It has been that way since the dawn of time. Now private schools say we are not going to do this. So public schools say we want out and go our own way and let you guys continue. But you say no we can't split from you. We vote on the issue....wow did you count the totals...you still say no we can't leave. Just a matter of time.

It has been that way since the dawn of time. Now private schools say we are not going to do this. So public schools say we want out and go our own way and let you guys continue. But you say no we can't split from you. We vote on the issue....wow did you count the totals...you still say no we can't leave. Just a matter of time.

 

In fairness, it was the politicians who said no and quelled the Prop 20 talk. Talk to the state legislators if you want to see action.

 

I think you will ONLY see a Prop 20 action or any serious movement on the issue when a lawsuit with a grouping of public schools gets together, sue and the court rules in their favor as happened with the funding issue that let to KERA in the late 80's, early 90's.

You are right, not fair to say YOU.

 

Trinity, St.X, Assumption and Sacred Heart have distinct enrollment advantages because of their non-coed natures. 1300-1500 male students gives you a much better chance of finding football players(of course we are terrible at basketball, go figure). The 800-1000(est) that you have at Assumption and Sacred Heart, respectively, not only get the advantages of numbers but most of these girls have been playing their sports for years in the CSAA and with each other as well. Trinity and St.X both have similar advantages with football.

 

I don't deny that we have advantages, but many of the advantages that we have we have built and earned for ourselves.

 

This point that PepRock makes about the CSAA in Louisville should be greatly considered in this debate, especially agianst the backdrop of the State Football Finals this weekend.

 

The CSAA has obviously done a great job of encouraging participation for youngsters, that I sense from Louisville people I know, has paid off for many who participated on thier High School Teams. Trinity and St. X, yes have numbers advantages, but for now, conentrate on the advantage of a well-run feeder sports program.

 

You can read post after post about the Youth leauges that are connected to Highlands Football. THe saturday morning youth games, where the community is involved, the High School players interacting with the 7,8,9 year olds. When the kids are itchin' to strap it on for the Bluebirds, and expect to win four state titles at that age, how can it not be a benifit over the years for Highlands. Does Bowling Green have such a youth program? I must claim ignorance. If a BG poster would like to describe thier youth program, please do. I would not be suprised if there was a good one there.

 

In Lexington, LCA and Lexington Catholic have in the past few years, developed a good working relationship in starting a youth leauge amoungst themselves. There are and have been Parks and Rec teams in Lexington, but now many of the kids that attend Lexington Catholic and Christians direct feeder schools play in that leauge. The kids that came from the start have been playing on the same teams for a few years now. Those that started early on, are now moving onto the middle and high school teams. Could it be a cause and effect of one reason why these two teams are in the finals, and are developing strong programs in short periods of time?

 

If I didn't mention your program, and for the other teams in the finals this weekend, I apologize for not knowing the aspects of your youth programs. I would be willing to bet that the youth programs of the teams (especially the well established powers) is very strong. And I know(because LBBC told me so) that this is an advantage that Urban areas have a good chance to hold over Rural areas, factoring in location and travell. I think that more attention needs to be paid to the development of the youth, and the have's have done it better, in general, than the have nots. And this is not just about sports. If the quality of education accross the board were better at the lower levels, and elementary school skills were greatly improved, logic suggests that educational skills should improve at High School levels as well.

 

Not a rant, I promise. Just looks like it.

To piggyback on what CC is saying here concerning rurals, my children have played little in our county leagues because of lack of quality in their development. Because of the level of quality athleticism in the league, the true competition does not occur and it is more of a recreational league. WHICH HAS IT'S GREAT POINTS AND IS NEEDED.

 

As a result, the past 8 years we have gone north (30-45 minute drive one way) for spring league soccer, indoor soccer, Little League Baseball, Fall Baseball, Knothole Baseball, Memorial Day Baseball tournament, 7UP golf league, spring league basketball, Bluegrass Games, KPGA junior events, winter league basketball, summer league basketball. And considered but couldn't get it to work out with the schedule of having to commit a full evening to whatever league we want to play in, Indoor Winter baseball and Fall League basketball.

 

Many of those options were not even an option by staying within our county.

^^^ The commitment and dedication shown here is a reason for athletic and academic success. Parental involvment can be a key for a good student, or a good student athlete. IMO, sucessful programs also have parents that are involved such as this. The great programs IMO, have the involvement, and the increased opportunity to be involved. Some of the programs (or schools) that are not sucessful do not have the parental involvment at the right places.

^^^ The commitment and dedication shown here is a reason for athletic and academic success. Parental involvment can be a key for a good student, or a good student athlete. IMO, sucessful programs also have parents that are involved such as this. The great programs IMO, have the involvement, and the increased opportunity to be involved. Some of the programs (or schools) that are not sucessful do not have the parental involvment at the right places.

 

Let me point out that financially, I can afford to do that. Many here cannot. We spend a lot in gas cards at Shell.

 

I will get several thousands back from a tax refund this year. My wife and I just discussed putting it ALL back to pay for all of the camps, leagues, uniform costs, etc, etc, etc. I estimate we pay somewhere around $7,500 a year in costs associated with my children's sports endeavors.

Let me point out that financially, I can afford to do that. Many here cannot. We spend a lot in gas cards at Shell.

