:lol2: :lol2: :lol2:

I appreciate your honesty. Basically you are profiling the guy, which I don't have a problem with in most circumstances. We will have to agree to disagree on this one. I think it absolutely absurd and basically insane to allow men (transgender or not) to use women's facilities. You and others don't.

 

For me, it is really more than just the bathroom issue, although that IS a big problem in my book. This is symbolic as to where we are headed as a society. As I stated before, we have become so narcissistic as a society, that we now say we have to allow people to "identify" as to what they are. This is just insane to me and will just get worse. We already have people identifying themselves as men or women when they are not and black and white when they are not. Where does it end? I just totally reject that people can just call themselves what they want to be instead of what they are... and what is worse is that people who think this is insane are called bigots and intolerant. Sorry PP, you are a black guy and if you say you identify yourself as a white woman, I am calling hooey on that:)!

 

Enough for me on the subject. I've made my points...RJS, don't feel the need to respond with another long diatribe. You will not change my mind and I will not change yours.

 

1. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind. I'm simply saying that I don't care who uses what bathroom. If I feared for my kid or wife's safety in ANY situation then I'll be right there with them to protect them.

 

2. I'm not the least bit bothered by people who have your stance on the issue. I don't understand why anyone cares about this bathroom issue as much as people do because I don't buy that bathrooms are going to become a breeding ground for violent acts upon women and children. And even if they do then my advice to the world would be to clear your bowels and bladders before you leave the house and accompany your children everywhere.

 

3. I can't identify as a white man let alone a white woman. :lol2:

3. I can't identify as a white man let alone a white woman. :lol2:

 

You could be in "White Chicks 2"!

I can't believe that there are people that advocate anybody using any bathroom in public. That is about as a moronic idea there can be. It's as moronic As It Gets. When a society will stand up for nothing right it will fall for anything wrong never ever have I seen such stupidity. I will stand by the fact that nobody outside of my daughter's gender is going into the bathroom with her. If I'm there and it happens it'll be what it's going to be. The rest of you people can bend over ( pun intended) and giv in to one or two people screaming kicking and crying about how their feelings are hurt. Get up and rub some dirt on it and get over yourself you just can't force everything you want to do on society. That's why there's laws and moral guidelines on how you should interact with each other. You just don't get to do everything you want because you want to that's the way it works sucks to be you. Furthermore if you would let one of your children or your wife in a situation like that and not do anything about it but sit there and watch as an obedient PC puppet you in my opinion are not a real man , you're not even fit to raise children or have a wife. That's the problem with society today we used to raise real men now we're raising a bunch of silly soft useless human beings. If you're not going to put on your big-boy pants and Lead like God has called you to, maybe you should be wearing a dress and using the women's bathroom.

 

Not suggesting that they would have nefarious intentions, though perhaps some might, are you comfortable with the present men/woman bathroom distinctions knowing that lesbian woman, either feminine or masculine types, utilize the same bathroom that your daughter does, and if not what might you suggest would be a solution while also taking into consideration that not all lesbian woman are easily identifiably lesbian? Chances are a male transgender would be less interested, and likely not at all, in your daughter than a lesbian woman might be.

 

To be clear I have read this entire thread taking into consideration everyone's points, and I'll be perfectly honest that SOME on both sides of the discussion have made valid points displaying that this topic isn't as cut and dried as some from either side would like to believe.

 

I'm not at all surprised by the representation of the "Just the way it's always been" types as that is par for the course in society. It was the "Just the way it's always been types" who were also resistant to recycle years ago ridiculing advocates of it as tree huggers, hippies, beatniks, and fruits and nuts. Some have come along and now get the benefits of recycling but have completely forgotten just who it was that pushed for it in the first place and the resistance they got, and that if it were up to them it never would have happened.

 

The point that nothing about the way it's always been has ever prevented anyone with ill intentions from acting out stands out, but on the flip side I do get where some might think that this opens the door for some male perverts to pretend to be a transgender to gain access.

