What about the "tweeners" such as Caldwell County, Fort Campbell (who plays in a district with Hopkinsville, Christian County and University Heights), DeSales, Elizabethtown (eliminated by a 4A school), or Breathitt County. These are small-type schools too big for the All-A.

Caldwell County, Elizabethtown, and Breathitt County have all been to the Sweet Sixteen tournament in the realtively recent past.

 

Caldwell County went in 1964 and won a game.

Elizabethtown has been 5 times, winning it all as recently as 2000.

Breathitt County has been to the show 11 times with their most recent trip in 1996 is not sooner.

 

Fort Campbell and DeSales have never been to my knowledge, but then neither had we (Brossart) until 2000.

 

The fact that it is not easy is what makes it so classic. When you do win a region and get there it really makes it something to treasure.

I just don't buy the arguement it's OK to class football into four classes, then expand it to six while at the same time say Basketball doesn't need to be classed.

Caldwell County, Elizabethtown, and Breathitt County have all been to the Sweet Sixteen tournament in the realtively recent past.

 

Caldwell County went in 1964 and won a game.

Elizabethtown has been 5 times, winning it all as recently as 2000.

Breathitt County has been to the show 11 times with their most recent trip in 1996 is not sooner.

 

Fort Campbell and DeSales have never been to my knowledge, but then neither had we (Brossart) until 2000.

 

The fact that it is not easy is what makes it so classic. When you do win a region and get there it really makes it something to treasure.

 

 

A couple of points.

 

One, I'm from Caldwell County and I'm 38 years old. My "recent past" doesn't include 1964.

 

Two, I've never considered Caldwell's 2A state football championship in 1998 less than legit because it wasn't a "true" state championship.

 

Why is it OK to have classes in some sports, but not others. It's blatantly unfair to have smaller schools compete with schools three or four times their size.

 

Does "tradition" mean that since the KHSAA has stuck it to the smaller schools for so long that it's OK to just keep on doing it?

 

I'm sorry, I just don't get that argument.

I just don't buy the arguement it's OK to class football into four classes, then expand it to six while at the same time say Basketball doesn't need to be classed.

 

It is a little easier to fill a basketball roster at a smaller school than it is a football roster. Their are a lot more positions to fill in football that require a lot of different skills. The bigger schools can have 22 different kids that don't have to play both offense and defense in the same school. 4A schools may have 60 or 70 kids come out and they can fill all the positions individually. 1A schools may only have 20 kids come out so they have to play their kids on both side of the ball. This makes a single class in football totally uneven. All it takes in basketball is 8. Only 5 can play at a time and both teams play the same kids on offense and defense. The point that I'm getting at is that classifying football is not a reason to justify classifying basketball!!!!

Everyone has their own opinions on the subject so I'll give mine. I'm a big school fan and would classification be good for my school as far as state appearances are concerned, yes. In the past decade we've lost to Highlands in '98, '99, '00, '01; St. Henry in '03, both much smaller than my school. Would it be nice to have banners for AAAA state appearances, maybe so but I would rather have a "one class" banner hanging, makes it a very special accomplishment. I bet most from smaller schools would echo the same thing.

A couple of points.

 

One, I'm from Caldwell County and I'm 38 years old. My "recent past" doesn't include 1964.

 

Why is it OK to have classes in some sports, but not others. It's blatantly unfair to have smaller schools compete with schools three or four times their size.

 

Does "tradition" mean that since the KHSAA has stuck it to the smaller schools for so long that it's OK to just keep on doing it?

 

I'm sorry, I just don't get that argument.

 

O.K. - 1964, the year before I graduated from high school may be a stretch. My point is that it's not impossible - they've done it before.

 

FAIR???? Who said anything about it being fair. We all agree it's as unfair as hell. So are horseraces. There are favorites and there are longshots, but occasionally those longshots win and when they do the payoffs are large, just as would a small school winning a regional tournament.

 

I guess my point is that being a smaller school and winning a regional tournament and advancing to Rupp is, as they say in the commericial - Priceless!

 

My earlier point about Division III (our lowest conference division) schools having no chance isn't going to change no matter how you classify it until you get down to having a tournament for the best of the worst. Something they probably wouldn't be very proud of anyway.

 

I don't think that there is a real answer here. Our State Tournament system as we know it is something very special, yet very unfair. The "A" state tournament has tempered the inequality somewhat - but it is still not recognized by the KHSAA as being anything more than an invitational statewide tournament for smaller schools. They probably cringe at the sound of the term "A" State Champ - like what we have plastered all over our "A" State Champs T-Shirts.

 

Unsuccessful programs are still going to remain unsuccessful programs - some due to their own doing and others simply victimized by circumstances beyond their control.

