Methinks you've tried to trivialize what Wright said. He didn't just say something that the congregation disagrees with, he espoused a message of hatred, racism and bigotry. How the black community can complain about racism when they support ministers and leaders that send their own messages of racism is simply beyond me.

 

If you can honestly look in the mirror and tell me that you would not criticize McCain if he attended a church lead by a minister that made sermons supporting the KKK, if he befriended that minister, and if he told people that such minister was his spiritual advisor, then your above post may have some credibility with me; then again it might not, because I would criticize McCain if that was the case.

 

I'm sorry, I'm not buying this whole "Black churches are different than white churches" stuff that Obama and his supporters are trying to use to cover the mess in the corner. Messages of hatred, bigotry and racism are wrong where ever and when ever they are made, or at least that's what Martin Luther King Jr tried to teach us. I'd bet every dollar that I have that MLK Jr. would have stood up during that sermon, called Wright wrong and walked out of the church. Blacks are not given a free pass to be racists. I don't excuse their racist messages because they may have been the victim of racism any more than I accept the white male who didn't get a job due to some affirmative action plan joining the KKK.

 

And heck yes I would expect Obama to leave that church or to work actively to have the minister removed a long time ago. I'd respect the heck out of Obama if he'd have done that.

 

And here is the truth teller: If Falwell had been the minister of your church and preached messages of intolerance and hatred, would you have handled the situation the same way Obama did?

 

Your arguments are very convincing and difficult to dispute.

Can anyone elaborate on this? I have heard that Obama will not pledge the American flag. That alone bothers me some, but I also heard Obama say that he loves America. Is this contradictory? Is the Whitehouse the appropriate place for a man that won't pledge the flag? I admit I haven't researched any of this.

 

Believe nothing you hear, and only half of what you see. The claims that Obama will not salute the flag are false.

Can anyone elaborate on this? I have heard that Obama will not pledge the American flag. That alone bothers me some, but I also heard Obama say that he loves America. Is this contradictory? Is the Whitehouse the appropriate place for a man that won't pledge the flag? I admit I haven't researched any of this.

 

That is a false rumor. You will see those types of rumors repeated right up until election day. There are some, including some on this site, that will continue to do things to cast doubt on Obama. Let's be very clear. Whether you agree with his politics or not, whether you will vote for him or not, Barak Obama is a patriotic and honorable American. He is a devout Christian. He loves his country. The same things are true of John McCain. I have great faith in the American people. They may or may not decide to elect Barak Obama President of the United States, but I believe that by election day the vast majority of decent Americans will know and believe that Barak Obama is a loyal and honorable American. There will be some that will choose to spread vile rumors. There will be some that will attempt to play on fears by emphasising Senator Obama's middle name. They can speak to their own motives and the rest of us can draw our own conclusions about their character and just how honorable they are. I think that the vast majority of Americans are decent people who will reject those tactics. Again, let me emphasize that that doesn't mean that people who don't vote for Senator Obama are not decent people. It just means that I do believe that most people will reject the vile rumors and insinuations and the equally vile people that start and spread them.

That is a false rumor. You will see those types of rumors repeated right up until election day. There are some, including some on this site, that will continue to do things to cast doubt on Obama. Let's be very clear. Whether you agree with his politics or not, whether you will vote for him or not, Barak Obama is a patriotic and honorable American. He is a devout Christian. He loves his country. The same things are true of John McCain. I have great faith in the American people. They may or may not decide to elect Barak Obama President of the United States, but I believe that by election day the vast majority of decent Americans will know and believe that Barak Obama is a loyal and honorable American. There will be some that will choose to spread vile rumors. There will be some that will attempt to play on fears by emphasising Senator Obama's middle name. They can speak to their own motives and the rest of us can draw our own conclusions about their character and just how honorable they are. I think that the vast majority of Americans are decent people who will reject those tactics. Again, let me emphasize that that doesn't mean that people who don't vote for Senator Obama are not decent people. It just means that I do believe that most people will reject the vile rumors and insinuations and the equally vile people that start and spread them.

