He does need to have his role adjusted with the way he's pitching right now. 20 hits and 11 walks in 14.1 innings isn't getting the job done late in a game...

 

I agree. None of the other relievers stats are much better though. I think Burton or Lincoln should possibly be given a shot at being the set up man if Weathers struggles continue. Only problem with them is they've been prone to giving up the long ball.

I suspect the players chalk it up to silly media hype.

 

Again, you guys make much more of a fuss about "the curse" as most Cubs fans I know.

Go back and read some of my criticism about Dusty when he was hired by the Reds. One of the things I mentioned then is that he spent half a season hitting Corey Patterson and Neifi Perez at the top of the order when they had the two worst OBPs in the lineup.

 

That was before the Reds signed Patterson, then (lo and behold) Dusty has him hitting in the leadoff slot on opening day. Almost like a gift from the baseball gods ...

 

Even some Reds fans on here have questioned it. You're not?

 

 

I have questioned why Dusty chose Patterson over Hopper, but I haven't continued to make a point about like you continuously have. We know your feelings on Patterson and Dusty, what is your point in brining it up on what seems to be a daily basis? Your point has been noted, can we please move on?

I have questioned why Dusty chose Patterson over Hopper, but I haven't continued to make a point about like you continuously have. We know your feelings on Patterson and Dusty, what is your point in brining it up on what seems to be a daily basis? Your point has been noted, can we please move on?

I'm not going out of my way to keep harping on it, as you and gametime seem to think I am. But if I see something noteworthy of criticism, I'll make the point.

 

I'll post what I want, when I want, as always within BGP guidelines. If you don't like it, don't read it.

The argument was that I, or anyone else can criticize any manager's lineups, decisions, etc..... The point is it gets old when that's all you ever do in the Reds threads. It's a little different when it comes from a Reds fan, but when it's constantly coming from Cubs fan, and he's criticizing his former manager, then it looks and sounds like someone who has nothing but hard feelings toward Dusty. I don't remember those two constantly coming in and criticizing the lineups of Bob Boone, Dave Miley or Petey Mac. By the way, how long was Soriano ever been left in the 3-5 hole, and been given a chance to produce?

 

 

Actually plenty of chances. He has over 600 plate appearances in both the 3 and 5 spots (only 44 batting 4th).

 

For his career here are his splits:

 

Leadoff:

 

2932 Plate Appearances, .295 Batting Average, .341 OB%, 185 2Bs, 164 HRs, 376 RBIs, 163 BBs, 590 Ks, 138 SBs.

 

All other spots:

 

2042 Plate Appearances, .263 Batting Average, .305 OB%, 104 2Bs, 87 HRs, 280 RBIs, 100 BBs, 401 Ks, 94 SB.

 

It is obvious he is a much better hitter in the leadoff spot. Like I said using Lou's placement of Soriano was a weak example. Dusty's use of Patterson is a much more valid argument.

Actually plenty of chances. He has over 600 plate appearances in both the 3 and 5 spots (only 44 batting 4th).

 

For his career here are his splits:

 

Leadoff:

 

2932 Plate Appearances, .295 Batting Average, .341 OB%, 185 2Bs, 164 HRs, 376 RBIs, 163 BBs, 590 Ks, 138 SBs.

 

All other spots:

 

2042 Plate Appearances, .263 Batting Average, .305 OB%, 104 2Bs, 87 HRs, 280 RBIs, 100 BBs, 401 Ks, 94 SB.

 

It is obvious he is a much better hitter in the leadoff spot. Like I said using Lou's placement of Soriano was a weak example. Dusty's use of Patterson is a much more valid argument.

I would rather see Soriano hit in the #2 spot, but there isn't a really good leadoff hitter there, either.

 

That's been a persistent problem with the Cubs ... they've never placed a premium on acquiring and developing hitters that get on base regularly. Every once in a while, when their offense struggles, Cubs fans talk about the need for more power when the real problem is they don't have enough hitters on base.

 

Now, back to the Reds ...

I'm not going out of my way to keep harping on it, as you and gametime seem to think I am. But if I see something noteworthy of criticism, I'll make the point.

 

I'll post what I want, when I want. If you don't like it, don't read it.

