Gym time is important. I wouldn't compare football and basketball though. A basketball player can do so much more on his own to improve skill level. A lot of very good basketball players are made by putting in countless hours in the driveway on their own, or with a couple of buddies. I don't think that opportunity exists as much for football players.

 

I agree. However, being in a gym and playing through an offense as a young kid helps transition that to middle school and then the high school. That's what the FTJFL prides itself on, instilling Highlands mentality and, to a lesser extent, offensive and defensive strategies right away.

We practice 2 nights a week at the Armory and the halfcourt is reserved for us but There is a small costs. Some nights we use full court if nobody is using the other end. We practice 1.5 to 2 hours and 7 of these same Johnson kids also drive out to Hickory Grove Church in Independence on Friday evening for AAU practice for 2 more hours. They love the practice and it has aided in their development. They play on Saturdays and Sundays so we are talking 5 days a week of hoops. Mix that in with my sons Varsity games and now my undertaking of coaching my 5 yr old daughter (who has great handles by the way due to hanging out at our practices) and There isn't much time to do anything.

 

QUOTE=mexitucky;4248694]You are missing a major, major, major difference b/n the FTJFL and the Moyer league. ....practice time. That is the main difference, especially for my sons' teams. When I was at Holy Spirit we practiced at least twice per week for 1 1/2 to 2 hours. The FTJFL gives 3 practice nights per week. The basketball team that my boys are on, once per week. The coach is fantastic, but for some reason Woodfill's gym time is so limited.

 

Q, I saw your team up at the Armory, how often do you guys practice per week, or get some type of gym time?

You are missing a major, major, major difference b/n the FTJFL and the Moyer league....practice time. That is the main difference, especially for my sons' teams. When I was at Holy Spirit we practiced at least twice per week for 1 1/2 to 2 hours. The FTJFL gives 3 practice nights per week. The basketball team that my boys are on, once per week. The coach is fantastic, but for some reason Woodfill's gym time is so limited.

 

Q, I saw your team up at the Armory, how often do you guys practice per week, or get some type of gym time?

 

Does the FTJFL use a school facility to practice? Football has the benefit of being outdoors and not limited by school administration. Basketball practice is indoors and is limited by school administrators and school liability. This has a major impact on practice times!

 

Also, Malachicrunch: When was the last time you saw a bunch of kids in the driveway playing?? If they play football, they practice 3 nights a week from July through Dec.. They then try to practice baseball in the spring and in the meantime try to play a little hoops in the driveway. There is not enough time to get better on your own. To many organized practices, aau, etc.

As I have said before. HHS has always been a football school. HHS has had sustained success in the past on the hardwood. Why can the past success in basketball not be repeated?

 

The reality is that the past 10 years of Highlands Football success is unmatched in any other decade. While Highlands has always been at or near the top in Football, they have never experienced a period of dominance like they have recently. Their basketball teams were good year in year out, but never were considered dominant other than a year here and there.

 

As their success in football has increased, more and more players want to be a part of that. Losing 2 or 3 players a year from the basketball team to focus only on Football, and you have your answer. Even if those players aren't the best bball players on the team. Take any of the other schools in NKY, and subtract 2 or 3 players a year from their program and I believe you would see similar results. While Highlands has defied the numbers with their succes in Football, the school size and their demographic have not been able to over come losing those 2 or 3 players a year.

 

A big part of Highlands Success in football is because of the sacrifice their players make to the program. It just so happens that one of those sacrifices is also a top level basketball program.

Between Shields and Messmer at Highlands in their combined 27 years as head coaches they won 9 regional championships and played in other regional finals not winning. So to say they were not dominant might be correct but their record in those 27 years playing the competition they played in and out of the 9th region was pretty dang good. I would have to look this up but if you look at those years I would say they won more regional championships in that period than any other school. They did this with a combination of players that were only basketball and those that played other sports including football. This years team has 7 or 8 football players on the JV and Varsity so I am not sure why people keep harping on the football players for not playing. I don't hear why isn't this baseball or soccer player not playing when there are some of those young men that could contribute also. Maybe they quit playing a sport because they just don't enjoy it anymore - kind of like when you change jobs or careers. Football always had practice in the summer and there was baseball in the summer and basketball was pick up games or you went to a camp (not a team camp) so when you add in all the organization, mandatory practices games etc maybe it really isn't fun to all of them anymore. Sometimes kids are playing for their parents and not themselves. I can think of one HHS grad that did this and had all the talent in the world and did not want to play. He did because his dad wanted him to. The team would have been better off without him IMHO. There are kids walking the halls of every high school that don't play any sports and could but they don't care to.

