From the intel community.

 

You guys give Obama a pass on faulty intel, does Bush not get the same consideration?

 

The Intel hasn't been the same since the late 80's,,And I have said many times on here, one of the biggest reasons is that we started to rely too much on new technology and less on people on the ground.

 

As far as your last paragraph, there has been talk that Bush and Blair worked together to "sell" the war knowing that it was bad Intel. Blair is under a lot of scrutiny, and many are calling for the early release of the Chilcot report, which is now years late. It's due to be released next summer.

 

Not saying anything either way, just throwing out there that some here, and many in the UK think that they knew that the Intel was wrong. BUT, when, if, the Chilcot report comes out this summer we will see.

The Intel hasn't been the same since the late 80's,,And I have said many times on here, one of the biggest reasons is that we started to rely too much on new technology and less on people on the ground.

 

As far as your last paragraph, there has been talk that Bush and Blair worked together to "sell" the war knowing that it was bad Intel. Blair is under a lot of scrutiny, and many are calling for the early release of the Chilcot report, which is now years late. It's due to be released next summer.

 

Not saying anything either way, just throwing out there that some here, and many in the UK think that they knew that the Intel was wrong. BUT, when, if, the Chilcot report comes out this summer we will see.

 

But Obama gets a pass on "faulty" intel?

'Tis amusing how either side can spin an analysis of all of the complexities with such an assumed authoritative approach and be so certain that what they offer as being the indisputable truth and reality as if it is a proven science, while both sides only aim to see things from some singular lopsided so called absolute correct perspective ignoring that the details of it all are a million times more complex than successfully completing the task of a rubik's cube.

 

For anyone to think that their position is so right on and solid, no matter how informed that they believe that they are, is at the very least a demonstration in delusionality, and an over inflated image of self worth and knowledge.

 

IF there were a position that could be nailed with complete knowledge and accuracy, it's a guarantee that the factors are so varied and endless that no one could absolutely and indisputably identify it, but nonetheless it is entertaining to watch people try, and to see them believe that they're on to something.

 

Continue to study hard all of the variables and pick and choose the ones that support and justify your aims and views, and by the time you are taking your last breath your head will be filled with so many details that add up to nothing.

 

Dead or alive the world will continue to spin, and good luck being the one who has the almighty power to alter it.

 

...And the band played on...

 

 

Unfortunately, there are some on here that won't get this and just perpetuate the lies from both sides.

Treasury head: US economy better now than when Obama took office | TheHill

Surely one can be a domestic liberal and a realist or isolationist in foreign policy just as one can be a domestic conservative and an idealistic interventionist in foreign policy (George W. Bush is indicative of this).

 

Except what he described wouldn't fit your description ?

I read the political threads and people go on and on about how bad things are. Of course it is all because Obama is the worst president ever. I am trying to figure out what is so bad?

 

- The economy is considered one of the strongest in the world.

- The market has been positive and growing.

- Unemployment is continuing to shrink.

- More people have health care than at any time in our history.

- Gas prices are back below $2 a gallon and there is surplus of oil.

- New home sales are at a 7 year high.

- Interest rates are about as low as they can go.

 

I see a lot of positive. Why does everyone keep screaming about how things are so horrible?

 

1. Our economy is currently growing at less than 2%, according to the most recent look at 3rd quarter GDP. 40% lower that the average rate of growth since 1947. This is good, in your opinion?

 

2. The Market has been up and down all year and is currently negative for the year. That said, the market has been artificially buoyed by the Federal Reserve keeping interest rates at zero percent for the past 6+ years. With no return on savings, investors have little choice but to buy stocks if they want to try to keep up with the cost of living.

 

3. The unemployment rate is down due to the Labor Participation rate being the worst since the Jimmy Carter era. Only 62% of working age adults are currently in the labor force. Millions have completely given up on looking for work and instead have opted for disability or welfare. Add those millions back to the labor force and the unemployment number goes back close to double digits. There is also the issue with the number of part time jobs created due to Obamacare mandates. Every job, part or full time, lowers the unemployment rate. It matters not that those part timers would rather have full time work.

 

4. Actually, more currently have health insurance, not health care. Health care has always been available, even if one could not afford to pay for it. Most of those that are newly covered by Obamacare are being subsidized by others. So in addition to paying for my own family's insurance, I am also being charged to cover the cost for other families. Socialism at it's finest. Decide for yourself it that is a good thing.

 

5. Gas prices are down. No argument there. But they are down despite of the policies of the current administration. Not because of them.

 

6. New home sales are up over what they were in the past few years, but the home ownership rate is down to under 64%. That is the lowest it has been since the 3rd quarter of 1994, over 20 years ago.

 

7. Interest rates are very low. Is that a good thing if you are someone who relies on interest from savings or CD's to supplement your income? And, why are rates so low? Because the economy has been stuck on slow for the past 7 years. This despite the policies of the current administration being in place for that entire period.

 

So despite your rose colored glasses, it is easy to understand why some see a glass half empty.

58 Facts About The U.S. Economy From 2015 That Are Almost Too Crazy To Believe

58 Facts About The U.S. Economy From 2015 That Are Almost Too Crazy To Believe

 

Those are crazy facts, if correct.

I'd guess the stats are correct .. the last 10 years of Bush economics followed by far worse has led to a horrible (predictable) outcome . We are getting the govt we voted for .. we wanted socialism and we are getting it . The middle class is darn near on life support . And as we continue this slide towards socialism its going to get worse . Obamacare is the driving force behind a lot of the bad numbers . I wonder if our country can turn it around . Too many millions want their free goodies with no work .. food stamp explosion . Disability explosion . Work force at 40 year lows . Free cell phones . Free College . Free health care . Brought to you straight outta the Democrat party and their willing partners , the GOP .

^ I read recently that the Democrats are the tax and spend party, while the GOP is simply the spend party.:thumb:

Sadly Can't argue much. It's just not funny as our country is sliding towards turmoil . And while the GOP has sucked swamp water the dem's are the slime in the swamp

^ I read recently that the Democrats are the tax and spend party, while the GOP is simply the spend party.:thumb:

 

Cannot argue with you Papa on that one. A big part of the problem is the media IMO. We know the Dems will NEVER cut spending on ANYTHING except the military. If an R even mentions cutting spending on ANYTHING, the media calls him racist or a hater of some sort. Eventually the R's just give up trying. Heck, we cannot even get the politicians to just freeze spending for a year.

 

The lack of fiscal responsibility in this country is the biggest problem we face...bigger than ISIS, bigger than global warming, bigger than immigration...

 

We simply spend more money than we take in as a country and now do it so routinely that we have a $20 trillion national debt and people don't care. It sickens me because this cannot go on forever and when it blows up, it will be a VERY BAD thing...

 

Again and I have said this many times and never get a response. When Obama was running for president the first time, he called Bush letting the national debt getting to $8 trillion "un-American". He was right BTW. What do you call letting the national debt get to $20 trillion if $8 trillion is "un-American". Of all the things that I cannot stand Obama for (and there are many other reasons), this is number one for me. I don't blame him solely because the R's have failed to stand up to him often, but he is the primary culprit in this case.

^ yep

Answer - My health insurance costs as much as my mortgage. ACA really sticks it to the middle class.

 

2-3 years ago I would have had better coverage for about half the cost.

Answer - My health insurance costs as much as my mortgage. ACA really sticks it to the middle class.

 

2-3 years ago I would have had better coverage for about half the cost.

 

Shocking....

 

You have been "Grubered"...