What I know of 'middle school' football is that its rules, makeup and approach are different county to county. So I am not sure if the kids that play for the LC middle school team are eligible to play MS at their home counties or in Fayette. I know that to be eligible at LC for the middle school team you have to attend a school that is NOT a feeder to a High School with a football team. This disqualifies most, if not all, the public school attendees in Fayette and the surrounding counties and Frankfort and Richmond. So the LC MS program is NOT an enticement to get kids that are otherwise likely to go public HS hooked on the LC brand.

 

I would guess that in most case the kids from outside Fayette can not play for other teams. As noted, the commitment to driving in 4 days a week (practices usually M-W and games usually on Thursday) is not one taken lightly. But there are always kids from Frankfort, Paris, Richmond, etc. that play and do that drive each day during the week. The 'carbon footprint' of the LC football family members is usually fairly large during football season! Especially since all games are against non-Fayette Co. competition, except for LCA. So our games are in Boyle Co., Berea, Frankfort, Rockcastle County, Whitley County, Paris, etc.

 

 

Thanks. Perhaps some other posters can provide some intel on the youth and middle school programs in the areas surrounding Lex. I'm told that Lex does not have a very coordinated youth football league, that the league(s) and teams aren't really affiliated with any particular high school, and that the school board puts some restrictions in place years ago that really has set back their middle school football program. Further, I'm told that those restrictions have resulted in some kids transferring into the Catholic middle schools so they can play in the LC middle school football program. Which is sort of ironic isn't it? The public schools put pressure on LC to prevent any middle school student attending a public middle school from playing in the LC middle school football program. As a result, they have lost kids entirely to the LC affiliated private middle schools, where once there, a lot of them are probably out of the public system for good. I'm also told that with the restrictions placed on the Lex public middle school football program, that soccer in Lex has really blossomed and with basketball, has become the sport of choice in Lex which has further hurt Lex high school football. I've heard those comments from numerous sports affiliated people in Lex, including football coaches and including people in the public high schools. I don't know that the comments are true, but based on the frequency that I've heard the comments and the credibility of the people making them, I'm inclined to beleive that they are true. Yet people wonder why the public high schools in Lex aren't more successful in football. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out why they are not more competitive with T and X, which benefit greatly from a very well ran Catholic youth football league in Lou. I'll say it again, having a youth football league that is well ran and "connected" with the local high school is the greatest determinant in developing a strong football program year in and year out. A strong youth league gets young kids interested in football early on while they are "sampling" sports; it teaches them fundamentals; and it can "tie" them emotionally with their local high school. Coming from someone that has seen first hand how Highlands football program has benefitted from the Ft. Thomas Jr. Football League, I know those things are true.

Thanks. Perhaps some other posters can provide some intel on the youth and middle school programs in the areas surrounding Lex. I'm told that Lex does not have a very coordinated youth football league, that the league(s) and teams aren't really affiliated with any particular high school, and that the school board puts some restrictions in place years ago that really has set back their middle school football program. Further, I'm told that those restrictions have resulted in some kids transferring into the Catholic middle schools so they can play in the LC middle school football program. Which is sort of ironic isn't it? The public schools put pressure on LC to prevent any middle school student attending a public middle school from playing in the LC middle school football program. As a result, they have lost kids entirely to the LC affiliated private middle schools, where once there, a lot of them are probably out of the public system for good. I'm also told that with the restrictions placed on the Lex public middle school football program, that soccer in Lex has really blossomed and with basketball, has become the sport of choice in Lex which has further hurt Lex high school football. I've heard those comments from numerous sports affiliated people in Lex, including football coaches and including people in the public high schools. I don't know that the comments are true, but based on the frequency that I've heard the comments and the credibility of the people making them, I'm inclined to beleive that they are true. Yet people wonder why the public high schools in Lex aren't more successful in football. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out why they are not more competitive with T and X, which benefit greatly from a very well ran Catholic youth football league in Lou. I'll say it again, having a youth football league that is well ran and "connected" with the local high school is the greatest determinant in developing a strong football program year in and year out. A strong youth league gets young kids interested in football early on while they are "sampling" sports; it teaches them fundamentals; and it can "tie" them emotionally with their local high school. Coming from someone that has seen first hand how Highlands football program has benefitted from the Ft. Thomas Jr. Football League, I know those things are true.

 

I agree. I think the South Lake Carroll football system in Texas is an example that supports what you are talking about Leatherneck.

I'm with you 100% on this. However, I think your idea is a largely utopian one. You'd be a fool to think that your going to get the same type of community involvement from Holmes that you get at Highlands, no matter how much you harp on the parents. Simple socioeconomics, some of these parents work 2 jobs or more, and simply don't have the time or money to donate to the program. On the other hand, if you have 6 grand to shell out for tuition, you are also far more likely to have some extra time or money to donate (at least this has been my experience).