 

As far as AAU goes I think most would be better off playing pick up basketball in Goebel Park, the Armory, Friars Club, Y etc because often times kids get burned out playing tournaments each weekend and practicing when some of the coaches act and think they are Bobby Knight. Not all of them but some of them. Just because you played AAU doesn't guarantee that you are going to play in HS. Kids get bigger and stronger and others quit growing and improving.

Highlands is a football school.The good athletes go the football route instead of basketball,same with Trinity,yes even though they are ranked 1 (New kids came in only take 1 or 2) The BB state powers do the opposite LC, Scott Co Madison Central. If Flynn could get athletes that spend time playing basketball he would win the state every other year.I am no Highlands fan you can see by my post but there is not a better basketball coach in the state,hands down than Flynn. I have watched him for years,excellent excellent bb coach

Between Shields and Messmer at Highlands in their combined 27 years as head coaches they won 9 regional championships and played in other regional finals not winning. So to say they were not dominant might be correct but their record in those 27 years playing the competition they played in and out of the 9th region was pretty dang good. I would have to look this up but if you look at those years I would say they won more regional championships in that period than any other school. They did this with a combination of players that were only basketball and those that played other sports including football. This years team has 7 or 8 football players on the JV and Varsity so I am not sure why people keep harping on the football players for not playing. I don't hear why isn't this baseball or soccer player not playing when there are some of those young men that could contribute also. Maybe they quit playing a sport because they just don't enjoy it anymore - kind of like when you change jobs or careers. Football always had practice in the summer and there was baseball in the summer and basketball was pick up games or you went to a camp (not a team camp) so when you add in all the organization, mandatory practices games etc maybe it really isn't fun to all of them anymore. Sometimes kids are playing for their parents and not themselves. I can think of one HHS grad that did this and had all the talent in the world and did not want to play. He did because his dad wanted him to. The team would have been better off without him IMHO. There are kids walking the halls of every high school that don't play any sports and could but they don't care to.

 

As far as AAU goes I think most would be better off playing pick up basketball in Goebel Park, the Armory, Friars Club, Y etc because often times kids get burned out playing tournaments each weekend and practicing when some of the coaches act and think they are Bobby Knight. Not all of them but some of them. Just because you played AAU doesn't guarantee that you are going to play in HS. Kids get bigger and stronger and others quit growing and improving.

 

So the 5 kids I mentioned above all of the sudden just stopped having fun playing basketball at Highlands. It just so happens all of them are very good football players also. The days of Goebel Park and the Armory to find good competition is long gone brother. You go up to the Armory these days on Wed/Thurs nights and its a bunch of scrubs or overweight dudes who cant slide their feet and foul all the time. Back in the 80's Coach Shields would have his kids up there and everyone in NKY knew it so they would come over and there would be some great games. AAU is very important if you want to be an above average High School player. If you can name one kid in NKY who was a good HS player in the last 5 yrs who didnt ever play AAU I would love to know that kid.

Between Shields and Messmer at Highlands in their combined 27 years as head coaches they won 9 regional championships and played in other regional finals not winning. So to say they were not dominant might be correct but their record in those 27 years playing the competition they played in and out of the 9th region was pretty dang good. I would have to look this up but if you look at those years I would say they won more regional championships in that period than any other school. They did this with a combination of players that were only basketball and those that played other sports including football. This years team has 7 or 8 football players on the JV and Varsity so I am not sure why people keep harping on the football players for not playing. I don't hear why isn't this baseball or soccer player not playing when there are some of those young men that could contribute also. Maybe they quit playing a sport because they just don't enjoy it anymore - kind of like when you change jobs or careers. Football always had practice in the summer and there was baseball in the summer and basketball was pick up games or you went to a camp (not a team camp) so when you add in all the organization, mandatory practices games etc maybe it really isn't fun to all of them anymore. Sometimes kids are playing for their parents and not themselves. I can think of one HHS grad that did this and had all the talent in the world and did not want to play. He did because his dad wanted him to. The team would have been better off without him IMHO. There are kids walking the halls of every high school that don't play any sports and could but they don't care to.