 

I will get several thousands back from a tax refund this year. My wife and I just discussed putting it ALL back to pay for all of the camps, leagues, uniform costs, etc, etc, etc. I estimate we pay somewhere around $7,500 a year in costs associated with my children's sports endeavors.

 

 

Of course, you could just use that to pay tuition to a private school:D:lol:

Of course, you could just use that to pay tuition to a private school:D:lol:

 

Very nice one. :thumb:

 

And I have longed said that if there was a Christian school that was a realistic choice, they would be attending there.

 

We looked into Calvary Christian 3-4 years ago and I even looked into their teaching positions. For reasons, non-athletic, it just didn't make sense. Big one, too close to retirement to throw that away.

We go over and over this issue and I've come to the following conclusions.

 

A. The problem that people have is that Trinity and St X are winning all the time and there programs are getting better at a faster rate than the programs chasing them. No one cares about Holy Cross, DeSales, or CAL they aren't winning all the time.

 

B. The reason that St X and Trinity are winning is NOT recruiting. This is a false assumption primarily coming out of the rural areas who aren't accustomed to open enrollment or boundary-less schools.

 

C-1. The reason that X and T are dominating is due to numbers and types of numbers. There are around 240 more boys at StX (the marginally smaller of X and T) than there are at Dunbar the largest public school. In the new districts Manual is probably the closest program to St X in terms of competitive football. Manual has 560 less boys to draw from. For comparison sake schools with 560 less boys than Manual are Clinton Co, Middlesboro, Fort Knox or McClean Co. Exactly how much of a chance would those schools have against Manual.

 

C-2. The other issue at hand was addressed by PepRock earlier. For Catholics football is a religious experience. Catholics in Louisville have a cultural connection to football. It isn't just that more boys attend X and T, it is that those boys are 50% more likely to play or have played football than boys attending public schools. In other words the player pool is not only bigger its richer as well.

 

D. Fans who think the private schools "try harder" are just as ignorant and blatantly biased as those claim X and T recruit and pay (in tuition) players.

WELL SAID I agree with you wholeheartedly. If X and T would all of a sudden cease to exist all this discussion would stop. It's about 2 schools in 1 sport. Period.

WELL SAID I agree with you wholeheartedly. If X and T would all of a sudden cease to exist all this discussion would stop. It's about 2 schools in 1 sport. Period.

 

Yes and no. That brought the attention from the media and the public but that is NOT what it is all about with coaches and or AD's who have brought this issue up.

 

Or are you assuming that the 190 votes that Prop 20 got are all Class 6A (4A at that time) football schools competing against T and X? THere are that many teams in 4A/6A football right?

Peprock1

You don't get it. I'm pointing out the difference in enrollment policies. I believe it has a direct effect on athletics if one chooses to use it. (Many do)

I can not get help in attending Corbin, as I would a private school. Open enrollment throughout 6 counties doen't exist in the public system.

 

That all I was doing.

How do you know you would get "help" at a private school. You assume it is there for the taking. The vast majority of students at private schools get no "help" at all. They pay the whole freight themselves. I know a GREAT many of parents who put their children through private schools and got no "help"at all. Some even had children who were great athletes, as you seem to think that has a bearing on the "help" given.

WELL SAID I agree with you wholeheartedly. If X and T would all of a sudden cease to exist all this discussion would stop. It's about 2 schools in 1 sport. Period.

Let me put a very big HOWEVER in there. While I think there situation deserves them being in a different class than all but two or three public schools, I'm not personally in favor of making that move.

We go over and over this issue and I've come to the following conclusions.

 

A. The problem that people have are that Trinity and St X are winning all the time and there programs are getting better at a faster rate than the programs chasing them. No one cares about Holy Cross, DeSales, or CAL they aren't winning all the time.

 

B. The reason that St X and Trinity are winning is NOT recruiting. This is a false assumption primarily coming out of the rural areas who aren't accustomed to open enrollment or boundary-less schools.

 

C-1. The reason that X and T are dominating is due to numbers and types of numbers. There are around 240 more boys at StX (the marginally smaller of X and T) than there are at Dunbar the largest public school. In the new districts Manual is probably the closest program to St X in terms of competitive football. Manual has 560 less boys to draw from. For comparison sake schools with 560 less boys than Manual are Clinton Co, Middlesboro, Fort Knox or McClean Co. Exactly how much of a chance would those schools have against Manual.

 

C-2. The other issue at hand was addressed by PepRock earlier. For Catholics football is a religious experience. Catholics in Louisville have a cultural connection to football. It isn't just that more boys attend X and T, it is that those boys are 50% more likely to play or have played football than boys attending public schools. In other words the player pool is not only bigger its richer as well.

 

D. Fans who think the private schools "try harder" are just as ignorant and blatantly biased as those claim X and T recruit and pay (in tuition) players.

 

A. True

 

B. False. The enrollments at X and T are so high largely because they recruit from several counties, even outside Kentucky in some cases.

 

C-1. True.........because of the recruiting of an extremely large pool, several counties wide.

 

C-2. Could be.

 

D. There are many rational and intelligent people that are certain tuition payment is used to entice great football players. In many cases, football player who don't even know what a rosary is.

B. False. The enrollments at X and T are so high largely because they recruit from several counties, even outside Kentucky in some cases.

You are wrong about this one.