On 2/6/2022 at 10:52 AM, ColonelMike said:

I think Flores is raising some valid points, but I'm not sure that a broad statement that black coaches are only hired into no-win situations is accurate.    And sweeping generalizations are usually not fair assessments, anyway.

Black coaches have a short leash.  Just like Black QBs.  That’s just the way it is.  So when he says they are put into no-win situations he means that when they are fortunate enough to get a head coaching job they aren’t given the time or the tools necessary for success.  How is that not accurate?  Other than Mike Tomlin, a true Rooney Rule success story, how many black coaches can you name off the top of your head who were put in situations where they were given time to grow as a coach?  It doesn’t happen often.  
 

Marvin Lewis.  Tony Dungy.  Anyone else qualify and come to mind immediately?  There have been 500 head coaches in the NFL.  24 have been black.  24.  
 

Sweeping generalizations may not be “fair assessments” but they sure do hit home sometimes.  

On 2/5/2022 at 3:50 PM, ColonelMike said:

If any of the allegations are true, Flores has a real point.   If the Giants, for example, had already decided on a coach before even interviewing Flores - doing so just to meet the NFL's requirements - then that is a sad state of affairs.

The problem is the backside of the coin....now, if I own a team and I have a head coaching vacancy, are you telling me that I must hire a black coach, simply because of the paucity of black head coaches?    If so, that's also a problem - and it's no better than the first because it's the SAME PROBLEM.

Who is saying that?  Not one person is saying that.  The actual problem is that black coaches are having an extremely hard time proving that they are deserving of being a head coach.  

Black coaches can’t even get an honest interview without being a pawn in the game so how can they prove that they are deserving when the rules put in place to incorporate fairness into the interviewing process are constantly side stepped?  
 

Mike Tomlin is a true Rooney Rule hire and he has turned out to be great for the Steelers.  They didn’t plan to hire him until he came in and interviewed.  It worked  then so people are being disingenuous when they say the Rooney Rule needs to go.  How else can you ensure that black coaches will get an opportunity to be a head coach in the NFL?  Eric Bienemy is on line one trying to find an answer to that question.   

On 2/6/2022 at 12:04 PM, ColonelMike said:

I agree!   Flores did a very good job in Florida and just didn't get the credit for it.

On paper, he's a far superior choice.   

I'd pick him in a heartbeat.

BUT....to throw a bit of a level-set out there....all owners are not bad owners, racist, or even "good-ol' boy" just because they don't make a singular pick that complies with society's mood of the day.     

Not defending the owners - I am, after all, the one who just made the comment about avoiding sweeping generalizations - but indicting the owners en masse isn't correct, either.

You personally know owners in the NFL?  

Having black owners in the NFL would be a good start to worthy change.  

16 minutes ago, PurplePride92 said:

Having black owners in the NFL would be a good start to worthy change.  

This is key... which, owners don't just relinquish ownership rights. So let's at least get minorities into high ranking positions with organizations. That is more crucial, imo. Only then can cultural changes be seen.

I liken it to the Oscars. The thing that irritated me about the #oscarssowhite movement is that it was misguided. People were "woking" all over the place because of lack of diversity in the categories, but the real lack of diversity comes with the producers and management companies. Don't fault the Oscars for only having a handful of African American actors to select from in leading roles. If you have 100 films and of those, 5 have a minority lead, then social media screams racism for not selecting one of those 5, then it is misguided.

13 minutes ago, bugatti said:

This is key... which, owners don't just relinquish ownership rights. So let's at least get minorities into high ranking positions with organizations. That is more crucial, imo. Only then can cultural changes be seen.

I liken it to the Oscars. The thing that irritated me about the #oscarssowhite movement is that it was misguided. People were "woking" all over the place because of lack of diversity in the categories, but the real lack of diversity comes with the producers and management companies. Don't fault the Oscars for only having a handful of African American actors to select from in leading roles. If you have 100 films and of those, 5 have a minority lead, then social media screams racism for not selecting one of those 5, then it is misguided.

Isn't Denver on the sale block?

2 minutes ago, 4 Quarters said:

Isn't Denver on the sale block?

Yes.  

9 hours ago, PurplePride92 said:

NFL owners want to make money.  I’d argue most don’t care about winning as long as they make money.   

They are already crazy rich, none of them bought a team to increase their wealth. They did buy the teams as a vanity exercise and people like that want to win. Additionally they sure don't want to be a loser.