 

I agree with you on some of the mudslinging that will only increase as we near the general election. Much of it is dispicable.

 

Getting back to the thread, do you support Sen. Obama's choice to stay at his church if some of the racial allegations that have been made about his preacher turn out to be true?

 

Just wondering if that would sway your support at all or not?

Can anyone elaborate on this? I have heard that Obama will not pledge the American flag. That alone bothers me some, but I also heard Obama say that he loves America. Is this contradictory? Is the Whitehouse the appropriate place for a man that won't pledge the flag? I admit I haven't researched any of this.

 

 

Since when did saying the pledge make you an unpatriotic American? I must have missed that list in the founding father's notes. Oh, yeah, they didn't have the pledge then. :irked:

I agree with you on some of the mudslinging that will only increase as we near the general election. Much of it is dispicable.

 

Getting back to the thread, do you support Sen. Obama's choice to stay at his church if some of the racial allegations that have been made about his preacher turn out to be true?

 

Just wondering if that would sway your support at all or not?

There are really two questions here. Should he have stayed at the church? Probably not. It sounds to me as if he let his very strong personal affection for the minister overcome his strong disagreement with some of what the reverend has said. Second, will it change my support of Senator Obama? No it won't. Have you ever let it slide when a friend or relative made a really objectionable statement? Ever let it slide when someone told a really offensive joke? Have you dropped the friend? Have you disowned the relative? In evaluating our relationships with others and whether to continue those relationships it is the totallity of the relationship that controls, not the worst thing that the friend or relative ever did. It would have made political sense to have dropped the friend and the church years ago. I haven't dropped my friends or relatives so I'll evaluate Senator Obama based on what he has said and done and not based on what his friends have done.

There are really two questions here. Should he have stayed at the church? Probably not. It sounds to me as if he let his very strong personal affection for the minister overcome his strong disagreement with some of what the reverend has said. Second, will it change my support of Senator Obama? No it won't. Have you ever let it slide when a friend or relative made a really objectionable statement? Ever let it slide when someone told a really offensive joke? Have you dropped the friend? Have you disowned the relative? In evaluating our relationships with others and whether to continue those relationships it is the totallity of the relationship that controls, not the worst thing that the friend or relative ever did. It would have made political sense to have dropped the friend and the church years ago. I haven't dropped my friends or relatives so I'll evaluate Senator Obama based on what he has said and done and not based on what his friends have done.

 

 

 

Good post.

 

It's sad to me that it has come to this, people finding anything that they can to degrade the man.

 

It really makes me beleive, from what i've seen with my own two eyes, that some people are just afraid, deep down, of a "non-white" man who has the oppurtunity to come to a position of real power. If you listned to the mans speech it was about coming together as a country and putting aside our differences, be them racial or whatever. Sadly I don't think the country is ready for that and IF he gets the nomination it will only get worse.

 

There is still somewhat of a racial divide in this country, whether you want to beleive it or not, and Obama will either be the one who unites the country, or the one who polarizes the country.

 

The way things are looking, it will be the latter, and it dissapoints me.

This reminds me of the uproar when the scandals broke within the Catholic Church.

 

Should Catholics have left their faith when they found out that the Church had covered up (for decades) the abuse by their clergy by moving them to other parishes? Should Catholics have left their faith much longer ago when they realized the atrocities of the Crusades and the Inquisition? Are all Catholics gender-biased because they practice a faith in which women are denied the ultimate leadership?

 

When I was a teenager, I attended a service at my boyfriend's baptist Church. Their pastor found it to be a great opportunity to preach against the Catholic Church. He pointed his finger toward me and said that all Catholics will go to hell. Should the members of that congregation have disbanded and found other churches?

 

There are many forms of discrimination.