 

As far as AAU goes I think most would be better off playing pick up basketball in Goebel Park, the Armory, Friars Club, Y etc because often times kids get burned out playing tournaments each weekend and practicing when some of the coaches act and think they are Bobby Knight. Not all of them but some of them. Just because you played AAU doesn't guarantee that you are going to play in HS. Kids get bigger and stronger and others quit growing and improving.

 

Exactly.:thumb:

Exactly.:thumb:

 

As if we didnt expect that.

I would love to but I'm trying to raise a family of 4, attend my son's games, coach my stepson 3 days a week, coach my 5 yr old daughter on Saturdays, mix in a little work at the clip of 45-50 hrs a week and try to keep my beautiful wife happy. Oh and my pops has dementia at 62 and i try and help my mom out There as she is his primary caregiver. But I will get right on it. LOL

Maybe someone, former player, graduate, a person in the community with a little more time could develop something like that. However, if we keep losing kids who have AAU experience once they become Frosh and sophs then what's the point. Like Tommy B said in the other thread, we gotta figure out how to keep em in the program. In the past 2 yrs the program has lost some kids who had 3-4 yrs AAU experience and could be contributing to the program but they aren't playing because they want to focus on football.

 

JR 6'3 200lb David Christian- played AAU ball from 3rd-8th grade. Stopped after Frosh yr.

JR 6'0 180lb Donovan McCoy- played 2-yrs AAU and led the Frosh team in scoring.

JR 6'3 180lb Jac Collinsworth- played atleast 3 yrs AAU and was key JV player last year earning some Varsity minutes as a soph.

Current freshman who decided to not play and are excellent players with solid AAU experience.

Frosh- Beau Hoge - very Good PG who played several yrs of AAU ball with the Hornets.

Frosh- Griffin Urlage- great shooter and top notch athlete. He was fed the kool aid last yr and he didn't even come out.

 

I'm guessing Coach Flynn may have been hoping a few of these kids would have stuck with the program and all have their own reasons for not playing but don't tell me kids optic.g to play football and nothing else isn't affecting the program.

 

There are 2 current JRs with zero AAU experience and played sparingly on the Frosh and JV teams the past 2 yrs. These guys are being asked now to grow up and become varsity players and it just doesn't happen overnight. Witte and Turner are the only JRs with extensive AAU experience.

 

As if we did'nt expect that.

As if we did'nt expect that.

 

Why dont you stick to the football forum period.

So the 5 kids I mentioned above all of the sudden just stopped having fun playing basketball at Highlands. It just so happens all of them are very good football players also. The days of Goebel Park and the Armory to find good competition is long gone brother. You go up to the Armory these days on Wed/Thurs nights and its a bunch of scrubs or overweight dudes who cant slide their feet and foul all the time. Back in the 80's Coach Shields would have his kids up there and everyone in NKY knew it so they would come over and there would be some great games. AAU is very important if you want to be an above average High School player. If you can name one kid in NKY who was a good HS player in the last 5 yrs who didnt ever play AAU I would love to know that kid.

 

Thing are inherently different at Highlands than in the Shields, Messmer era. It was stated that there has always been summer football at Highlands and that is true. I had a conversation with a friend of mine that was a very good football player in the early 80's. He told me that what the kids are doing now is much more time consuming and physically intense than we strapped on the helmet. Thus, we have kids that quit playing bball, especially in the summer. The other apparent difference is that there was always a larger core of bball players that did not play football. the 79 team ( one of the better all tiime teams ) had no football players. 82 regional winner had a couple, but still had a group that did not play football. The guys that did play football, still had the time and energy to play during the summer. I may be wrong here, because I'm not totally familiar with all of the squads in the late 80's and 90's, but it seems the Lorenzen, Smith era may be the only time where the team was successful mainly with football players. I have a hard time including that era, due to the fact that HHS will see the likes of those types of athletes rarely. So, the question is, why is it different at HHS now, than in the past?

Why dont you stick to the football forum period.

 

Ah heck, Qryche. Henry probably knows about as much about basketball as you do about football.

 

To Henry's point and with much respect, I realize you are busy; then again the founders of the Jr. Football League and the countless others who have been involved in the League since then have pretty much all been extremely busy themselves. But, realizing the importance it played in making the Highlands football program successful, they make the necessary sacrifices needed to make the League a top priority in their lives. Ask Henry how we celebrated a lot of our anniversaries! It wasn't a romantic dinner I can assure you.

