All started with Saul Smith getting DUI this year. Tubby is good guy and decent coach.

Tubby is getting paid a nice chunk of change to deliver more than what he has delivered.

 

He has also butted heads with administration in regards to getting a new practice facility. It is much easier to get those things accomplished when you are winning rather than treading water.

 

His seat has been getting warmer over the last couple of years.

 

He has had a bit over turnover on his roster including some very good players leaving the program in addition to some of his players getting in trouble as well as Saul getting a DUI.

 

Minnesota has some really good homegrown talent coming up including two of the top 25 prospects this year and I don't think Minny is in the lead hunt for those kids.

 

Add in a new AD who is not afraid to throw punches and you will get this result.

 

Don't shed too many tears for Tubby, because he has been hunting jobs the last few years as well.

 

One school that I would keep an eye on for him would be Wake Forest.

^When the admin. promises you a practice facility before you're hired in 2007 and they haven't even begun the planning phases by 2013, I think you have reason to "butt heads" as you call it.

You mean the team with:

 

14 year NBA veteran Nazr Mohammed

12 Year NBA veteran Jamal Magloire

8 Year NBA veteran Scottie Padgett

6 year NBA vet Michael Bradley

 

Not to mention some pretty good college players in Jeff Shepherd, Wayne Turner, and Allen Edwards.

 

The thing I don't understand is the people who love Tubby, but hate Rick.

 

Yes, that team. One of the least talented champions in the past 25 years. I am not saying they had no talent. I am comparing that team to other NCAA champions. 7 footers can hang out in the NBA a long time. Do you really consider those guys talented NBA players? Do the research and compare. If you go by 1st round draft picks as most do, that UK team does not compare with other NCAA champions.

 

Your last line I agree with. I don't understand the animosity towards Tubby and I don't understand the animosity towards Pitino either. He got offered a huge amount of money to pursue an NBA dream at arguably the number 1 franchise in NBA history. How can anyone fault him for that?

My $0.02 on the Tubby thing.... I think most of the "anti Tubby" group aren't as much "anti Tubby" as they are annoyed by the people who act like Tubby could do no wrong.

 

By all accounts, Tubby is a great guy, but you have to acknowledge he's had his share of shortcomings as a basketball coach. He may be the best X and O coach of all time, but if you can recruit the players, and manage them once you do, it doesn't matter.

 

Regardless of how talented or not the 1998 team was, Tubby didn't recruit those guys. And he proceeded to show over the rest of his tenure at UK that he couldn't recruit (or coach, you choose) at a high enough level to get back within sniffing distance of a title. And at the time he left (remember, he wasn't fired by UK), he wasn't close to getting back there.

 

I wish Tubby all the best, but just being a nice guy doesn't mean you can do a mediocre job and stick around.

Are you saying Cal doesn't have any class?

I guess I was making that insinuation, although, not necessarily about Cal alone. BUT, after checking Websters and Wikipedias definition of class/classy, I stand corrected.

I realize college basketball IS revenue, winning games, and hanging those ultimate prizes=banners. He obviously has done all three, although I refuse to give him a free pass on this season, regardless of last season, or what he MAY do next season. Wouldn't have such a hard time with this down year if it was as a result of a natural process, such as graduating a talented senior laden class, but when he recruits himself into it, then not sure it's acceptable.

I very much admire his cleverness when it comes to marketing, reaching out to pioneers/alumni of the program, and his fundraising ability. All these thing are "classy" acts, BUT, back to those banners. While I understand he wasn't personally indicted, when programs under his watch have to take down banners and all the issues that go with it, I'm just not sure I associate that with class. Just tend to think things of this severity overrides the "classy" acts.

Obviously coaches are not paid to be good guys with clean, well respected reputations, but I do think they can co-exist with success. Not pretending I'm right about any of this, just an opinion.

By the way also in regards to the banners. Has hung 3, taken down 2. Net result: -1

My $0.02 on the Tubby thing.... I think most of the "anti Tubby" group aren't as much "anti Tubby" as they are annoyed by the people who act like Tubby could do no wrong.

 

By all accounts, Tubby is a great guy, but you have to acknowledge he's had his share of shortcomings as a basketball coach. He may be the best X and O coach of all time, but if you can recruit the players, and manage them once you do, it doesn't matter.