 

 

 

:laugh::laugh::laugh: Please excuse me as I come back from reminiscing about my Jr. high days. You do go out of your way. Trust me, GT, and I aren't the only ones that see it. What's comical about it is you're not even a Reds fan. Why should you even care? Where was the constant criticism of the other managers? If you can't see like everyone else what that makes you look like, then by all means post away, and keep adding to your reputation.

:laugh::laugh::laugh: Please excuse me as I come back from reminiscing about my Jr. high days. You do go out of your way. Trust me, GT, and I aren't the only ones that see it. What's comical about it is you're not even a Reds fan. Why should you even care? Where was the constant criticism of the other managers? If you can't see like everyone else what that makes you look like, then by all means post away, and keep adding to your reputation.

John Dillinger, the story goes, was asked why he robbed banks. His answer was "That's where the money is."

 

I'm a baseball fan, much more so than I'm a fan of any particular team. On this board, most of the baseball talk is about the Reds. That's where the action is.

 

My reputation? Heck, that's already in tatters with some on this board. I'm going to post my opinions, and I will provide evidence to back them up. If you feel I'm wrong, feel free to debate the issue. That's the way it's done here.

John Dillinger, the story goes, was asked why he robbed banks. His answer was "That's where the money is."

 

I'm a baseball fan, much more so than I'm a fan of any particular team. On this board, most of the baseball talk is about the Reds. That's where the action is.

 

My reputation? Heck, that's already in tatters with some on this board. I'm going to post my opinions, and I will provide evidence to back them up. If you feel I'm wrong, feel free to debate the issue. That's the way it's done here.

 

 

I've given you two chances so far, and you still are avoiding answering. Where was all the criticism for Boone, Miley, and Petey Mac? Trust me, you had plenty of chances with the first two names.

I've given you two chances so far, and you still are avoiding answering. Where was all the criticism for Boone, Miley, and Petey Mac? Trust me, you had plenty of chances with the first two names.

 

How about your response to the Soriano statement you made? The numbers backed up what I said didn't they? :sssh: Your criticism of another manager just to try and show up westsider is no better than his harping on Dusty, especially when the point you tried to make is not valid.

I've given you two chances so far, and you still are avoiding answering. Where was all the criticism for Boone, Miley, and Petey Mac? Trust me, you had plenty of chances with the first two names.

I wasn't posting in this thread very often, at that time ... sorry.

 

Actually, I thought Mackanan did a pretty decent job. I thought he was a better choice than his successor.

How about your response to the Soriano statement you made? The numbers backed up what I said didn't they? :sssh: Your criticism of another manager just to try and show up westsider is no better than his harping on Dusty, especially when the point you tried to make is not valid.

 

 

Do I have to explain it again? My point wasn't necessarily Soriano, but that we could find ways to criticize all managers if we chose to do so. Using Soriano may have been a bad example to use, but that wasn't my main point. We all know what Westsider's stance is on Patterson and Baker. We get it. What is the point on brining it up over and over and over. Do you like listening to a broken record? I don't think anyone does, yet we constantly have to in the Reds thread.

I wasn't posting in this thread very often, at that time ... sorry.

 

Actually, I thought Mackanan did a pretty decent job. I thought he was a better choice than his successor.

 

 

And you can't see what it makes you look like when you all of a sudden start jumping in when Dusty takes over? Now I've never met you, and I'll have to take you for your word, but try looking at it from our point of view, and I'm sure you can see how we see it.

With all the discussion of lead off hitters burning this thread up, I have a question ( 2 actually). What kind of numbers are we all looking for out of the 1 spot? Are there a lot of guys leading off and posting those type of numbers?

With all the discussion of lead off hitters burning this thread up, I have a question ( 2 actually). What kind of numbers are we all looking for out of the 1 spot? Are there a lot of guys leading off and posting those type of numbers?

 

 

Ideally, you'd like you're leadoff man to have an OBP of at least .380 or higher and have some speed. I haven't really looked at the numbers of all the leadoff hitters in the majors, but I wouldn't imagine that there are too many that have that high of an OBP.

With all the discussion of lead off hitters burning this thread up, I have a question ( 2 actually). What kind of numbers are we all looking for out of the 1 spot? Are there a lot of guys leading off and posting those type of numbers?

 

I personally think a good lead off hitter has atleast a .300 BA, .400+ OBP, 25-35 SB, and anywhere from 15-25 HR's.

 

Now is that likely? Probably not, but as long as a leadoff man is getting on base 40+ % of the time he's doing his job.