It is not just kids. PP, if your wife goes into a public restroom and you watch a dude walk in right after her, what would you do ? Just assume everything is OK?

 

I am not trying to be funny...just seriously asking the question.

 

I need more context. Was he stalking us or following us around? Is he creepy looking? Black? White? Does he look clean or dirty? Does he have on a suit? Is he intoxicated? Do I know him? Where is the bathroom at? Walmart? Target? McDonald's? Guadalajara? The Blue Heron? Bengals game? Does she have to go real bad or can she hold it if she feels threatened? #1 or #2? Is the bathroom clean? Well lit?

 

I need more context to give you an honest answer and even still at the end of the day if she is that scared and has to go real bad and wants me in there then I'm going in there. We tend to be pretty aware of our surroundings. If she didn't want to use the bathroom after a dude followed her in there then she wouldn't. It's really that simple.

It seems (at least to me) that where we disagree is whether or not a bunch of dudes will start simply using the ladies because they "can". You believe they will. I don't. Can you imagine the reception a dude will get if he walks into a crowded ladies room in any of the situations you mention?? It won't be pretty. And no way will he get a chance to peek in on any lady doing her business. Any guy brave enough to try, is going to find out pretty quickly that the ladies room is no place for guys to be and that they aren't welcome. And there's zero chance he'll have an opportunity to commit some crime. The social norms and practices are strong enough that people aren't regularly going to try to cross that line.

 

In response to the bolded sentence: this is precisely what is being destroyed by allowing men to use women's restrooms and locker rooms. There will be no social norms if we keep heading in the direction we are going. You think "Social norms and practices will be strong enough to" keep non-transgender men (that is anatomical males) from going into the women's restrooms? If laws don't do it, neither will these social norms that are being weakened and soon to be extinct.

In response to the bolded sentence: this is precisely what is being destroyed by allowing men to use women's restrooms and locker rooms. There will be no social norms if we keep heading in the direction we are going. You think "Social norms and practices will be strong enough to" keep non-transgender men (that is anatomical males) from going into the women's restrooms? If laws don't do it, neither will these social norms that are being weakened and soon to be extinct.

 

Social norms do change over time. Some Things that weren't acceptable 50 years ago are acceptable now. Society evolves over time. You may not always agree with the way things evolve, but that ddoesn't sent stop it from happening.

Segregating bathrooms/locker rooms by sex is a good idea. Doing so has a longstanding track record of being quite functional and providing a private place for people to feel safe.

 

Segregated by sex bathrooms/locker rooms provide privacy, first of all, and public safety. They allow patrons to feel safe while showering or changing clothes or using the lavatory to a degree that cannot be achieved by making it "normal" for folks from the opposite sex to be present. Not all locker rooms/changing rooms have private changing areas or private showers. Not all restrooms have doors on the stall.

 

What is being proposed violates the basic right to privacy that we as humans have. It is the right that I want my children to have.

 

Here's where we are headed...

 

In Midland, Michigan, a woman’s gym membership was suspended after she witnessed a man using the women’s locker room and insisted on telling other women at the gym what she saw. Yvette Cormier, 48, said that on Sunday, February 28, she walked into the Midland Planet Fitness locker room last Saturday and saw a man wearing a wig and “a little bit of blush” who was “huge” and appeared “very manly.” She told ABC News, “I just stopped right there in my tracks. It was a man for sure.”

 

When she inquired of the front desk why a man was there, the employee answered that the man identified as a woman. Cormier approached the Planet Fitness’ corporate office, only to be told, according to Cormier, that Planet Fitness policy is “whatever gender you feel you are, that’s the locker room you’re allowed to go in… We’ve had lots of complaints about him but we told him to go change in a stall… if you’re uncomfortable with that you can wait until he’s done in there.”

 

Cormier said she asked, “How about he waits until I’m done in the women’s locker room? Or get a unisex bathroom?” When the employee asked if she wanted to speak with the manager, Cormier responded, ‘I’m calling corporate.'”

 

Cormier asserted that she went back to the gym every day through Thursday, and informed other women about what she had seen. That prompted the Planet Fitness’ corporate office to call and tell her she was violating their “no judgement” policy. They asked her if she would stop speaking to other women about the issue. She refused, so they suspended her membership.

 

McCall Gosselin, public relations director for Planet Fitness, stated that whatever gender identity a person decides to use allows them to use that particular locker room. Large, intimidating men dressed up as women have every right to use the women’s locker room. His statement read:

 

Planet Fitness is committed to creating a non-intimidating, welcoming environment for our members. Our gender identity non-discrimination policy states that members and guests may use all gym facilities based on their sincere self-reported gender identity. The manner in which this member expressed her concerns about the policy exhibited behavior that management at the Midland club deemed inappropriate and disruptive to other members, which is a violation of the membership agreement and as a result her membership was cancelled.