 

I also want to point out that I am not saying the privates are "doing it right" or "doing it wrong". I am simply saying that there are inherent advantages to being a private school that enable them to continue to get a leg up on the public schools. It is far easier to give your compelling speech to a room full of people that wish to make things better than it is to people that only wish to complain about the problem.

 

Bottom line is this: There is probably a reason that the parents of private school students can afford the tuition. They think rationally, make sound decisions, are fiscally responsible, etc, etc. The same can not be said of many of their public school counterparts...........I know you'd like to envision them being the same, but there IS a reason they are NOT.

 

Well said Under the Lights...but how do some city inner city schools like Central turn around their programs? In Miami, aren't there several inner city schools that are football powerhouses in Florida? Poor coaching and lack of community involvement are factors that can be changed, albeit not always easily.

Thanks. Perhaps some other posters can provide some intel on the youth and middle school programs in the areas surrounding Lex. I'm told that Lex does not have a very coordinated youth football league, that the league(s) and teams aren't really affiliated with any particular high school, and that the school board puts some restrictions in place years ago that really has set back their middle school football program. Further, I'm told that those restrictions have resulted in some kids transferring into the Catholic middle schools so they can play in the LC middle school football program. Which is sort of ironic isn't it? The public schools put pressure on LC to prevent any middle school student attending a public middle school from playing in the LC middle school football program. As a result, they have lost kids entirely to the LC affiliated private middle schools, where once there, a lot of them are probably out of the public system for good. I'm also told that with the restrictions placed on the Lex public middle school football program, that soccer in Lex has really blossomed and with basketball, has become the sport of choice in Lex which has further hurt Lex high school football. I've heard those comments from numerous sports affiliated people in Lex, including football coaches and including people in the public high schools. I don't know that the comments are true, but based on the frequency that I've heard the comments and the credibility of the people making them, I'm inclined to beleive that they are true. Yet people wonder why the public high schools in Lex aren't more successful in football. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out why they are not more competitive with T and X, which benefit greatly from a very well ran Catholic youth football league in Lou. I'll say it again, having a youth football league that is well ran and "connected" with the local high school is the greatest determinant in developing a strong football program year in and year out. A strong youth league gets young kids interested in football early on while they are "sampling" sports; it teaches them fundamentals; and it can "tie" them emotionally with their local high school. Coming from someone that has seen first hand how Highlands football program has benefitted from the Ft. Thomas Jr. Football League, I know those things are true.

 

I guess this can apply to most things we here about private schools as well.

 

Where there is smoke, there is fire.

 

OK, Now I'm finished.

I guess this can apply to most things we here about private schools as well.

 

Where there is smoke, there is fire.

 

OK, Now I'm finished.

 

Except what they told me is an admission against their own interests, whereas you don't hear the privates going around admitting that they cheat. Huge difference my friend.

 

Now back to the issue, do you have any knowledge as to whether what I was told by Lexington folks about the Lex public middle school league and the youth football situation is accurate or not? That's what I'm looking for, not whether you are upset that LC beat Bell or some other school that you support. That's already painfully apparent. Whenever a private school becomes dominant, its caused in part (and in my opinion, a big part) as a result of the near by public schools having failed to some degree. No parent in their right mind (other than those chosing a private school strictly for religion purposes) is going to choose to pay tuition in the thousands of dollars each year, choose to forego public transportation and in some cases be forced to drive their kids long distances to and fro the private school, when there are well ran public schools near by providing strong academic and athletic programs to the kids. I think LC's success has been made much easier by decisions made by the Lexington public school district in re middle school football and by the failure of the head coaches of the public high schools in Lexington to get more involved in the youth football leagues.

Except what they told me is an admission against their own interests, whereas you don't hear the privates going around admitting that they cheat. Huge difference my friend.

 

Now back to the issue, do you have any knowledge as to whether what I was told by Lexington folks about the Lex public middle school league and the youth football situation is accurate or not?

 

 

From what I know what you were told is very accurate. I do not know the program but go off other parents comments who were involved a couple of years ago. The teams only play 6 games in the schedule and it seems to be against other Fayette MS schools. The couple of parents who commented were not impressed...and now....their kids do not play football while in HS.

 

There are a lot of activities that can take away from the football pool in Fayette - soccer is a big one. Others include hockey and Lacrosse. There are 4 full strength HS hockey teams in Lexington (LC, HC, Dunbar and Lafayette). Thats 60 physical, hard hitting kids. Only a fraction play football as well since there is an overlap. Lacrosse is coming on strong and also attracts physical football quality players.

 

With a strong LC MS program and a weak public school program the question might be is there a surge from one to other? As I have indicated the LC MS program is only open to students going to schools that are feeders to HS that DO NOT have football programs - thus disqualifying all public school attendees in Fayette and surrounding counties. So there is not a fluid in and out as it appears there is in Fort Thomas. That being said I know of maybe one family and one kid that may have enrolled in Catholic MS to focus on football this past year. And that is a maybe. Otherwise, the families seem to all be ones that were committed to Catholic schools with our without football.

