Can't gamble (according to the pesky rules) but I'll make an avatar bet. 'll sport a Reds avatar from October to the first pitch of 2008 if they don't lose 100 games. If they do, I'll have an avatar for you. Deal?

Deal! :thumb:

The Reds shouldnt lose 100 games, but it looks like they very easily could, which is sad.

The media in Minnesota openly lobbying for Terry Ryan to give up one of their top pitching prospects for Adam Dunn. Interesting read....

 

http://www.sctimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070715/SPORTS/107150002/1002

RBIs are not an accurate measure as to one's ability to help a team win games. Too many variables outside of the control of the individual batter.

 

He's hardly one-dimensional. If you subscribe to the theory that "runs created" are the most important measure of one's contribution to wins, then you cannot call Dunn one-dimensional. Most experts will tell you that the best way to measure a batter's offensive contribution to victories is to look at the combination of SLG% , OB%, ability to get on base via walks, and Isolated Slugging (SLG% minus OB%) . These factors generally provide a true picture of one's ability to produce runs (the name of the game).

 

Dunn is currently 28th in the category of runs created according to http://www.thehardballtimes.com . For comparison, Griffey's outstanding season places him 21st.

 

Where Dunn struggles is RISP . If he improves that area, he'll be a monster.

Then why cant he move a runner from second to third with no outs?

Move him on. I like the guy but we need pitching and he needs to go.

Not sure trading Dunn or Jr is a wise move. If they could get good talent back for either of them, I wonder why either is not already gone before this season.

 

So, if the question is to take one or two key cogs out of your offensive lineup for unequal talent in return, I think you say no to the trade.

 

And before someone throws up the Kearns/Lopez trade, the Reds offensive this season has not been hurt because of this trade. Gonzalez and Hamilton along with time for Freel/Hopper has more than offset the loss of offense from Lopez/Kearns.

 

To me, the ONLY answer to the Reds problem is keep the lineup as is with maybe a tweak here or there, add $15 to $20 mil ALL in pitching. 1 very talented starter and 2-3 bullpen mates. I think the addition of these 3-4 pitchers and the Reds are the cream of the crop in the NL Central, barring injuries.

I think the Reds are weighing the option of trading Dunn and getting mid-level pitching in return or losing Dunn to free agency and getting a sandwich pick or two in the next draft. Believe it or not, a lot of teams had rather lose a player to free agency and get that extra pick at the end of the first round if there isn't any help out there in the market.

I think the Reds are weighing the option of trading Dunn and getting mid-level pitching in return or losing Dunn to free agency and getting a sandwich pick or two in the next draft. Believe it or not, a lot of teams had rather lose a player to free agency and get that extra pick at the end of the first round if there isn't any help out there in the market.

 

Yeah sometimes it works out. Because you get that player for the rest of the year and you have no pressure to trade for prospects. Who knows what the Reds will do though.

Hopefully they keep Dunn and Griffey and can pick up some pitching in the off season.

Not sure trading Dunn or Jr is a wise move. If they could get good talent back for either of them, I wonder why either is not already gone before this season.

 

So, if the question is to take one or two key cogs out of your offensive lineup for unequal talent in return, I think you say no to the trade.

 

And before someone throws up the Kearns/Lopez trade, the Reds offensive this season has not been hurt because of this trade. Gonzalez and Hamilton along with time for Freel/Hopper has more than offset the loss of offense from Lopez/Kearns.

 

To me, the ONLY answer to the Reds problem is keep the lineup as is with maybe a tweak here or there, add $15 to $20 mil ALL in pitching. 1 very talented starter and 2-3 bullpen mates. I think the addition of these 3-4 pitchers and the Reds are the cream of the crop in the NL Central, barring injuries.

The reason Dunn or Griffey were not traded before this season is the Reds management in their infinite wisdom, believed this team to be a contender.

I'm not sure what a very talented starter goes for, but I have a feeling 15-20 million won't last too long.

Another issue no one seems to want to address is team speed. The Reds are like turtles. 2 of the guys that have any speed are not everyday players and the other has been out a lot. The thinking this team is only a couple of players away is what will keep them where they are.

Hopefully they keep Dunn and Griffey and can pick up some pitching in the off season.

 

You figure if they are going to trade Griffey now is the time, since he may not be healthy next year and they wouldn't get anything for him. As much as I rip Dunn, he has avoided long term injuries, but if you are going to trade him, now is a good time since he is having another solid season on offense.

 

You would think at least one of them would be gone by the end of the month.

I think the Reds are weighing the option of trading Dunn and getting mid-level pitching in return or losing Dunn to free agency and getting a sandwich pick or two in the next draft. Believe it or not, a lot of teams had rather lose a player to free agency and get that extra pick at the end of the first round if there isn't any help out there in the market.

 

That is exactly what the article I linked above from Minnesota talked about.

Tonight's line-up:

 

Freel cf

Hatteberg 1b

Griffey rf

Phillips 2b

Dunn lf

Valentin c

Encarnacion 3b

Lopez ss

Livingston p

Well, that is one way to guarantee Dunn will get nothing to hit...that is some serious protection.

That has to be a mistake, there is no way in goodness green earth you put Valentin in that spot.

 

If that is the actual line up, that is just horrible.

Is there any doubt that they are trying to showcase Freel? Two in a row at 3rd and now CF...