 

Cormier said that the policy does not create a safe environment for women, and commented, “I feel it’s kind of one-sided. I feel like I am the one who is being punished.” She said her solution would be to offer a third locker room for transgender people. The women’s locker room features s private changing stalls and includes bathroom stalls with doors.

 

Link to the full article: Planet Fitness Bans Woman for Protesting Man in Locker Room

 

The person who calls for common decency and courtesy is the one who is being punished. That's a microcosm of what is happening in our society.

Social norms do change over time. Some Things that weren't acceptable 50 years ago are acceptable now. Society evolves over time. You may not always agree with the way things evolve, but that ddoesn't sent stop it from happening.

 

Then you agree with me that saying social norms will prevent the behavior in question is a weak argument. It won't stop the behavior you said it will especially when the very social norms you allude to our being undercut by the so-called "right" for a male to be in the female restrooms/locker rooms.

Segregating bathrooms/locker rooms by sex is a good idea. Doing so has a longstanding track record of being quite functional and providing a private place for people to feel safe.

 

Segregated by sex bathrooms/locker rooms provide privacy, first of all, and public safety. They allow patrons to feel safe while showering or changing clothes or using the lavatory to a degree that cannot be achieved by making it "normal" for folks from the opposite sex to be present. Not all locker rooms/changing rooms have private changing areas or private showers. Not all restrooms have doors on the stall.

 

What is being proposed violates the basic right to privacy that we as humans have. It is the right that I want my children to have.

 

Here's where we are headed...

 

In Midland, Michigan, a woman’s gym membership was suspended after she witnessed a man using the women’s locker room and insisted on telling other women at the gym what she saw. Yvette Cormier, 48, said that on Sunday, February 28, she walked into the Midland Planet Fitness locker room last Saturday and saw a man wearing a wig and “a little bit of blush” who was “huge” and appeared “very manly.” She told ABC News, “I just stopped right there in my tracks. It was a man for sure.”

 

When she inquired of the front desk why a man was there, the employee answered that the man identified as a woman. Cormier approached the Planet Fitness’ corporate office, only to be told, according to Cormier, that Planet Fitness policy is “whatever gender you feel you are, that’s the locker room you’re allowed to go in… We’ve had lots of complaints about him but we told him to go change in a stall… if you’re uncomfortable with that you can wait until he’s done in there.”

 

Cormier said she asked, “How about he waits until I’m done in the women’s locker room? Or get a unisex bathroom?” When the employee asked if she wanted to speak with the manager, Cormier responded, ‘I’m calling corporate.'”

 

Cormier asserted that she went back to the gym every day through Thursday, and informed other women about what she had seen. That prompted the Planet Fitness’ corporate office to call and tell her she was violating their “no judgement” policy. They asked her if she would stop speaking to other women about the issue. She refused, so they suspended her membership.

 

McCall Gosselin, public relations director for Planet Fitness, stated that whatever gender identity a person decides to use allows them to use that particular locker room. Large, intimidating men dressed up as women have every right to use the women’s locker room. His statement read:

 

Planet Fitness is committed to creating a non-intimidating, welcoming environment for our members. Our gender identity non-discrimination policy states that members and guests may use all gym facilities based on their sincere self-reported gender identity. The manner in which this member expressed her concerns about the policy exhibited behavior that management at the Midland club deemed inappropriate and disruptive to other members, which is a violation of the membership agreement and as a result her membership was cancelled.

 

Cormier said that the policy does not create a safe environment for women, and commented, “I feel it’s kind of one-sided. I feel like I am the one who is being punished.” She said her solution would be to offer a third locker room for transgender people. The women’s locker room features s private changing stalls and includes bathroom stalls with doors.

 

Link to the full article: Planet Fitness Bans Woman for Protesting Man in Locker Room

 

The person who calls for common decency and courtesy is the one who is being punished. That's a microcosm of what is happening in our society.

 

What did other people at the gym have to say about it? Was she the only one speaking out about it?

What did other people at the gym have to say about it? Was she the only one speaking out about it?

 

Well, if you look further into the case you'll see a few things. First, the person in question is a legit transgender. Second, that person never threatened, harassed, attacked or otherwise accosted the other lady in any way. In fact, the person in question came forward publicly and offered her side of the story. The end result was the lawsuit was dismissed.

