You thinking of moving to Texas, Jesse? Think of how taxes would spike in Texas if it became its own country. (Have to fund a military, come up with a substitute for Social Security, on and on.) Also think about how many companies and talented people would leave the state if the secesh vote succeeded.

 

Gotta say, me and TTP don't agree on much, if anything, but have to agree with him here. If it became it's own country I am quite sure it would make deals/agreements with the US, just like any other country, and the US would probably supply some military protections just like NATO countries in other places, but still the logistics would be a nightmare I think and it would probably be a net loss for them.

It would be bad. But not something that could not be overcome. I can sit here and ask all the same questions and thinking about this I have, but to think this could not work is to believe the USA is so good we cant do anything any other way or it will fail. Scary part in this is $$$$ controls people to the point they are scared to do anything or even think of anything different. Like I said before this says alot about our society as a whole.

 

Now you guys debate this or tell me how it cant cant cant cant be done. I have to work lol.

 

Why are we debating that it can't be done. Anything can be done. It's a matter of how well it would work. It wouldn't.

 

More importantly, this is an academic discussion since there is ZERO chance it will EVER happen.

I don't think the Colonial America example works. Much of the Independence clamor came because there was an ocean of distance, literally, from England. Texas is right beside the USA and locked into the grid.

 

As for thinking outside the box, I am. I just am not thinking outside of the Universe. :thumb:

 

Sure Texas will revamp what government is for. But they will still need roads, military, governance and the mechanisms for a vibrant society. I just don't see that as a possibility in any scenario.

 

The major factors in the Revolutionary War could very well apply today.

 

The general agreement of historians (though rarely, if ever taught in school) are a series of actions by the King of England that hurt the colonies. Replace King with 'Federal Government' and colonies with 'States' and there are some interesting parallels.

 

- Heavy taxation: In the 1700s the King applied taxes to colonies to pay for French-Indian wars where England went into debt funding its military operations in North America. Taxation to fund a destitute government is an issue today.

 

Link: What Were the Most Important Causes of the American Revolution in the British Colonies? | The Classroom | Synonym

 

- The Currency Act: The King forced the colonies to accept only England private bank currency and not use any colony-based banking as they were doing. Ben Franklin indicated this was the actual final trigger leading to the Revolution. Today, our currency is controlled by a private bank - the Federal Reserve. The currency is not controlled at all by the government. Attempts by two notable Presidents to establish actual government issued currency evaporated after their untimely deaths - Lincoln and Kennedy. So today, the Federal government is forcing private bank currency on the people, not unlike how the King did so in late 1700s.

 

Links:

The Role of Foreign Banks in US History | Veterans Today

 

Under pressure from the Bank of England, George III passes currency act forbidding the use of colonial scrip (paper money) in the American colonies. Forced to use scarce gold and silver coins issued by the Bank of England, the colonies are plunged into deep depression with massive unemployment. Benjamin Franklin maintains this, not the tea tax, triggers the American Revolution.

 

Currency Acts

 

The Currency Acts of 1751 and 1764 were one of the causes of the Revolutionary War. The Acts were an attempt by Parliament to limit the colonies' ability to create their own currency. It was both an attempt to solve possible inflation and control the colonies.

 

- The Intolerable Acts. A series of acts in reaction to the Boston Tea Party. Today, many consider the mandates of ACA, the EPA, etc. 'intolerable'.

 

If one reads the grievances in the Declaration of Independence one would find a number of them, maybe half or more, apply to the situations of today. It seems the root causes of political unrest have not really changed over 200 years. Heavy taxation, currency control and unpopular, dictated mandates from a powerful central government - be it a King or massive bureaucracy.

We are still debating this? :lol2:

The major factors in the Revolutionary War could very well apply today.

 

The general agreement of historians (though rarely, if ever taught in school) are a series of actions by the King of England that hurt the colonies. Replace King with 'Federal Government' and colonies with 'States' and there are some interesting parallels.

 

- Heavy taxation: In the 1700s the King applied taxes to colonies to pay for French-Indian wars where England went into debt funding its military operations in North America. Taxation to fund a destitute government is an issue today.

 

Link: What Were the Most Important Causes of the American Revolution in the British Colonies? | The Classroom | Synonym

 

- The Currency Act: The King forced the colonies to accept only England private bank currency and not use any colony-based banking as they were doing. Ben Franklin indicated this was the actual final trigger leading to the Revolution. Today, our currency is controlled by a private bank - the Federal Reserve. The currency is not controlled at all by the government. Attempts by two notable Presidents to establish actual government issued currency evaporated after their untimely deaths - Lincoln and Kennedy. So today, the Federal government is forcing private bank currency on the people, not unlike how the King did so in late 1700s.