 

The reason this is so offensive to many of those who are crying out, is that Rev. Wright uses black vs. white as his platform, and many whites have yet to acknowledge that all things are still not equal, racially. Racism is the "quiet" discrimintation, legally protected. And, I'm sorry, but I do say that in one way, Rev. Wright is correct....the country is run by rich whites. :lol:

There are really two questions here. Should he have stayed at the church? Probably not. It sounds to me as if he let his very strong personal affection for the minister overcome his strong disagreement with some of what the reverend has said. Second, will it change my support of Senator Obama? No it won't. Have you ever let it slide when a friend or relative made a really objectionable statement? Ever let it slide when someone told a really offensive joke? Have you dropped the friend? Have you disowned the relative? In evaluating our relationships with others and whether to continue those relationships it is the totallity of the relationship that controls, not the worst thing that the friend or relative ever did. It would have made political sense to have dropped the friend and the church years ago. I haven't dropped my friends or relatives so I'll evaluate Senator Obama based on what he has said and done and not based on what his friends have done.

 

Apples and Oranges: My friend making a comment that is inappropriate is much different than my minister and spiritual advisor making racist comments for over 20 years. (by the way, if my friend continued to make racist comments, I would in fact leave them)

 

Quick question:

 

So if McCain's minister and spiritual adviser for the past 20 years turned out to be a racist and McCain had been found to have sat in on many racist and anti-American rants, would you be cool with that and think it no big deal?

 

I don't think Sen Obama is a racist, but I must questions things moreso if some of these allegations turn out to be true. Of course some people may be more tolerant of racism than I am.

Apples and Oranges: My friend making a comment that is inappropriate is much different than my minister and spiritual advisor making racist comments for over 20 years. (by the way, if my friend continued to make racist comments, I would in fact leave them)

 

Quick question:

 

So if McCain's minister and spiritual adviser for the past 20 years turned out to be a racist and McCain had been found to have sat in on many racist and anti-American rants, would you be cool with that and think it no big deal?

 

I don't think Sen Obama is a racist, but I must questions things moreso if some of these allegations turn out to be true. Of course some people may be more tolerant of racism than I am.

 

Exactly.:thumb:

Anyone recall the comments Obama made after the Don Imas thing? I cant recall exactly but I do recall Obama being interviewed about how he thought it should be dealt with. That situation was kind of reverse of this Wright situation. Anyone recall what Obama said?

I can tell everyone here if Senator Obama has to leave his church because of what the pastor said then all of the people who attended should have left. Also if everyone thinks that this only happened at this predominately black church you are all should think again.
 
I can tell you as a 49 year old African American that these types of sermons have been sometimes preached at  predominately black churches, that I have attended, since I was a little boy.
 
I don't know how old most of you are but I can tell you this. If you think this sermon of Rev. Wright's was bad you should have come to some of the ones I've seen back in the 60's and 70's.

 

 

 

 

1. Mitt Romney's faith was not off limits.

 

2. This is not about "faith," it is about a presidential candidate attending church services over a 20-year period where an anti-American racist pastor delivered sermons that would most Americans would find very offensive.

 

3. This has become an issue of credibility. Obama first denied very being present during any of Rev. Wright's racist, anti-American rants, but today admitted that he had been present during some of Rev. Wright's controversial remarks. Why did he lie?

 

I disagree on the first. At least here on BGP, any mention of Mormonism and you took a beating for mentioning it and that it should not be relevant.

I disagree on the first. At least here on BGP, any mention of Mormonism and you took a beating for mentioning it and that it should not be relevant.

 

 

And it shouldn't. The same should be true for Obama. The difference is that Mitt was running on the Conservative Republican ticket, and Obama is a Democrat.

I can tell everyone here if Senator Obama has to leave his church because of what the pastor said then all of the people who attended should have left. Also if everyone thinks that this only happened at this predominately black church you are all should think again.
 
I can tell you as a 49 year old African American that these types of sermons have been sometimes preached at  predominately black churches, that I have attended, since I was a little boy.
 
I don't know how old most of you are but I can tell you this. If you think this sermon of Rev. Wright's was bad you should have come to some of the ones I've seen back in the 60's and 70's.

 

 

 

 

 

Do you see a problem with any of the comments that Rev. Wright has been accused of making?