Who did Florida miss more this season? Harvin or Murphy?

[CatsCatsCats]

For a closer look, Chris Brown broke down UT game plan vs. UF. Obviously, it's alot more extensive than what I wrote, but IMO this guy is a football savant. Can you take his word for it OR? His stuff is very well known in football cirlces. It's the 3rd story down, with the headline of Monte Kiffin.

 

http://smartfootball.com/tag/urban-meyer

 

Monte Kiffin, one of the best defensvive minds of all-time, disagrees with you as UT payed no attention to the outside guys, going out of his pattented "Tampa 2", into a coverage that slowed UF down. Had UT had some form of offense they may have won that game. But what do Urban Meyer or Monte Kiffin know?:idunno:

[Wireman]

Can we add Tim Tebow to the poll?

[CatsCatsCats]

OR, nothing I say strategy wise comes from me. I'm not going to say that kind of stuff without some research. Sure stats can tell alot, but I'd rather base my assumptions on what people like Meyer, Saban, Tressell etc. say. Shouldn't they be able to be trusted?

[Original Rookie]

For a closer look, Chris Brown broke down UT game plan vs. UF. Obviously, it's alot more extensive than what I wrote, but IMO this guy is a football savant. Can you take his word for it OR? His stuff is very well known in football cirlces. It's the 3rd story down, with the headline of Monte Kiffin.

 

http://smartfootball.com/tag/urban-meyer

 

Monte Kiffin, one of the best defensvive minds of all-time, disagrees with you as UT payed no attention to the outside guys, going out of his pattented "Tampa 2", into a coverage that slowed UF down. Had UT had some form of offense they may have won that game. But what do Urban Meyer or Monte Kiffin know?:idunno:

Which just goes to show what I've been saying along right?

 

Any team preparing for a Tebow led offense is going to try to stop the run first. They are just that much better with Harvin, even if you did stack the box, they could still run it.

[Original Rookie]

OR, nothing I say strategy wise comes from me. I'm not going to say that kind of stuff without some research. Sure stats can tell alot, but I'd rather base my assumptions on what people like Meyer, Saban, Tressell etc. say. Shouldn't they be able to be trusted?

 

I've yet to see a quote or anything from any of those guys talking about stopping the Florida deep ball or passing game.

 

Just pointing out the obvious, no team last year went into playing Florida and said that they better stop Florida from throwing it over top of them if they hope to win.

[CatsCatsCats]

Which just goes to show what I've been saying along right?

 

Any team preparing for a Tebow led offense is going to try to stop the run first. They are just that much better with Harvin, even if you did stack the box, they could still run it.

 

I'm going to make this really easy for you to understand.

 

1. #1 priority when facing the Gators is stopping the run.

2. Without a LEGIT down the field threat, you can do so many more things defensively.

 

Where is the argument? No one said you had to stop Murphy first. But, you had to account for him more than Cooper or others. Which changes the way you set up your defense. It's not complex man. It's not a hard subject.

 

BTW, an extra 2-3 yards per play is a huge deal. That's not a hard concept either.

 

But, like I said Meyer, Saban, and the rest of the SEC coaches know nothing. They should just hire you.

[Original Rookie]

I'm going to make this really easy for you to understand.

 

1. #1 priority when facing the Gators is stopping the run.

2. Without a LEGIT down the field threat, you can do so many more things defensively.

 

Where is the argument? No one said you had to stop Murphy first. But, you had to account for him more than Cooper or others. Which changes the way you set up your defense. It's not complex man. It's not a hard subject.

 

BTW, an extra 2-3 yards per play is a huge deal. That's not a hard concept either.

 

But, like I said Meyer, Saban, and the rest of the SEC coaches know nothing. They should just hire you.

I understand 2-3 yard per play is a huge deal, which is why crediting that to Murphy is pretty funny.

 

Sure you had to account for Murphy, but for most, that just meant putting your best corner on an island and hoping that he can stop him. They just had too many weapons, which made them great. Murphy was a great weapon and better than Cooper even though the numbers don't say so. Harvin was so much more dangerous though it is crazy.

