As long as we are working with an imperfect game (football), with imperfect people (you can put whomever you want here) it by necessity constitutes and imperfect system. Instead of the RPI, why not assign points to all class A team 6 points for a win, 8 for 2A and on up, so if a 6A teams beats a 2 A team they get 8 points and a point for each win that team earns during the season. Then when you play an out of state team, you know exactly what you will be getting for the win. But then again, I'm an imperfect man, trying to come up with a perfect system for an imperfect game.

5 minutes ago, Big East Zebra said:

As long as we are working with an imperfect game (football), with imperfect people (you can put whomever you want here) it by necessity constitutes and imperfect system. Instead of the RPI, why not assign points to all class A team 6 points for a win, 8 for 2A and on up, so if a 6A teams beats a 2 A team they get 8 points and a point for each win that team earns during the season. Then when you play an out of state team, you know exactly what you will be getting for the win. But then again, I'm an imperfect man, trying to come up with a perfect system for an imperfect game.

Ehhhh. Maybe...

Personally, I'm going to trust a committee of former coaches, administrators, and reporters above anything else. 

At least RPI, tries to take into account things like Opponents of Opponens' Strength of Victory. This approach seems a bit too simplistic.

Even with some of the better match ups in the 1st round, for the majority of those it's a "clocking" in the waiting come round 2 and for some others,  that inevitable is coming in the 3rd round, it even happens in the 4th round.

If it's about opportunities at playing as many games as possible, which I agree, then play an 11 game regular season with a regional "bowl" game of sorts (which would be the current 2nd round week) for those that have accumlated 5 wins & just take the Top 8 in each class to the playoffs. 

FWIW, some of the perceived "upset alerts" this week based off district seeding alone, aren't considered to be that on CalPreps.

I think RPI is fine.  We know it's not going to be perfect.  But it's mostly correct as far as rankings at the end of the season.  Sure, there are a few outliers.  But it does what it's supposed to do and makes sure the top teams are in regional finals and state finals.  

8 minutes ago, brooksville said:

I think RPI is fine.  We know it's not going to be perfect.  But it's mostly correct as far as rankings at the end of the season.  Sure, there are a few outliers.  But it does what it's supposed to do and makes sure the top teams are in regional finals and state finals.  

I disagree for anyone that plays out of state teams, especially top flight out of state teams. 

2 hours ago, theguru said:

I disagree for anyone that plays out of state teams, especially top flight out of state teams. 

There is a problem with a system when you are better off scheduling BYE than playing and beating the #1 team from Ohio.  There are simple solutions that VOR has proposed in other threads.

On 11/2/2024 at 5:21 PM, Oldercoach said:

I totally understand how the mathematical tracking of multiple(7,10,15 or 49) states for OW and OOWP purposes seems overwhelming for my slide-rule…maybe need to upgrade to an abacus.  Playing out of state teams is optional and the benefits known and considered when scheduled.  However, required games is what needs tweaking.  I do think the disparity in District sizes should work hugely to the detriment in some instances.  Near and dear example…Beechwood is in the only 6 team 2A district and thus required to play 5 district games.  If they had not played Carroll Co. (1-9) and just played a 9 game season their RPI would be #2 and Mayfield would be traveling to Beechwood rather than visa-versa.  Playing Mayfield anywhere is a challenge.  Going to their home turf (despite how gracious they are as hosts) is a nightmare.  Hmmmm…. In what world should no game be worth more then winning a required game on a running clock shutout?

Mayfield can't get anyone to play us. Next year a 6 team district.

12 hours ago, Big East Zebra said:

As long as we are working with an imperfect game (football), with imperfect people (you can put whomever you want here) it by necessity constitutes and imperfect system. Instead of the RPI, why not assign points to all class A team 6 points for a win, 8 for 2A and on up, so if a 6A teams beats a 2 A team they get 8 points and a point for each win that team earns during the season. Then when you play an out of state team, you know exactly what you will be getting for the win. But then again, I'm an imperfect man, trying to come up with a perfect system for an imperfect game.

Agreed, it's an imperfect system and there will never be a perfect solution.  It's always good to hear other people's ideas.  The system you mention has some merit, but also some flaws.  Let's say I schedule a team like Owensboro Catholic and defeat them.  It's their only loss of the year, so they go 9-1.  Based on the formula above, I would get 17 points.  Not bad, but if I schedule a class 6A team like Southern (no offense to Southern) and defeat them, I would get 16 points alone for them just being a 6A team and if they had just 1 win on the season, that would get me as many points as beating a 9-1 Owensboro Catholic.

For me, I think RPI is fine just needs a few tweaks, like actual points for out-of-state teams and not just a standard number regardless of the team.  If we can figure out opponents win% and OOWS win % and so on, why couldn't we do that for out of state teams as well?  I would also put in a clause in the RPI that if two teams have to face each other in rounds 3 or 4 and they played during the regular season, the winner of the regular season game gets to be at home for the playoff game even if they're the lower seeded team based on RPI.  I'm pulling for CAL in the playoffs, but it looks like Central will have to travel to CAL for a 3rd round game at this point.  Obviously good for CAL, but to me, fair is fair and Central earned the right to host that game in the playoffs should it happen.

Tweak RPI as follows:

1).  Allow each team to drop 2 victories from their RPI calculation.  This allows out-of-state games to continue without penalty….allows mandated weak District victories to be eliminated and evens the disparity of 4,5, and 6 team districts.  With this one tweak I think the system eliminates the disparity of scheduling BYE generating a better RPI result than a victory over an out-of-state powerhouse or a win over an inferior mandated District opponent.  
 

Thoughts?

3 hours ago, Oldercoach said:

Tweak RPI as follows:

1).  Allow each team to drop 2 victories from their RPI calculation.  This allows out-of-state games to continue without penalty….allows mandated weak District victories to be eliminated and evens the disparity of 4,5, and 6 team districts.  With this one tweak I think the system eliminates the disparity of scheduling BYE generating a better RPI result than a victory over an out-of-state powerhouse or a win over an inferior mandated District opponent.  
 

Thoughts?

1st order of business- Fix the out of state component. Examples: Boyle County should be rewarded for beating a top tier program such as Cleveland St. Edwards. Trinity should be rewarded for beating a top tier program such as Cincinnati St. Xavier. Not asked to drop the game from calculation and certainly not penalized with a .51 for winning such a game. 

On 11/3/2024 at 12:08 PM, gchs_uk9 said:

Central routed CAL two weeks ago to win the district and is the consensus number one team in Class 3A, yet almost assuredly will have to play at CAL in the third round.

I’ve said over and over that I like the format the KHSAA uses for the playoffs, but the RPI is an absolutely atrocious metric. 

IMO in instances like this...head to head wins should trump RPI ratings to determine Home field advantage.  

I agree head to head results should be weighted more heavily. 

4 hours ago, thsrocks said:

I agree head to head results should be weighted more heavily. 

Hopkinsville-Warren East-Logan County ended in a 3-way for 3rd which had to go to RPI. Warren East had the best RPI of the 3 teams and got the 3 seed. 
 

Hopkinsville beat Logan County head to head but because Logan had the higher RPI they got the 4th seed and Hopkinsville was left home. 
 

11 hours ago, WKY_Football said:

Hopkinsville-Warren East-Logan County ended in a 3-way for 3rd which had to go to RPI. Warren East had the best RPI of the 3 teams and got the 3 seed. 
 

Hopkinsville beat Logan County head to head but because Logan had the higher RPI they got the 4th seed and Hopkinsville was left home. 
 

That's the nature of a 3-way tie, though. Whoever gets left home could complain that they beat one of the other two teams.