Two More Star Wars Movies Coming?

[PepRock01]

I liked the Gungans because it was realistic to think they might be able to defeat the Droid army.

 

But Teddy Bears armed with bow and arrows, stones, spears, etc defeating the Storm Troppers. Come on. Out of all the things that are unrealistic in the movie, this is #1.

 

Yes, without a doubt, it is.

 

I would never argue otherwise on that. I just found them less annoying.

[ladiesbballcoach]

To the last part... They made that perfectly believable without needing the prequels.

 

In 4-6 he never strikes me as half as evil as the Emperor. In fact he makes mention to Moff Jerjerrord at the start of 6 "The Emperor is not as forgiving as I." Considering this guy killed Captain Needa and Admial Ozzel in Empire it makes you wonder about the Emperor.

He would not confide in Obi Wan because he felt he was holding him back. That Obi Wan was too judgemental. Not to mention that Obi Wan would have led the charge to kick him out of the Jedi after his massacre.

 

The guilt of it and knowing how anti-Jedi it was I would assume would prevent him from disclosing much to the Jedi. He had already shown a willingness to step out of the Jedi mindset and handle matters on his own.

 

I don't think they did. How many conversations did Darth and Luke have about the matter. Two. One in a battle where he cuts his hand off and the other when Luke pretty surrenders himself to Darth. Two conversations overcome many years of darkness. Dr. Phil would have nothing on Luke.

[PepRock01]

Considering how quickly he fell, I suppose a sudden ascension out of the dark side if perfectly logical...

 

Althoug I still feel that there was considerable brooding on the matter by Vader from the end of Empire to his heroic act in Jedi. You could hear the affection in Vader's voice when talking about and to his son, you knew that it would have to come into play at some point.

 

Luke's sensing the conflict within his father was enough of an indication that there was good in him as was the logic that Luke used. "You couldn't destroy me before..." Meaning there was clear hesitation on Vader's part when it looked like Luke would not turn. Also you can hear a degree of urgency in his voice when he is pleading with Luke to join him. He does not want to harm him anymore than he already has. That much was clear to me in that battle in Empire.

[ladiesbballcoach]

I would refer to him as a whiney farm boy, but in EP IV he does have a bit of that going. Leia certainly has an ego issue. I however find that by Empire they have grown dramatically. Leia and Luke both have been given roles with responsibility within the Rebel Alliance and their behavior from then on was a marked difference from the previous film.

 

I would say maybe at the end of Empire or Return but he was arrogant and cocky with Yoda. And there was nothing given in the story to really show how he became as powerful in Return as he was. That always bothered me in Return.

 

If you pay close attention it seems as though the conflict with in Vader starts when he fights Luke in Empire. But moving forward to Jedi it is apparent when he speaks with the Emperor that there is a degree of affection for his son. There is something in his voice, it is very noticeable, when he mentions him to the Emperor. Luke's conversation with his father about it was merely serving to make him question his decision. What was the straw that broke the camel's back on the whole thing was watching the Emperor kill his son. The remnants of the good man within him wanted to protect his son, and he did just that.

 

I fully admit that personal bias plays into my view here but you also admitted as much with you can't abide fools. But I despise fathers who abandon their children. And until 1, 2, 3, that is what Darth Vader was. A person who is supposedly so powerful to sense the very presence of things and yet he did not know he had a child or could sense it.

 

I think if you are going to call out the Jedi for not sensing the Sith Lord, the same holds true for Darth to not sense his own children.

 

I saw him as someone who abandoned his family for evil ways and no reason given.

 

1, 2, 3 explained the whole back story on why he did not know that he had two children.

 

BTW, I am going to be watching two of the 6 tonight after all of this talk. Going to have to pick two out to watch with my son. Which to me is the VERY BEST way to enjoy a Star Wars movie.

[ladiesbballcoach]

Considering how quickly he fell, I suppose a sudden ascension out of the dark side if perfectly logical...

 

Althoug I still feel that there was considerable brooding on the matter by Vader from the end of Empire to his heroic act in Jedi. You could hear the affection in Vader's voice when talking about and to his son, you knew that it would have to come into play at some point.

 

Luke's sensing the conflict within his father was enough of an indication that there was good in him as was the logic that Luke used. "You couldn't destroy me before..." Meaning there was clear hesitation on Vader's part when it looked like Luke would not turn. Also you can hear a degree of urgency in his voice when he is pleading with Luke to join him. He does not want to harm him anymore than he already has. That much was clear to me in that battle in Empire.