 

You keep talking about all of these top coaches, but I've yet to see one thing from them that agrees with your side of the argument :idunno:

[CatsCatsCats]

I've yet to see a quote or anything from any of those guys talking about stopping the Florida deep ball or passing game.

Just pointing out the obvious, no team last year went into playing Florida and said that they better stop Florida from throwing it over top of them if they hope to win.

 

That's because they don't have to account for it. I give up. We aren't even speaking the same language.

 

Everything you've said is correct, but you're missing the grand scheme that makes it possible. SEC football is a chess match, and you have to give something up no matter what you do.

 

Last season, teams could not have a strategy like the one they could this year. That has little to do with Harvin. This years strategy would have helped teams last year against UF and Harvin (somewhat not completely IMO), but they couldn't do it because of Murphy in the deep passing game. With that threat taken away, everyone's production dropped in the big games. Harvin's may not have, but after all he is one of the favorites for R.O.Y.

 

So, in essence, Murphy helped Tebow, Demps, Rainey, Hernandez as much as Harvin did. He kept defenses honest, but in a different way than Harvin did.

The guy that ended up being responsible for Tebow this season, would have had to at least back up a little before the snap because of the threat of the 15+ yard pass. It's not hard man, it really isn't. You have to read between the lines, and know what Urban is trying to accomplish at the same time.

 

This is it. I've given you what SEC coaches say about it, so it can't be that off base. Everything, especially football is not as simple as just give it to Percy Harvin.

[Original Rookie]

That's because they don't have to account for it. I give up. We aren't even speaking the same language.

 

You're just far too advanced for me and this board. I'm surprised you aren't on the way up the college football coaching ladder already.

 

*Insert 100 laughing faces*

[CatsCatsCats]

I understand 2-3 yard per play is a huge deal, which is why crediting that to Murphy is pretty funny.

 

Sure you had to account for Murphy, but for most, that just meant putting your best corner on an island and hoping that he can stop him. They just had too many weapons, which made them great. Murphy was a great weapon and better than Cooper even though the numbers don't say so. Harvin was so much more dangerous though it is crazy.

 

You keep talking about all of these top coaches, but I've yet to see one thing from them that agrees with your side of the argument :idunno:

 

How about Urban's offensive philosophy.

-+1 in the box (offense out-numbers the defense by one player) run the ball.

-Even in the box run or pass.

- -1 in the box (pass or run option)

 

Urban wants to run the ball on most downs. He wants to play option football, and use formations to mess with the defense. If you cannot pass down the field, the defense is better suited to defend the run. Often times Murphy was going one on one with help over the top. Not a true double team, but they had to have some help. C'mon the guy was clocked at like a 4.39.

 

Murphy allowed the Gators a weapon that no one else on the team provided. Harvin had speed, but Demps and Rainey are world class as well. Harvin couldn't specialize at just catching passes, and we've seen how tough UF's passing game was with Cooper leading the WR corp.

 

With Monte Kiffin, the players he was able to use were a result of the "burners" UF had outside. No way hall-hawk Eric Berry is mainly in run support if UF had someone who could stretch the field. Eric Berry nearly kept UT in the game single-handedly. I don't see how that isn't agreeing, when you basically take one of the best coverage safeties in the history of college football and have him filling the run almost exclusively. Even Berry's pick came from being up in run support, dropping to the flat as UT was in an Invert Cover 2 with a CB taking his place on the snap of the ball.

 

Maybe you didn't get that out of that, but I don't see how. Of course when you play Meyer you want and have to stop run first. But, without a deep pass catching threat, it's alot easier to do. Not a hard concept.:idunno:

[CatsCatsCats]

You're just far too advanced for me and this board. I'm surprised you aren't on the way up the college football coaching ladder already.

 

*Insert 100 laughing faces*

 

Not what I meant by that. I meant that we are talking about two different things, which we are. That is the subject that is hard for you to comprehend. I don't know anything about your specific football knowledge.