Well, if you look further into the case you'll see a few things. First, the person in question is a legit transgender. Second, that person never threatened, harassed, attacked or otherwise accosted the other lady in any way. In fact, the person in question came forward publicly and offered her side of the story. The end result was the lawsuit was dismissed.

 

Thanks for the rest of the story.

What did other people at the gym have to say about it? Was she the only one speaking out about it?

 

From the article they had lots of complaints.

 

When she inquired of the front desk why a man was there, the employee answered that the man identified as a woman. Cormier approached the Planet Fitness’ corporate office, only to be told, according to Cormier, that Planet Fitness policy is “whatever gender you feel you are, that’s the locker room you’re allowed to go in… We’ve had lots of complaints about him but we told him to go change in a stall… if you’re uncomfortable with that you can wait until he’s done in there.”

 

Well, if you look further into the case you'll see a few things. First, the person in question is a legit transgender. Second, that person never threatened, harassed, attacked or otherwise accosted the other lady in any way. In fact, the person in question came forward publicly and offered her side of the story. The end result was the lawsuit was dismissed.

 

The point is the actual female was uncomfortable with a male in the locker room as were many other females as there were many complaints about "him." The right to privacy and the right to feel safe in a women's locker room are ignored to favor this trangender person's desire to be in the women's locker room.

 

Thanks for the rest of the story.

 

Huh? I must have missed "the rest of the story" that you must have gleaned from rjs4440's response. I didn't see any mention of lawsuit in the article I linked that had to do with this incident. The end of the article did mention a separate issue with Planet Fitness in which there was allegedly a camera taping unclothed people in the tanning bed. That is a separate unrelated issue.

 

The only story here is that a woman can't go into the locker room at Planet Fitness with the expectation that she will not encounter a man in there because that is the accepted practice at Planet Fitness.

From the article they had lots of complaints.

 

When she inquired of the front desk why a man was there, the employee answered that the man identified as a woman. Cormier approached the Planet Fitness’ corporate office, only to be told, according to Cormier, that Planet Fitness policy is “whatever gender you feel you are, that’s the locker room you’re allowed to go in… We’ve had lots of complaints about him but we told him to go change in a stall… if you’re uncomfortable with that you can wait until he’s done in there.”

 

 

 

The point is the actual female was uncomfortable with a male in the locker room as were many other females as there were many complaints about "him." The right to privacy and the right to feel safe in a women's locker room are ignored to favor this trangender person's desire to be in the women's locker room.

 

 

 

Huh? I must have missed "the rest of the story" that you must have gleaned from rjs4440's response. I didn't see any mention of lawsuit in the article I linked that had to do with this incident. The end of the article did mention a separate issue with Planet Fitness in which there was allegedly a camera taping unclothed people in the tanning bed. That is a separate unrelated issue.

 

The only story here is that a woman can't go into the locker room at Planet Fitness with the expectation that she will not encounter a man in there because that is the accepted practice at Planet Fitness.

 

Rjs didn't get his info from the article you linked. He said, "well if you look further into the case" and knowing Rjs like I do I know he did due diligence on the whole case before he spoke and mentioned the dropped lawsuit.

 

The point I was getting at is that if this business is still open and operating then obviously not as many people cared. Otherwise they'd go workout somewhere else and that gym would close. There are gyms everywhere. There isn't a law that says people can only work out at Planet Fitness. She should go find a gym that suits her needs. I guarantee it will be very very similar to Planet Fitness.

Rjs didn't get his info from the article you linked. He said, "well if you look further into the case" and knowing Rjs like I do I know he did due diligence on the whole case before he spoke and mentioned the dropped lawsuit.

 

The point I was getting at is that if this business is still open and operating then obviously not as many people cared. Otherwise they'd go workout somewhere else and that gym would close. There are gyms everywhere. There isn't a law that says people can only work out at Planet Fitness. She should go find a gym that suits her needs. I guarantee it will be very very similar to Planet Fitness.

 

It is correct there was no mention of any lawsuit in oldgrappler's post. However, I figured there was more to the story, and consulted Google. There was a lawsuit filed that was eventually dismissed. Here is a quick summary from the local Midland newspaper.

 

Lawsuit involving Midland's Planet Fitness dismissed | News | ourmidland.com

This is how women feel about men in the bathroom.

 

YouTube Transgender Bathroom 'Experiment' Results In Screams Of Outrage

This is how women feel about men in the bathroom.

 

YouTube Transgender Bathroom 'Experiment' Results In Screams Of Outrage

 

How dare you stand in the way of the brainwashing machine of the media and LBGT people.

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And so do men when having to do #2