I have to disagree about giving them welfare. I'm not sure I even know any illegal immigrants personally, but I do know the industries they permeate. And they work, work hard, and work the jobs Americans don't want, or feel are beneath them. I doubt the welfare roles will increase much.

 

The farmers I have talked to would rather hire immigrants than American teenagers because of what you have stated.:thumb:

I have to disagree about giving them welfare. I'm not sure I even know any illegal immigrants personally, but I do know the industries they permeate. And they work, work hard, and work the jobs Americans don't want, or feel are beneath them. I doubt the welfare roles will increase much.

 

Yet the numbers I see for hospital care and expense for incarceration, overwwhelm us. I agree as a whole, they work hard, but you have to take other factors into consideration.

I have to disagree about giving them welfare. I'm not sure I even know any illegal immigrants personally, but I do know the industries they permeate. And they work, work hard, and work the jobs Americans don't want, or feel are beneath them. I doubt the welfare roles will increase much.

 

In the past, hard working, law-abiding immigrants, wanting a better life and seeking to become citizens have made this country great. I don't see today's immigrants as being different. However, in today's world we need to control the border for issues of security and fairness. Also, there is a limit to the numbers that we can absorb into society before it strains the system.

In the past, hard working, law-abiding immigrants, wanting a better life and seeking to become citizens have made this country great. I don't see today's immigrants as being different. However, in today's world we need to control the border for issues of security and fairness. Also, there is a limit to the numbers that we can absorb into society before it strains the system.

 

 

That's a legitimate argument, IMO. But to say they'll be put on welfare, or that they even want to be on welfare is extremely biased, and unfairly so. Ggranted, I believe I only know legal immigrants, I still know that they have far too much pride and pragmatism to simply accept welfare.

FWIW, in the short amount of time I worked in taxes, I heard about illegal immigrants "buying" SS#'s from retirees who would still like to have money contributed to "their" SS funds.

Welcome back!

What is your proposal to round up and deport 12 million people?

 

You deport those that you find one, two or a dozen at a time. There is no way you can go after all of them.

 

Reagan legalized illegals during his term, said we would never do it again and stop future illegals from coming into the country. Another example of failure of government. The defense our borders should be a major concern, but the government has failed miserably for the last 30 years.

http://townhall.com/columnists/LindaChavez/2009/04/17/supporting_family_values

A new report out this week from the Pew Hispanic Center confirms what many observers already suspected about the illegal immigrant population in the United States: It is made up increasingly of intact families and their American-born children. Nearly half of illegal immigrant households consist of two-parent families with children, and 73 percent of these children were born here and are therefore U.S. citizens.

 

One of the chief social problems afflicting this country is the breakdown in the traditional family. But among immigrants, the two-parent household is alive and well.

 

But there is still some room for optimism in the Pew Hispanic report. Nearly half of illegal immigrants between the ages of 18-24 who have graduated from high school attend college. A surprising 25 percent of illegal immigrant adults have at least some college, with 15 percent having completed college.

 

And although earnings among illegal immigrants are lower than among either the native population or legal immigrants, they are far from destitute. The median household income for illegal immigrants was $36,000 in 2007 compared with $50,000 for native-born households. And illegal immigrant males have much higher labor force participation rates than the native born, 94 percent compared with 83 percent for U.S.-born males.

Considering there is no feasable way to round up and deport 12 million people who are already living and in most cases working here I don't see a problem with it.

I won't pretend to be familiar with the specifics of President Obama's plan, but assuming it is more than simply saying that anyone here is legal, wouldn't it be equally as difficult to round up those 12 million people to start the process of legalization?

Well, you would have to 1st get started in stopping what is happening. Seen the unemployment rate lately?

 

Know a lot of unemployed people packing up their trucks to go pick lettuce in California these days? These people are doing unskilled manual labor. Most people I know who have been laid off don't want to take such a massive pay cut with no benefits. Although, maybe we should just wait awhile... see how desperate Americans get.

I won't pretend to be familiar with the specifics of President Obama's plan, but assuming it is more than simply saying that anyone here is legal, wouldn't it be equally as difficult to round up those 12 million people to start the process of legalization?

 

While I don't know all of the specifics either, and tend to agree that it will still be difficult to implement; I think the attraction of citizenship and not having the threat of being deported and seperated from your family would be very attractive to most in question.

Opponents of a legalization effort said that if the Obama administration maintained the enforcement pressure initiated by Mr. Bush, the recession would force many illegal immigrants to return home. Dan Stein, the president of the Federation for American Immigration Reform, said it would be “politically disastrous” for Mr. Obama to begin an immigration initiative at this time.

 

 

 

This paragraph from the article describes the issue in a nutshell. There is no plan that Obama has right now. He simply made promises to Hispanic voters to court their vote, and is now committed. He won't correct course, regardless as to what is in the country's best interest, because it would be political disaster.

 

I believe the phrase is "you made the bed, now sleep in it."

While I don't know all of the specifics either, and tend to agree that it will still be difficult to implement; I think the attraction of citizenship and not having the threat of being deported and seperated from your family would be very attractive to most in question.

 

So you want to reward them for breaking the law?

For what it's worth here are my two cents:

 

You aren't going to get many, if any, illegals to come forward for punishment so you are going to have to give them some enticement to come forward.

 

A path to citizenship would likely be the best route, however it would have to come with some sanctions and restrictions(jail time, fines and so on). Any criminals, short of minor traffic violations, would be immediately and unquestionably deported(of course you don't tell them that part ahead of time).

 

While on the topic of citizenship I think an examination of the means to become a citizen in the U.S. needs to be done. What can we do to streamline it and improve it? These are things that need to be at the top of our list in regards to making it less complicated to come here legally.

 

 

Now as to the borders:

 

Minefields along the border in addition to signs in English and Spanish clearly stating that an illegal violation of U.S. territory is punishable by lethal force, also direct them to a legal immigration office. Increase border security and up their armament, making sure that they are authorized use deadly force. Although with the land mines they may need shovels more so than guns. I know many hear the word "land mine" and they instantly think poor child in Africa blown to pieces. Here is my reasoning for using them:

 

1) You need an effective deterrent and I think that if Miguel sees Paulo blown to little pieces by something he can't see then it is likely to force him to rethink this course of action.

2) Mines are cost effective, don't need to be paid for more than once and much more sure at stopping someone than a fence.

 

Also increase the use of motion sensors and/or other physical obstructions to deter an illegal crossing.

 

:thumb:

 

I've been saying we need to put mines on the boarder for the past 5 years.

 

I'll go a step further though. Those illegals that make it through the mines and into the country, are granted automatic citizenship.

:thumb:

 

I've been saying we need to put mines on the boarder for the past 5 years.

 

I'll go a step further though. Those illegals that make it through the mines and into the country, are granted automatic citizenship.

 

I will assume that your further step is a joke.

It would only take 328 years to deport 12 million people at a rate of 100 deportations a day. I say we just start deporting and see how that goes.

 

The land-mine thing is despicable and makes me want to puke. We kill someone or injure them for life because they want to come to America to make a better life for themselves? WOW - Now that is what a Christian nation should do. Obama is right, we are not a Christian nation!!