 

No matter the rule however, perverts will be perverts, and I'm not aware of a present or past problem where men have dressed as women on purpose to gain access to the women's room for ill-intent, and I'm not so sure that you'd see an increase in that if the laws were to change to allow transgenders to use the bathroom associated to the gender they identify with.

 

If I were in the men's room and a very masculine transgender woman came in and entered a stall I could care less. She's behind a closed door anyhow. If she passed me at a urinal to get there, I still don't think that I would care. Chances are if she is a masculine woman there's little chance that she would stop and stare anyhow, and even less of a chance that she/he's going to try to relieve his/her self at the urinal.

 

Considering that women's rooms have only stalls, then a male transgender guy/gal that goes into the women's room will still be in a stall to do his business, and if there is not ill intent then he's not watching anyone, and no one is watching him.

 

The biggest thing IMO that should be more the focus than anything else would to be have dividers in the men's room between urinals to eliminate that which has taken place for centuries giving gay guys with wandering eyes free and easy access to peek at other men relieving themselves.

 

And why is it that so many straight guys are comfortable about hauling their junk out while standing right next to other straight men hauling their junk out? Gay or straight, you'd think that this could prove to be awkward, yet for the most part it's been the accepted way public men's restrooms have been set up for eternity, and other than a straight guy not wanting a gay guy looking at him, he's cool with standing next to his best bud shooting the bull while taking care of business.

 

Woman have the freedom to pee in private, but men usually don't unless they go to a stall to do so. I suppose men have accepted the way men's rooms are set up just because that's the way it's always been, but considering that more and more restrooms are providing dividers it would appear that at least someone is beginning to think about men's privacy as well, and also decreasing the chance for perversion.

 

Because I'm gay, some of you are obviously wondering how I conduct myself in the men's room, and because I don't want any bit of trouble one iota, nor am I interested in watching anyone pee, I stare directly at the wall ahead of me, finish my business and move along. The last thing I need is some overly quick to wanna fight drunk meat head wanting to cause a scene. I consider myself a pretty straight looking gay guy anyhow, so it's never been a problem that anyone thinks I'm gay anyhow under the circumstances.

 

I recall years ago standing in line to "go" at an arena heavy metal show with drunk metal heads peeing in the sinks, or breathing down your neck to hurry up looking for any reason to fight, and me being so nervous that once it was my turn I couldn't go anyhow no matter how much I needed to. No one singled me out but these were the type of harsh sophomoric punks that wouldn't hesitate to shout "All you faggots better hurry up!"

 

Anyhow though I went astray and got all wordy like a typically do, I'd still be interested in hearing what you think regarding the question that I posed to you in my first paragraph.

^ Excellent question.

Not suggesting that they would have nefarious intentions, though perhaps some might, are you comfortable with the present men/woman bathroom distinctions knowing that lesbian woman, either feminine or masculine types, utilize the same bathroom that your daughter does, and if not what might you suggest would be a solution while also taking into consideration that not all lesbian woman are easily identifiably lesbian? Chances are a male transgender would be less interested, and likely not at all, in your daughter than a lesbian woman might be.

 

To be clear I have read this entire thread taking into consideration everyone's points, and I'll be perfectly honest that SOME on both sides of the discussion have made valid points displaying that this topic isn't as cut and dried as some from either side would like to believe.

 

I'm not at all surprised by the representation of the "Just the way it's always been" types as that is par for the course in society. It was the "Just the way it's always been types" who were also resistant to recycle years ago ridiculing advocates of it as tree huggers, hippies, beatniks, and fruits and nuts. Some have come along and now get the benefits of recycling but have completely forgotten just who it was that pushed for it in the first place and the resistance they got, and that if it were up to them it never would have happened.

 

The point that nothing about the way it's always been has ever prevented anyone with ill intentions from acting out stands out, but on the flip side I do get where some might think that this opens the door for some male perverts to pretend to be a transgender to gain access.