While I understand your point that the story here can stand alone, I think 1, 2, 3 helps support the story and makes it even stronger. We have no reason to know why Darth abandoned his family, went so evil and now is conflicted about it. #2 with the death of mom and #3 with the death of Padme and the struggles he is having personally explains that.

 

To me, it never made good sense on why he turned evil and then turned good. Why did he being so powerful not know his children.

 

One thing that has bothered me is that Obi Wan seemed to age much more between 3 and 4 than Luke and Leia did.

[ladiesbballcoach]

I would have rather seen them show more of that to drive home the evil.

I would say that they held off on this because of attracting children to the movie. Has to be a balance there.

 

I thought Padme was a good character in 1 and even 2 as they showed her as heroic and you could see where Leia got her spunk. And then she became a shell of that character in 3. Hated her role in 3.

 

She went from taking that creature on at the executions to a crying, bumbling mess who was so distraught over Anakin that she pretty much gave up her life leaving her children motherless and as far as she knew going to be raised by the man that brought her to this point.

[ladiesbballcoach]

Well this will give the Nerds something to talk about in late night chat rooms.

And yeah we both read this but just ignoring you.:lol:

[PepRock01]

I would refer to him as a whiney farm boy, but in EP IV he does have a bit of that going. Leia certainly has an ego issue. I however find that by Empire they have grown dramatically. Leia and Luke both have been given roles with responsibility within the Rebel Alliance and their behavior from then on was a marked difference from the previous film.

 

I would say maybe at the end of Empire or Return but he was arrogant and cocky with Yoda. And there was nothing given in the story to really show how he became as powerful in Return as he was. That always bothered me in Return.

 

 

The arrogance and cockiness that you mention was there, but that was of a supremely confident fighter pilot and soldier. No fighter pilot gets to where they are without a level of confidence (if not cockiness); Luke was an elite pilot by this point in time. I find it makes sense for the character at that point. The sudden turn from where he was in Empire to Jedi does seem a bit odd. What would make sense in my estimation is that his adventurism and wild nature was burned out after he faced Vader and he began to fully embrace all that Yoda had taught him. In doing so and finding that within himself he grew in power and maturity.

 

If you pay close attention it seems as though the conflict with in Vader starts when he fights Luke in Empire. But moving forward to Jedi it is apparent when he speaks with the Emperor that there is a degree of affection for his son. There is something in his voice, it is very noticeable, when he mentions him to the Emperor. Luke's conversation with his father about it was merely serving to make him question his decision. What was the straw that broke the camel's back on the whole thing was watching the Emperor kill his son. The remnants of the good man within him wanted to protect his son, and he did just that.

 

I fully admit that personal bias plays into my view here but you also admitted as much with you can't abide fools. But I despise fathers who abandon their children. And until 1, 2, 3, that is what Darth Vader was. A person who is supposedly so powerful to sense the very presence of things and yet he did not know he had a child or could sense it.

 

I think if you are going to call out the Jedi for not sensing the Sith Lord, the same holds true for Darth to not sense his own children.

 

I find a difference in sensing a trained Sith lord with mastery over the force and children who's abilities with the force were fledgling at best at that point. But I do understand what you are saying. However the time that Luke and Leia(whom the force is least strong with) were nearest him(on the Death Star in ANH) his focus was on the very noticeable presence of Obi-Wan.

 

I saw him as someone who abandoned his family for evil ways and no reason given.

 

1, 2, 3 explained the whole back story on why he did not know that he had two children.

 

Actually Obi-Wan mentioned to Luke in Jedi that they were hidden from their father and the Emperor when they were infants. There was no indication of abandonment. Although I do understand your perspective. Parents abandoning their children is disgusting at any level. One of the reasons I hate Kate Chopin's The Awakening, the main character abandons her family for her "awakening."

 

BTW, I am going to be watching two of the 6 tonight after all of this talk. Going to have to pick two out to watch with my son. Which to me is the VERY BEST way to enjoy a Star Wars movie.

 

I am glad you have that bond with your son. :thumb:

[PepRock01]

And yeah we both read this but just ignoring you.:lol:

 

Yep. :thumb:

[PepRock01]

While I understand your point that the story here can stand alone, I think 1, 2, 3 helps support the story and makes it even stronger. We have no reason to know why Darth abandoned his family, went so evil and now is conflicted about it. #2 with the death of mom and #3 with the death of Padme and the struggles he is having personally explains that.