 

If one doesn't or can't make organizing and running a similar type youth basketball league in FT a top priority, one can't or shouldn't grumble if FT kids grow up wanting to make football their first priority and in high school choose to give up other sports to concentrate on football. That's just reality and for now the way it is in FT. Folks can blame Mueller all they want, but a large majority of kids have chosen to play just football at Highlands for a long time. Not all, but a lot.

 

If Mueller is "guilty" of anything, it's taking football to never before experienced heights, making football even more attractive at Highlands than it's ever been before. As someone else posted, the bunk about Highlands not having good coaches in the other sports is rather ridiculous. I strongly think that Flynn, Richey, Bioni, etc, are excellent coaches and that Mueller as the AD has done a great job working with the Principal to get great coaches. Other than telling Dale to intentionally weaken the football program to make it less attractive or having Dale tell football players that they won't get much playing time unless they play other sports, I'm not sure exactly what people expect Dale to do to help out the other sports (he already encourages them to play other sports and that's undeniable: ask Flynn and Bioni directly if any one doubts such).

 

I agree that it stinks that so many kids that had played AAU basketball and had played for the lower level Highlands basketball teams decided to not play again this year. I'm sure the varsity team would have been better if some had kept playing. But the reality is, that's unlikely to change. One can grumble about it, but that's not going to effectuate change. Rather than having one 6th grade team, one 7th grade team and one 8th grade team (I think that's the case, correct?), I think it's imperative that there be 4 6th grade basketball teams; 4 7th grade teams; and 4 8th grade teams. Heck, I'd see if the school would accept having 2 frosh teams. With the realization that a decent number of kids that played basketball at those levels are going to choose to not play varsity basketball, you need enough good basketball players remaining to have an excellent varsity basketball team. In order for that to be the case, you need more than just one 6th, 7th, 8th and even 9th grade team.

 

But I totally understand your frustration. If my kids hadn't played football but had concentrated on basketball at Highlands, I'd probably have been frustrated about it also. Not sure I'd be grumbling about it on message boards though. I'd like to think that when my kids were younger I'd have made it a top priority to start a better basketball league; baseball league, etc. Too late for the kids on this year's varsity team; not too late for your step son.

 

Here's hoping that the Birds basketball team will get things rolling soon. I'm pulling for them, I can assure you of that.

Ah heck, Qryche. Henry probably knows about as much about basketball as you do about football.

 

To Henry's point and with much respect, I realize you are busy; then again the founders of the Jr. Football League and the countless others who have been involved in the League since then have pretty much all been extremely busy themselves. But, realizing the importance it played in making the Highlands football program successful, they make the necessary sacrifices needed to make the League a top priority in their lives. Ask Henry how we celebrated a lot of our anniversaries! It wasn't a romantic dinner I can assure you.

 

If one doesn't or can't make organizing and running a similar type youth basketball league in FT a top priority, one can't or shouldn't grumble if FT kids grow up wanting to make football their first priority and in high school choose to give up other sports to concentrate on football. That's just reality and for now the way it is in FT. Folks can blame Mueller all they want, but a large majority of kids have chosen to play just football at Highlands for a long time. Not all, but a lot.

 

If Mueller is "guilty" of anything, it's taking football to never before experienced heights, making football even more attractive at Highlands than it's ever been before. As someone else posted, the bunk about Highlands not having good coaches in the other sports is rather ridiculous. I strongly think that Flynn, Richey, Bioni, etc, are excellent coaches and that Mueller as the AD has done a great job working with the Principal to get great coaches. Other than telling Dale to intentionally weaken the football program to make it less attractive or having Dale tell football players that they won't get much playing time unless they play other sports, I'm not sure exactly what people expect Dale to do to help out the other sports (he already encourages them to play other sports and that's undeniable: ask Flynn and Bioni directly if any one doubts such).

 

I agree that it stinks that so many kids that had played AAU basketball and had played for the lower level Highlands basketball teams decided to not play again this year. I'm sure the varsity team would have been better if some had kept playing. But the reality is, that's unlikely to change. One can grumble about it, but that's not going to effectuate change. Rather than having one 6th grade team, one 7th grade team and one 8th grade team (I think that's the case, correct?), I think it's imperative that there be 4 6th grade basketball teams; 4 7th grade teams; and 4 8th grade teams. Heck, I'd see if the school would accept having 2 frosh teams. With the realization that a decent number of kids that played basketball at those levels are going to choose to not play varsity basketball, you need enough good basketball players remaining to have an excellent varsity basketball team. In order for that to be the case, you need more than just one 6th, 7th, 8th and even 9th grade team.

