidge to a contender near the trading deadline for some quality prospects. I'm still not convinced that the Reds need to commit to Dunn long term but I think he's shown enough this year that picking up his option at the current rate isn't that bad of a deal. The main reason I wouldn't go ahead and extend his deal is that sluggers of his size tend to lose it quickly as they age instead of declining slowly. I just think getting rid of him for a 30 year old closer who has had control issues in the past and probably is as good as he's ever going to be just isn't the deal they should be looking for. What would you ideally like to see them do?

For the sake of further argument, let's get the whole "Dunn for Lidge" concept out of everyone's head. That's not going to happen because, frankly, the Astros have no place to put a guy like Dunn, unless they're planning on moving Lee or Berkman (which is HIGHLY unlikely).

What would you ideally like to see them do?

 

Thanks for asking.

 

A. If the casual fans in this market are going to continue to unfairly paint him as the problem and a villain, than trade him. No one deserves that, especially when it, in essence, isn't deserved. He didn't set the market for big hitters, he just lives during it. Not his fault.

 

So....

 

B. If you are going to trade him, send him to the AL for a group that looks like this:

 

.....1. A right-handed hitting outfielder on the verge of the majors with some pop.

.....2. A starting pitcher in AA that has a high ceiling.

.....3. A solid catching prospect at or above the AA level.

 

....aka, similar to what the Brewers did in sending Sexson to AZ or Lee to TX. Same story.

 

Or....

 

C. Sign him long-term and market him to the area so that people understand what he DOES do far outweighs what he DOESN'T do. This town has gone from a "great baseball town" to "we haven't won in decades and the fan base is casual at best about baseball." They need an education. You have fans here that freaking think Freel and Hopper are okay substitutes for Dunn. I mean I can't make this stuff up.

 

I'm okay with the first option (although this town will regret it), but obviously I'd prefer option C.

For the sake of further argument, let's get the whole "Dunn for Lidge" concept out of everyone's head. That's not going to happen because, frankly, the Astros have no place to put a guy like Dunn, unless they're planning on moving Lee or Berkman (which is HIGHLY unlikely).

 

Am I in the bibliography?

Here is the funny thing about this town: everyone is saying that Junior is having a monster year, should be an All-Star, and what a shame the Reds aren't contending. Their next breath is Dunn is a "K Monster" and should be dealt for a bucket of baseballs. However, when compared, who is really having the better year?

 

Dunn leads Griffey in runs, doubles, triples, home runs, rbi, total bases, stolen bases, sluggling percentage, has fewer errors, and more outfield assists.

 

Griffey leads Dunn in walks, fewer strikeouts, on base percentage and batting average.

 

They are tied in hits.

 

So one guy is having a monster year and the other guy is a bum. I'm telling you, this town's fan base (especially the casual ones who hear "this" much of something and just run with it) is crazy.

 

I'm in the group that Dunn is a lot more tradeable than Griffey and that he will bring back more in return. I'm also in the camp that Dunn's numbers have declined every year the last few years. I'm not sold that the Reds can ever seriously contend w/ him especially when he gets a raise. Last year they were actually in the race the last month of the season. He was absolutely horrible at producing runs that month. If he was "average" for him they may have won the division. I still think a guy that hits more than 40 HR's should be able to drive in over 100 and score over 100. It shouldn't be that hard.

Am I in the bibliography?

 

Partial credit. I asked the question late last night and nobody addressed it.

....They need an education. You have fans here that freaking think Freel and Hopper are okay substitutes for Dunn. I mean I can't make this stuff up.

I think Freel, plays extremely hard in all he does, I'll give him that and I enjoy watching players, who have passion for the game. With that said, he's at best a .270 hitter and his lifetime HR totals are 21 and RBI's, what barely over 100....Sounds like a normal Dunn year, but he gets criticized.

 

Let's look at each position, offensively and see where the problem lies....Anyone care to start.

 

...He was absolutely horrible at producing runs that month. If he was "average" for him they may have won the division. I still think a guy that hits more than 40 HR's should be able to drive in over 100 and score over 100. It shouldn't be that hard.

Point the blame, where it needed pointing....Pitching. Some says he could carry the team, others say he can't.