 

Regardless of how talented or not the 1998 team was, Tubby didn't recruit those guys. And he proceeded to show over the rest of his tenure at UK that he couldn't recruit (or coach, you choose) at a high enough level to get back within sniffing distance of a title. And at the time he left (remember, he wasn't fired by UK), he wasn't close to getting back there.

 

I wish Tubby all the best, but just being a nice guy doesn't mean you can do a mediocre job and stick around.

 

I don't think any of the Tubby supporters will argue the fact that Tubby's recruiting definitely slipped the last 2 or 3 years. The problem is the Tubby bashers refuse to give him any credit. The fact that Tubby didn't recruit the players from the 1998 squad shouldn't matter. Tubby still guided that team to the National Championship with his coaching, yet all the bashers can say is "That was Pitino's team. "

 

Tubby also had some great teams with players he did recruit. I believe two of his teams were the overall #1 seed going into the tournament. One was upset by UAB in the 2nd round, and the other one lost to Marquette in the Regional final after Bogans was injured. Tubby did some great things for the UK program, and IMO deserves a banner in the Rupp rafters.

I guess I was making that insinuation, although, not necessarily about Cal alone. BUT, after checking Websters and Wikipedias definition of class/classy, I stand corrected.

I realize college basketball IS revenue, winning games, and hanging those ultimate prizes=banners. He obviously has done all three, although I refuse to give him a free pass on this season, regardless of last season, or what he MAY do next season. Wouldn't have such a hard time with this down year if it was as a result of a natural process, such as graduating a talented senior laden class, but when he recruits himself into it, then not sure it's acceptable.

I very much admire his cleverness when it comes to marketing, reaching out to pioneers/alumni of the program, and his fundraising ability. All these thing are "classy" acts, BUT, back to those banners. While I understand he wasn't personally indicted, when programs under his watch have to take down banners and all the issues that go with it, I'm just not sure I associate that with class. Just tend to think things of this severity overrides the "classy" acts.

Obviously coaches are not paid to be good guys with clean, well respected reputations, but I do think they can co-exist with success. Not pretending I'm right about any of this, just an opinion.

By the way also in regards to the banners. Has hung 3, taken down 2. Net result: -1

 

Fuzzy math and wrong regardless.

 

Hung 4, taken down 2, net result: 2.

Fuzzy math and wrong regardless

 

Hung 4, taken down 2, net result: 2.

 

Stand corrected. Still a big problem with "taken down 2" and that any math has to be done to begin with.

It was certainly more talented than the roster he left BCG.

 

LOL....Let the man be..

Are you saying Cal doesn't have any class?

 

Don't talk ill of Cal, there will be an uproar on BGP.:lol:

Don't talk ill of Cal, there will be an uproar on BGP.:lol:

 

That was a question.

 

 

I love Cal.

Fuzzy math and wrong regardless.

 

Hung 4, taken down 2, net result: 2.

Actually, not so much fuzzy math, as it is little boy Mayberry math.?

Tubby is talked about worse than Joker Phillips by the anti-Tubby crowd.

 

That's a problem.

I don't think any of the Tubby supporters will argue the fact that Tubby's recruiting definitely slipped the last 2 or 3 years. The problem is the Tubby bashers refuse to give him any credit. The fact that Tubby didn't recruit the players from the 1998 squad shouldn't matter. Tubby still guided that team to the National Championship with his coaching, yet all the bashers can say is "That was Pitino's team. "

 

Tubby also had some great teams with players he did recruit. I believe two of his teams were the overall #1 seed going into the tournament. One was upset by UAB in the 2nd round, and the other one lost to Marquette in the Regional final after Bogans was injured. Tubby did some great things for the UK program, and IMO deserves a banner in the Rupp rafters.

 

Who recruited the 98 team wouldn't matter if Tubby had ever returned to the Final Four. Since he never managed it again (and had plenty of chances), you have to look at what was different about the 1998 team. The obvious answer is that Tubby didn't recruit those guys. He did do an excellent job coaching them for that year though. I don't think anyone argues against that.

 

As for success with his own recruits, UK judges success by Final Fours and National Titles. He failed to reach that level again after 1998. If he wanted accolades for Sweet 16 appearances, he should have gone to IU.

 

And again, nobody is arguing he's not a great PERSON. He may even be a great coach, but his recruiting and team management isn't so great.

 

The bottom line is that if he was truly elite, he wouldn't have gone from UK to Minn to homeless.