 

But I totally understand your frustration. If my kids hadn't played football but had concentrated on basketball at Highlands, I'd probably have been frustrated about it also. Not sure I'd be grumbling about it on message boards though. I'd like to think that when my kids were younger I'd have made it a top priority to start a better basketball league; baseball league, etc. Too late for the kids on this year's varsity team; not too late for your step son.

 

Here's hoping that the Birds basketball team will get things rolling soon. I'm pulling for them, I can assure you of that.

 

To be quite honest I dont want to put the time in to start a league. It isnt that important to me. I currently coach my stepson and have coached my son in the past to be involved in their lives plain in simple. It isnt to turn Highlands into a state championship contender in hoops. I have more important things to do in my life to be quite honest. I care about the program and I want it to be successfull but I honestly dont have the time or the history with the school to dedicate that kind of time. It doesnt mean that I dont want it to happen or wouldnt donate some of my time to help out. I feel like the work I have done with the group of kids I coached in the past and the work I do now with the current 5th graders at Johnson is enough. We have a great group of kids and they will be successfull as HS athletes. I hope they all continue to play hoops but we do have a couple kids who excel at football and I can see them possibly giving it up. The key is getting as many of these kids better so that if they do choose to play they have the experience.

 

As far as grumbling on message boards, I really dont have anything to hide. Anybody that knows me certainly knows I say what I want when I want. I am not a lurker and I definitely dont hide on here.

 

Would I like to see the Highlands basketball team vie for the 9th Region crown? Yes indeed. Will my life be incomplete if they dont win it? Certianly not.

 

My current HS son is having fun and that is all that matters. Do I like the losses? Heck no, anybody with a competitive bone in their body would be frustrated.

 

The lack of success to be quite honest shouldnt be attributed to a few kids that decided not to play. That is probably not fair. I only pointed out that those kids certainly could have helped us. The lack of dedication to getting better in the offseason is what is hurting the program. They are much more involved in training for football and they dont give hoops enough time. Basketball is a skill sport and you cant simply take athletes and put them on the floor and expect them to win if they lack skill.

 

Happy Friday LN !!

To be quite honest I dont want to put the time in to start a league. It isnt that important to me. I currently coach my stepson and have coached my son in the past to be involved in their lives plain in simple. It isnt to turn Highlands into a state championship contender in hoops. I have more important things to do in my life to be quite honest. I care about the program and I want it to be successfull but I honestly dont have the time or the history with the school to dedicate that kind of time. It doesnt mean that I dont want it to happen or wouldnt donate some of my time to help out. I feel like the work I have done with the group of kids I coached in the past and the work I do now with the current 5th graders at Johnson is enough. We have a great group of kids and they will be successfull as HS athletes. I hope they all continue to play hoops but we do have a couple kids who excel at football and I can see them possibly giving it up. The key is getting as many of these kids better so that if they do choose to play they have the experience.

 

As far as grumbling on message boards, I really dont have anything to hide. Anybody that knows me certainly knows I say what I want when I want. I am not a lurker and I definitely dont hide on here.

 

Would I like to see the Highlands basketball team vie for the 9th Region crown? Yes indeed. Will my life be incomplete if they dont win it? Certianly not.

 

My current HS son is having fun and that is all that matters. Do I like the losses? Heck no, anybody with a competitive bone in their body would be frustrated.

 

The lack of success to be quite honest shouldnt be attributed to a few kids that decided not to play. That is probably not fair. I only pointed out that those kids certainly could have helped us. The lack of dedication to getting better in the offseason is what is hurting the program. They are much more involved in training for football and they dont give hoops enough time. Basketball is a skill sport and you cant simply take athletes and put them on the floor and expect them to win if they lack skill.

 

Happy Friday LN !!

 

Thanks Qryche and Happy Friday to you too.

 

Your comments about not wanting to put the time into to start the league are fair. If improving the baskeball program to the level of being a state championship contender or even a regular 9th region championship contender is not that important to you, then no one can blame you for your decision. I just thought, based on your past posts, that you were pretty unhappy and frustrated with the level of the program and was making the point that those unhappy have to do more than just post what they want when they want on message boards if they really want things to change. Didn't mean it to be offensive and hope you didn't take it that way.

 

I certainly agree with you that your life shouldn't be incomplete if the Birds don't win the 9th region this year. Heck, my older son got as much out of playing football at Highlands as my younger son did, and the older son's teams weren't near as successful.