 

No matter the rule however, perverts will be perverts, and I'm not aware of a present or past problem where men have dressed as women on purpose to gain access to the women's room for ill-intent, and I'm not so sure that you'd see an increase in that if the laws were to change to allow transgenders to use the bathroom associated to the gender they identify with.

 

If I were in the men's room and a very masculine transgender woman came in and entered a stall I could care less. She's behind a closed door anyhow. If she passed me at a urinal to get there, I still don't think that I would care. Chances are if she is a masculine woman there's little chance that she would stop and stare anyhow, and even less of a chance that she/he's going to try to relieve his/her self at the urinal.

 

Considering that women's rooms have only stalls, then a male transgender guy/gal that goes into the women's room will still be in a stall to do his business, and if there is not ill intent then he's not watching anyone, and no one is watching him.

 

The biggest thing IMO that should be more the focus than anything else would to be have dividers in the men's room between urinals to eliminate that which has taken place for centuries giving gay guys with wandering eyes free and easy access to peek at other men relieving themselves.

 

And why is it that so many straight guys are comfortable about hauling their junk out while standing right next to other straight men hauling their junk out? Gay or straight, you'd think that this could prove to be awkward, yet for the most part it's been the accepted way public men's restrooms have been set up for eternity, and other than a straight guy not wanting a gay guy looking at him, he's cool with standing next to his best bud shooting the bull while taking care of business.

 

Woman have the freedom to pee in private, but men usually don't unless they go to a stall to do so. I suppose men have accepted the way men's rooms are set up just because that's the way it's always been, but considering that more and more restrooms are providing dividers it would appear that at least someone is beginning to think about men's privacy as well, and also decreasing the chance for perversion.

 

Because I'm gay, some of you are obviously wondering how I conduct myself in the men's room, and because I don't want any bit of trouble one iota, nor am I interested in watching anyone pee, I stare directly at the wall ahead of me, finish my business and move along. The last thing I need is some overly quick to wanna fight drunk meat head wanting to cause a scene. I consider myself a pretty straight looking gay guy anyhow, so it's never been a problem that anyone thinks I'm gay anyhow under the circumstances.

 

I recall years ago standing in line to "go" at an arena heavy metal show with drunk metal heads peeing in the sinks, or breathing down your neck to hurry up looking for any reason to fight, and me being so nervous that once it was my turn I couldn't go anyhow no matter how much I needed to. No one singled me out but these were the type of harsh sophomoric punks that wouldn't hesitate to shout "All you faggots better hurry up!"

 

Anyhow though I went astray and got all wordy like a typically do, I'd still be interested in hearing what you think regarding the question that I posed to you in my first paragraph.

 

Transgenders and gays don't bother me. Allowing anyone the right to enter any bathroom is too broad and allows those who do have nefarious intentions access to easily those environments. So it isimply can't be allowed.

Transgenders and gays don't bother me. Allowing anyone the right to enter any bathroom is too broad and allows those who do have nefarious intentions access to easily those environments. So it isimply can't be allowed.

 

So, how to enforce? Signs (won't work)? Armed guards? Somewhere in between?

So, how to enforce? Signs (won't work)? Armed guards? Somewhere in between?

 

Guess if you walk in on the family and they come tell me I'll have to enforce it. It's a difficult question, but since there is no obvious answer we should not open pandoras box. The laws as is should stand untill a better answer than letting regular men who will lie go into the womens restroom.

You could be in "White Chicks 2"!

 

No lie, I could do that. Word.

Guess if you walk in on the family and they come tell me I'll have to enforce it. It's a difficult question, but since there is no obvious answer we should not open pandoras box. The laws as is should stand untill a better answer than letting regular men who will lie go into the womens restroom.

 

What is the current bathroom statute? I didn't realize that there was one.

If my BPH is screaming loud enough and the Men's bathroom is unavailable, I don't care what the law is, I'm using the Ladies room!

Come on in!

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What about the guy that follows your son into the men's room?? Male sex offenders use the same men's room as young boys. Or is that not as big of an issue??