 

Remember, I've been on both sides of the fence and I wouldn't change anything - but maybe that's just me!!!

O.K. - 1964, the year before I graduated from high school may be a stretch. My point is that it's not impossible - they've done it before.

 

FAIR???? Who said anything about it being fair. We all agree it's as unfair as hell. So are horseraces. There are favorites and there are longshots, but occasionally those longshots win and when they do the payoffs are large, just as would a small school winning a regional tournament.

 

I guess my point is that being a smaller school and winning a regional tournament and advancing to Rupp is, as they say in the commericial - Priceless!

 

My earlier point about Division III (our lowest conference division) schools having no chance isn't going to change no matter how you classify it until you get down to having a tournament for the best of the worst. Something they probably wouldn't be very proud of anyway.

 

I don't think that there is a real answer here. Our State Tournament system as we know it is something very special, yet very unfair. The "A" state tournament has tempered the inequality somewhat - but it is still not recognized by the KHSAA as being anything more than an invitational statewide tournament for smaller schools. They probably cringe at the sound of the term "A" State Champ - like what we have plastered all over our "A" State Champs T-Shirts.

 

Unsuccessful programs are still going to remain unsuccessful programs - some due to their own doing and others simply victimized by circumstances beyond their control.

 

Remember, I've been on both sides of the fence and I wouldn't change anything - but maybe that's just me!!!

Good post but there should be a number of games that count for the All A ... Just flat 2 games or something ??..... All A is not recognized by the KHSAA but should be because class would hurt KHSAA more ........ KHSAA ???? Not sure about these guys ..??

Based upon football allignments, and assuming University Heights would be 1A if they had football, over the last 20 years the champion as came from the following. 1A - 10%, 2A - 5%, 3A - 45%, 4A- 35%. Obviously the majority of the champions have came from the larger schools, however, IMO the fact that the 3A schools have won the most championships over that period of time, shows that numbers are much less important in basketball than in football.

 

If football were not classified, IMO, over the last 20 years the overall state champion would likely be a current 4A team almost every single year. Only the Lorenzen - Smith Highlands teams come to mind as possibilities to crash the 4A party. Lets face it in 4A, most of the 4A teams don't even stand a chance.

 

I agree with those that have stated if it ain't broke don't fix it. The Sweet Sixteen is a special event, and you never know what might happen. I'm a fan but I'll admit Apollo had no business being in the championship game last year, but a miracle almost happened for them.

Leave it alone, it's great the way it is.:banana:

NO! NO! NO!

No matter how much complaining is done, the KHSAA is not going to make this change. It is financial reasons and the tradition of the tournament that will keep this from ever happening.

 

Keep it the way it is right now. It has been very successful for a long time and no need to change it.

Not sure an agreeable, fair and evenly classed system of HS Basketball, will be possible, until all relative issues can be resolved.

 

Most in favor of Class, are so because to make things even/fair and in reality, that still won't exist, because the argument would then be private/public and some non-female, or non-male schools.

 

Establishing class size criteria, over enrollment is subjective, from sport to sport within a school and whom will monitor, the enrollment records and ensure compliance.

 

Has anyone, broken down the Classes and how many teams, would be in each class....Is there balance in numbers, would one significantly be greater in number, than others.

 

I'm old school, a traditionalist and currently, every team gets a chance, albeit insurmountable at times but nonetheless, a chance from District, Region and into the Sweet 16. Unless a well conceived Class system, can be implemented that addresses all the concerns, I'm not for changing....If a Class system, can be devised and is logical, then it must be considered.

 

At the same time, I'll throw this out....Don't dislike some programs, because they perennially have competitive Basketball programs, perhaps they just outwork some, who complain more....instead of working to improve.

I agree, see Indiana

 

I was reading recently that over 25,000 people were in attendance at the Indiana State Championships this year. Sounds like something is right about what they have done. Imagine how great it would be to see schools like East Carter and Rowan Co, i.e. have a chance to win a state title.

Must we rehash this every time the Sweet 16 brackets are set. Classify if you want, but no complaining when you've sucked all the magic out of the experience.

I feel that we could have a 4 class system, with 4 state tourneys. You have 4 champions. Then to be the over all state champ you could have 3 more games. 4A vs 2A, 3A vs 1A then have the winners play for the over all KENTCUKY STATE CHAMP. All 4 would be recognized as there class champ and for those that want an over all champ, we could do the final 3 games. I think it would still be exciting and be a few more games to watch. But then again you have to look at what private schools are put in these 4 classes. You don't want a powerhouse in each class that will win it every year and it could happen. Have to be careful with this kind of thing.