Jordan was a bully to his teammates. That has been reported. He wasn't exactly a great teammate. Even Phil Jackson says that Jordan was a bully and Kobe is a lot like how Jordan was in practice. I also don't think you can get anymore obnoxious and arrogant as MJ did during his HOF induction speech. For the record I loved it but his HOF speech was the first time I had ever seen the media turn on "the greatest player of all time" Michael Jeffrey Jordan.

Jordan has Kobe beat in the jerk department. People are often fooled by his advertisement persona. Kobe may be a little more of a hothead emotional type on the court, but there are lots of stories of Jordan getting in physical altercations with teammates. To me it seems Kobe has a lot better relationship off the court with his guys.

Never.

 

At least not until most of the MJ apologists can admit that the gap between the two is very close.

 

I'm in no way an MJ apologist and I don't think it's nearly as close as the Kobe supporters want it to be.

As for the thread, I would take Jordan and I did not think twice about it. I am as big of a Kobe fan as there is, but Jordan has just a little bit more of that "it" quality about him. That is not a knock on Kobe nor does it mean I think he stinks, but Jordan would be my pick. It is hard to ignore Jordan always being at the top of his game when he had to be, I cannot say the same for my boy, Kobe. Even in last year's finals, while he won the MVP, it was not a dominating type performance. If anything, I think Kobe presses it too much in a lot of big games instead of letting the game come to him.

Jordan has Kobe beat in the jerk department. People are often fooled by his advertisement persona. Kobe may be a little more of a hothead emotional type on the court, but there are lots of stories of Jordan getting in physical altercations with teammates. To me it seems Kobe has a lot better relationship off the court with his guys.

 

Are we talking about the same guy that was indicted for rape? The guy that admitted to "adultery" and threw Shaq and other NBA players under the bus for adultery too? Yeah he's a choir boy comparitively.

I'm in no way an MJ apologist and I don't think it's nearly as close as the Kobe supporters want it to be.

 

:thumb:

Are we talking about the same guy that was indicted for rape? The guy that admitted to "adultery" and threw Shaq and other NBA players under the bus for adultery too? Yeah he's a choir boy comparitively.

Which is exactly what I said, didn't I?

 

Jordan was a known philanderer and addicted to gambling, so I guess that is a wash

 

Adultery and pro sports go together like Peanut Butter & Jelly, just the nature of the beast. I am not going to judge moral/personal behavior in my assessment. Has Kobe had his squabbles with teammates? Sure he has; most notably a reciprocated feud with Shaq.

Which is exactly what I said, didn't I?

 

Jordan was a known philanderer and addicted to gambling, so I guess that is a wash

 

Adultery and pro sports go together like Peanut Butter & Jelly, just the nature of the beast. I am not going to judge moral/personal behavior in my assessment. Has Kobe had his squabbles with teammates? Sure he has; most notably a reciprocated feud with Shaq.

 

I just think the biggest difference is Jordan didn't show his teammates up on the court in big games like Kobe does. You mentioned it earlier and it's right. Jordan knew when to let the game come to him and when it was time to take over. Jordan trusted his teammates. Kobe wants people to think he trusts his teammates. We'll see if he really does now.

 

As far as off the court goes. I highly doubt MJ would ever tell anyone that a teammate cheats on his wife but knows how to make it go away like Kobe did. Dude you got caught raping a chick or at the very least having sex w/ her. Don't bring others into that. Own up to it like a man and move on. You don't hear Tiger blaming everyone for his sexual behavior.

As for the thread, I would take Jordan and I did not think twice about it. I am as big of a Kobe fan as there is, but Jordan has just a little bit more of that "it" quality about him. That is not a knock on Kobe nor does it mean I think he stinks, but Jordan would be my pick. It is hard to ignore Jordan always being at the top of his game when he had to be, I cannot say the same for my boy, Kobe. Even in last year's finals, while he won the MVP, it was not a dominating type performance. If anything, I think Kobe presses it too much in a lot of big games instead of letting the game come to him.

 

 

I can agree with that.

Are we talking about the same guy that was indicted for rape? The guy that admitted to "adultery" and threw Shaq and other NBA players under the bus for adultery too? Yeah he's a choir boy comparitively.

 

Shaq was the only player he threw under the bus and it wasn't like he set out to throw Shaq under the bus. He asked for the Shaq treatment. I guess big brother Shaq told him to ask for the Shaq treatment if he got in a pinch. Shaq was a well known philanderer as was MJ.

I just think the biggest difference is Jordan didn't show his teammates up on the court in big games like Kobe does. You mentioned it earlier and it's right. Jordan knew when to let the game come to him and when it was time to take over. Jordan trusted his teammates. Kobe wants people to think he trusts his teammates. We'll see if he really does now.

 

As far as off the court goes. I highly doubt MJ would ever tell anyone that a teammate cheats on his wife but knows how to make it go away like Kobe did. Dude you got caught raping a chick or at the very least having sex w/ her. Don't bring others into that. Own up to it like a man and move on. You don't hear Tiger blaming everyone for his sexual behavior.

 

He did own up to it like a man. When he "threw Shaq under the bus" was in a police interview that I am sure he never thought would make it to the public. Never once did he publicly "throw Shaq under the bus". He accepted full responsibility in the press conference with his wife sitting next to him rocking a 4 million dollar ring. He has no problems since then.

He did own up to it like a man. When he "threw Shaq under the bus" was in a police interview that I am sure he never thought would make it to the public. Never once did he publicly "throw Shaq under the bus". He accepted full responsibility in the press conference with his wife sitting next to him rocking a 4 million dollar ring. He has no problems since then.

 

Well I would hope being indicted for rape once would be enough. It's still a reach to say he's a better person or teammate off the court than MJ. Neither one of them are exactly moral off the court.

Well I would hope being indicted for rape once would be enough. It's still a reach to say he's a better person or teammate off the court than MJ. Neither one of them are exactly moral off the court.

This debate, and it seems there is barely one, should be kept to on the court perfomance. No one here has a clue to be speaking about the morality and character of these guys off the court.

When you look at players that have flat got it done when it matters most since say 1980 you got a small group of players that were the ultimate dominant players in the playoffs.

 

Michael Jordan

Magic Johnson

Larry Bird

Hakeem Olijawon

Kobe Bryant

Shaquille O'neal

Scottie Pippen

Tim Duncan

 

This is an elite group of guys who weren't only the best players in the NBA, but the ulitmate winners.

Statements like this is why I started this thread to begin with. I have said continually that MJ had a better career and if they played 10 times MJ would likely win 6 out of 10 but there are no stats or facts that prove that "it is not even close". The "not even close" mindset is mind boggling to me.

 

If it were "close" as you think it is, I would think your poll would be a little less lopsided...:sssh:

Well I would hope being indicted for rape once would be enough. It's still a reach to say he's a better person or teammate off the court than MJ. Neither one of them are exactly moral off the court.

 

I don't think any athlete is which is why I left their off the court issues out of my preliminary arguments. I'll give my side if it is spoken on.