Current TV/Media revenue to each team is $250-300,000,000. That alone will cover the expense of putting a team on the field. If all they are worried about is money, then the quickest way to raise the value of the team is to build a winner. These guys not only want the newest jet and biggest yacht, they want to wave that SB ring in everyone else's face...bottom line, they want to win. Some just can't figure out how.

6 hours ago, PurplePride92 said:

NFL owners want to make money.  I’d argue most don’t care about winning as long as they make money.   

 I don't buy that. See post above.

13 hours ago, Jumper_Dad said:

They are already crazy rich, none of them bought a team to increase their wealth. They did buy the teams as a vanity exercise and people like that want to win. Additionally they sure don't want to be a loser.

Current TV/Media revenue to each team is $250-300,000,000. That alone will cover the expense of putting a team on the field. If all they are worried about is money, then the quickest way to raise the value of the team is to build a winner. These guys not only want the newest jet and biggest yacht, they want to wave that SB ring in everyone else's face...bottom line, they want to win. Some just can't figure out how.

We’ll just have to disagree.  Too many average and mediocre teams for me to believe otherwise.  You’re telling me that men competent enough to become billionaires aren’t competent enough to put a winning product on the field?  

Yeah, okay. 
 

Mike Brown stumbled into a Super Bowl.  He didn’t plan this.  
 

 

 

8 hours ago, Voice of Reason said:

 I don't buy that. See post above.

We’re all entitled to our opinions.  You’ll never convince me that a majority of owners care about winning.  
 

The Denver Broncos are valued at 4 Billion dollars and have a total of what……..  two Super Bowl wins since 1995.  Outstanding commitment to winning.  
 

The Dallas Cowboys haven’t won a playoff game since when?  How much are they worth?  6.5 Billion.  More than any franchise in the NFL.  The Cowboys.  America’s Team.  A shining example of mediocrity.  Simply contending for a Super Bowl adds another 500M of worth to the franchise.  They don’t even have to be in the Super Bowl to add 500M of worth to the franchise.  You sure Jerry is sad about his team being trash?  

55 minutes ago, PurplePride92 said:

We’re all entitled to our opinions.  You’ll never convince me that a majority of owners care about winning.  
 

The Denver Broncos are valued at 4 Billion dollars and have a total of what……..  two Super Bowl wins since 1995.  Outstanding commitment to winning.  
 

The Dallas Cowboys haven’t won a playoff game since when?  How much are they worth?  6.5 Billion.  More than any franchise in the NFL.  The Cowboys.  America’s Team.  A shining example of mediocrity.  Simply contending for a Super Bowl adds another 500M of worth to the franchise.  They don’t even have to be in the Super Bowl to add 500M of worth to the franchise.  You sure Jerry is sad about his team being trash?  

 I see Jerry Jones a lot like Mike Brown in this way - nobody wants to win more than Jerry Jones. But like Mike, he just isn't very good at putting a team together.

Jerry Jones spends more money on his players than just about anyone.  He overpays his star players. He makes trades trying to bring in talent. He just isn't very good at putting a winning team on the field. But that dude wants to win.

15 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

 I see Jerry Jones a lot like Mike Brown in this way - nobody wants to win more than Jerry Jones. But like Mike, he just isn't very good at putting a team together.

Jerry Jones spends more money on his players than just about anyone.  He overpays his star players. He makes trades trying to bring in talent. He just isn't very good at putting a winning team on the field. But that dude wants to win.

Sure he wants to win. Making money is more important.  That much is clear.  

I'd think for most making money and winning aren't mutually exclusive.  Winning makes more money, doesn't it?  Especially in a sport with salary caps and all.

On 2/7/2022 at 9:18 AM, CincySportsFan said:

Off the cuff, here's what I'd propose...a dead period in hiring.  Six weeks from the end of the regular season before you can sign anyone.  Gives a ton of time for interviews to be done, and has less of an impact on deserving coordinators who have their teams in the playoffs.

I would hope most owners would look at that six week period as a positive, in the sense that they can find not only their best fit, but also their second best and third best, etc.  Heck, you could easily interview 10-15 prospects over that time period if you wanted to.  

In addition to what others have said regarding getting up to speed on the draft, etc., hiring one's own assistant coaches is a huge reason not to delay the hiring of a HC.  Most Head Coaches want to hire their own set of assistants.  The delay you suggests puts them way behind the eight ball in hiring assistants and makes getting together a good draft strategy even harder.  Plus, some of the guys a new HC may want to pick could have been hired during that 6-week delay by existing head coaches on other teams who have a vacancy.