 

Links:

The Role of Foreign Banks in US History | Veterans Today

 

Under pressure from the Bank of England, George III passes currency act forbidding the use of colonial scrip (paper money) in the American colonies. Forced to use scarce gold and silver coins issued by the Bank of England, the colonies are plunged into deep depression with massive unemployment. Benjamin Franklin maintains this, not the tea tax, triggers the American Revolution.

 

Currency Acts

 

The Currency Acts of 1751 and 1764 were one of the causes of the Revolutionary War. The Acts were an attempt by Parliament to limit the colonies' ability to create their own currency. It was both an attempt to solve possible inflation and control the colonies.

 

- The Intolerable Acts. A series of acts in reaction to the Boston Tea Party. Today, many consider the mandates of ACA, the EPA, etc. 'intolerable'.

 

If one reads the grievances in the Declaration of Independence one would find a number of them, maybe half or more, apply to the situations of today. It seems the root causes of political unrest have not really changed over 200 years. Heavy taxation, currency control and unpopular, dictated mandates from a powerful central government - be it a King or massive bureaucracy.

 

Great facts to bring up. I'm not denying the grievances. I am saying that the difference is logistics now versus 1775. Maintaining an empire from across an ocean was just plain hard for England.

 

Maintaining Texas as a separate Republic on the border of the mother country is harder IMO.

 

I don't doubt the problems or grievances. I doubt the logistics of comparing the two events as possible.

So said the polls on Brexit.

 

It's not REMOTELY the same...not even the same universe.

Think of a small school that's been around for a while wanting to start a varsity football team from scratch today. And maybe this isn't the best analogy but I think it kind of fits. Think of all the logistics and infrastructure that has to go on (playing/practice facilities, coaches, training, etc.), then all the money it takes to supply the needed, updated equipment. It could bankrupt a public school...might be a little easier but still awfully hard even for a loaded private school.

Still no one addressed my question... Would the Union let this happen?

The last time states attempted things got rather messy.

Still no one addressed my question... Would the Union let this happen?

The last time states attempted things got rather messy.

 

Lol. The current administration can barely form a coherent strategy to combat terrorists actively seeking out to kill Americans, an ever increasing North Korean Military, an emboldened Russia or China. We have shown time and time again we cant control our borders, and we cant do anything to stop homegrown terrorists. Our government is more divided now than in the past several decade, which is mirrored by our society.

 

What makes you think it matters what the Union wants? Do you think the Union would be able to stop Texas, if Texas really wanted to? Americans can hardly stomach killing middle easterners thousands of miles away, which they only hear about over the news. Do you think that Americans could stomach seeing other Americans die, if it got "messy" like it did before?

What makes you think it matters what the Union wants? Do you think the Union would be able to stop Texas, if Texas really wanted to? Americans can hardly stomach killing middle easterners thousands of miles away, which they only hear about over the news. Do you think that Americans could stomach seeing other Americans die, if it got "messy" like it did before?

 

Your on to something there. It wouldn't get messy at all. In fact I think our government would still openly trade with them (Texas produces a lot of oil) and would certainly offer them military protection if needed. I'm late to the party and don't want to get into a big debate about it since I don't believe it will ever happen in my lifetime. But if any state could succeed and make it work, Texas is the only one I can think of. I also really doubt that USA would turn their back on them if they did leave the union. We would likely work out a similar deal as we did with Japan, military protection in return for something we need. With Japan it was electronics, with Texas it would be oil.

There are more than 30 US military locations/bases in Texas. If they are closed, do you think that is good or bad for Texas economically?

 

They'd to close wouldn't they? They house US troops not Texas troops. They'd have to form their own armed forces. :lol2:

Still no one addressed my question... Would the Union let this happen?

The last time states attempted things got rather messy.

 

Yep, and then invade and take over their weak country the following week. :lol2: :lol2:

Since Brexit the US stock market has lost over 1.2 Trillion dollars as just reported by the NBC nightly news. If more EU countries leave think about how much will be gone. If Texas were to leave imagine the crying over what the stock market would do then.....

Your on to something there. It wouldn't get messy at all. In fact I think our government would still openly trade with them (Texas produces a lot of oil) and would certainly offer them military protection if needed. I'm late to the party and don't want to get into a big debate about it since I don't believe it will ever happen in my lifetime. But if any state could succeed and make it work, Texas is the only one I can think of. I also really doubt that USA would turn their back on them if they did leave the union. We would likely work out a similar deal as we did with Japan, military protection in return for something we need. With Japan it was electronics, with Texas it would be oil.

 

As much as anything, it was having a satellite friend so close to communist China and North Korea.

As much as anything, it was having a satellite friend so close to communist China and North Korea.

 

I get that, but Texas produces a lot of oil and this country uses a lot of oil. With Japan we wanted electronics for the military. Oil from Texas would be a similar deal other than we are not protecting for that sole reason. We would also be protecting them because they would share a border with our country. If a country were to attack "Texas" it would be a major security issue for the USA. We would help out to help ourselves out so to speak.