 

To me, it never made good sense on why he turned evil and then turned good. Why did he being so powerful not know his children.

 

One thing that has bothered me is that Obi Wan seemed to age much more between 3 and 4 than Luke and Leia did.

 

On the first point, fair enough.

 

Point 2: I agree with you on that for the most part. The development of both fall and rising from the ashes per-se were not as well done as they could have been.

 

There are a few things that I may be able to offer on the last point: I think they were trying to indicate Obi-Wan Was in his 50's and Anakin in his 30's in EPIII. The streaks of grey in the beard I think were there for that reason(even if he didn't LOOK that old). Also he lived on a desert planet for 19 years, I figure that sort of harsh climate could age him a whole lot too. But I agree, the aging difference was dramatic.

[PepRock01]

I would say that they held off on this because of attracting children to the movie. Has to be a balance there.

 

I thought Padme was a good character in 1 and even 2 as they showed her as heroic and you could see where Leia got her spunk. And then she became a shell of that character in 3. Hated her role in 3.

 

She went from taking that creature on at the executions to a crying, bumbling mess who was so distraught over Anakin that she pretty much gave up her life leaving her children motherless and as far as she knew going to be raised by the man that brought her to this point.

 

Excellent points on her character.

 

Her sudden death after she "lost the will to live" bothered me too. It was like she unplugged and died almost instantaneously.

[ladiesbballcoach]

I am glad you have that bond with your son. :thumb:

After watching the movies, I used the time to springboard into discussions of how the devil and evil lies to you, tells you things that are complete and full lies trying to get you to turn FROM Jesus and to evil.

 

How that evil as the Emperor did is going to construct an argument that is perfectly suited for each of us in our own way to lure us to the "dark side."

 

That Anakin fell from the "truth" which we know is the gospel of Jesus Christ and instead fell for the lies. And those lies can be extremely enticing.

 

And as Scripture indicates we need to flee, running from them and not entertain them or we might become too enticed.

[PepRock01]

After watching the movies, I used the time to springboard into discussions of how the devil and evil lies to you, tells you things that are complete and full lies trying to get you to turn FROM Jesus and to evil.

 

How that evil as the Emperor did is going to construct an argument that is perfectly suited for each of us in our own way to lure us to the "dark side."

 

That Anakin fell from the "truth" which we know is the gospel of Jesus Christ and instead fell for the lies. And those lies can be extremely enticing.

 

And as Scripture indicates we need to flee, running from them and not entertain them or we might become too enticed.

 

I am glad you use that analogy. I remember when Episode I came out there were a few Christian groups protesting it in some cities. I wish they saw it in the same light. :thumb:

[ladiesbballcoach]

I am glad you use that analogy. I remember when Episode I came out there were a few Christian groups protesting it in some cities. I wish they saw it in the same light. :thumb:

I remember starting a thread or commenting in one that I wondered if the Force did not have a strong Christian semblance to the Holy Spirit. Not identical but I see a lot of similiarities.

[ram2003]

While I can see lbbc's point of view, I pretty much entirely agree with Peprock (but that includes the parts that he agrees with you, lbbc).

 

Midachlorians or however you spell them was unecessary and took away from the religious and training aspects of the Force.

 

The Gungans could've been much better. Anyone not seeing Jar-Jar being well-hated during the writing process of the film should never write for films again. They should go straight to cartoons.

 

Luke and Leia's changes in characters from a whiney farm boy and a spoiled princess to the much more mature characters in Jedi were well developed and well played out. Whereas Anakin as a child was not only an annoying character, but a poor young actor with Jake Loydd IMO. Hayden Christiansen wasn't a terrible choice, but he wasn't great, and his character developement, especially in Episode III, was just plain bad. "I want mroe power, but I'm a Jedi, trained and born and raised to be wary of the Sith, my natural enemy. Oh wow, the Chancellor is the Sith Lord, whom myself and my brethern have been battling my entire Jedi career! I know the Sith are infamous for betrayal and lies, but I'm going to believe him anyways when he says I can save Padme. Oh, but now I want to kill Padme! And I want to kill Obi-Wan, the only person who I could possibly call family. Oh, but now I'm Darth Vader and I want to know where Padme is because I suddenly love her again!"

 

Please.

 

At least they gave Chewbacca some love.

 

Chewbacca keeps it real.