 

Why do you always want to come off as the bad guy? You look for people that you can try to make look stupid? That's a sad way to live your life man.

 

Say what you want about me, but I would never want to intentionally try to hurt someone or say something like that. It's kind of pathetic.

[Original Rookie]

How about Urban's offensive philosophy.

-+1 in the box (offense out-numbers the defense by one player) run the ball.

-Even in the box run or pass.

- -1 in the box (pass or run option)

 

Urban wants to run the ball on most downs. He wants to play option football, and use formations to mess with the defense. If you cannot pass down the field, the defense is better suited to defend the run. Often times Murphy was going one on one with help over the top. Not a true double team, but they had to have some help. C'mon the guy was clocked at like a 4.39.

 

Murphy allowed the Gators a weapon that no one else on the team provided. Harvin had speed, but Demps and Rainey are world class as well. Harvin couldn't specialize at just catching passes, and we've seen how tough UF's passing game was with Cooper leading the WR corp.

 

With Monte Kiffin, the players he was able to use were a result of the "burners" UF had outside. No way hall-hawk Eric Berry is mainly in run support if UF had someone who could stretch the field. Eric Berry nearly kept UT in the game single-handedly. I don't see how that isn't agreeing, when you basically take one of the best coverage safeties in the history of college football and have him filling the run almost exclusively. Even Berry's pick came from being up in run support, dropping to the flat as UT was in an Invert Cover 2 with a CB taking his place on the snap of the ball.

 

Maybe you didn't get that out of that, but I don't see how. Of course when you play Meyer you want and have to stop run first. But, without a deep pass catching threat, it's alot easier to do. Not a hard concept.:idunno:

You said all of that when you could have just said that UT loaded the box to stop the run.

 

Harvin could absolutely specialize at just catching passes, have you watch him in the NFL? He was just too good to only use him as a receiver knowing that TT is limited throwing the ball.

[Original Rookie]

Not what I meant by that. I meant that we are talking about two different things, which we are. That is the subject that is hard for you to comprehend. I don't know anything about your specific football knowledge.

 

Why do you always want to come off as the bad guy? You look for people that you can try to make look stupid? That's a sad way to live your life man.

 

Say what you want about me, but I would never want to intentionally try to hurt someone or say something like that. It's kind of pathetic.

 

Um what? :idunno:

 

I don't look to try to make anyone stupid, you are the one who talks "down" to people because of your knowledge of the game.

 

I'm not sure what you took as personal, but that is never my intention. You can't take these discussions too seriously.

[CatsCatsCats]

You said all of that when you could have just said that UT loaded the box to stop the run.

 

Harvin could absolutely specialize at just catching passes, have you watch him in the NFL? He was just too good to only use him as a receiver knowing that TT is limited throwing the ball.

 

Once again we are talking about two different things with the top sentence. Of course UT stacked the box. Not having Murphy or a quality top of the line outside guy made than an easier choice? Correct?

 

Harvin could just catch passes, but in the college game most coaches choose to use a talent like that in many different facets of the game. Heck, even the Vikings do. To have Percy only catching passes at UF would be a waste, am I correct there?

 

Um what? :idunno:

 

I don't look to try to make anyone stupid, you are the one who talks "down" to people because of your knowledge of the game.

 

I'm not sure what you took as personal, but that is never my intention. You can't take these discussions too seriously.

 

Never do I talk down to anyone. I have my opinion, and I'll defend it, and it gets nasty once people act like I'm stupid or something. I may not be the smartest on the board, but I don't consider myself mentally handicapped either. But, the post you made a second ago was a personal attack, which I would never make unless provoked, which you are pretty good at. I never claimed to have knowledge, like I said, most of the strategy stuff that I say comes from reading Saban, Meyer, etc. Now I will say that they know more than you or I do. But, the personal attacks are sickening man. Just ignore my posts or something, because it does seem like it's your intent. It's always trying to make someone look bad or stupid.

[CatsCatsCats]

^^Also, I'm not even normally a serious guy. I love sports and love to argue it. But, I can take most of this as fun, just not when it crosses the line IMO.