 

The biggest recuiting effort for Catholic Football in MS goes on internally. Getting the football quality students who are already attending the schools to play and get their parents to make the substancial investment and commitment. This is were recuiting needs to be done by all schools and where a big difference is. Its not external recruiting that makes the difference - its internal recruiting of what is already walking through your own school doors.

Translation:

 

I have no logical arguments to back my position.

 

I believe that answer has been doing that for about a month now and has made some very valid points. The problem is that you all enjoy all the perks of how things are now and i cant say that i blame u.

But no use talking or trying to validate a point that you or me have no posibilties in changing. So my theory one worries about things you directly effect all the rest, "FORGET IT":irked::sleep::irked:

I believe that answer has been doing that for about a month now and has made some very valid points. The problem is that you all enjoy all the perks of how things are now and i cant say that i blame u.

But no use talking or trying to validate a point that you or me have no posibilties in changing. So my theory one worries about things you directly effect all the rest, "FORGET IT":irked::sleep::irked:

 

 

Question: If "we" are enjoying the perks of how things are now, why shouldn't "we". "We worked for them, built great programs, created "tradition, foster community. Why should "we" be penalized because "they" only recently realized that "they" are behind the eight ball?

Raceland's logo printed on their letter head is: "A private school education, in the public sector". I see a lot of parallels with Raceland and a private school. So, Raceland is as close as we will get to a private school.

 

Suprised no one has questioned this statement Ram. Isn't this offensive to public schools? How can a public school get away with putting that on a letterhead? They are saying that a private education is better, which I agree with, but I am suprised that public supporters aren't up in arms over this statement.

 

The fact that they aren't up in arms tells me they may believe it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tabman

How would a public school pay 50K - 100K??

 

 

I would say, they wouldn't, because they would be sure not to recruit. The point.

 

Ram, are you saying with this statement that public schools don't recruit?

 

 

Sorry I'm late to the party here. I saw this thread last week, but didn't have the stomach to open it. But it's like a carwreck...I just can't look away. :creepy:

Suprised no one has questioned this statement Ram. Isn't this offensive to public schools? How can a public school get away with putting that on a letterhead? They are saying that a private education is better, which I agree with, but I am suprised that public supporters aren't up in arms over this statement.

 

The fact that they aren't up in arms tells me they may believe it.

 

I don't know why anyone would get up in arms about the quote. There are a lot of parallels in Raceland schools and a private school. Many of those parallels are not with most large private schools, but with the small private schools that dot the state.

 

Raceland has small class size, most students, faculty, and parents know everyone else. The school district is small in geography, so many of the students live outside the district, thus they choose to attend Raceland. They do not attend just because they live in the district. Raceland's test scores are very good, which is synonymous with private schools.

 

There is no violence at Raceland, for the last state grading period, there were zero violent situations. Raceland is part of the alternative school in Ashland, any problem children are placed at that facility, creating a safe and problem free learning environment.

 

And, one of the things that I think is the best thing about private schools is that, most of the students and parents have a great sense of ownership in the private school that they attend, because they chose the school. Raceland students and players seem to have this sense of ownership. The school is a close knit group of people.

 

If anyone wants to get up in arms about these things, they can, but I would not know why people would fault a school district for these things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tabman

How would a public school pay 50K - 100K??

 

 

 

 

Ram, are you saying with this statement that public schools don't recruit?

 

 

Sorry I'm late to the party here. I saw this thread last week, but didn't have the stomach to open it. But it's like a carwreck...I just can't look away. :creepy:

 

 

Have you read all of my post on the subject?

 

I am not saying that public schools do not recruit. Quite the opposite. I do not separate the public schools and private schools in this discussion. If you want you can the read the opening post when I started this thread. When it comes to recruiting, I see it as "Right Versus Wrong", not "Public Versus Private".

 

I believe that any school, public or private, caught recruiting should be severely punished, by fining them $50-$100K, and banning them from post season play for five years.

 

If you think that I am anti-private, then you have seriously misjudged me.

Ram, are you saying with this statement that public schools don't recruit?

 

What I was saying with that statement was, if a school knew in advance that they would receive a punishment of $100K fine and banned from post season play for five years, they would not recruit. Schools recruit to win, if they can not play in the post season for five years, they will not win, and the player they recruited, will be graduated before they can play in the post season again.

You'd be a fool to think that your going to get the same type of community involvement from Holmes that you get at Highlands, no matter how much you harp on the parents. Simple socioeconomics, some of these parents work 2 jobs or more, and simply don't have the time or money to donate to the program. On the other hand, if you have 6 grand to shell out for tuition, you are also far more likely to have some extra time or money to donate (at least this has been my experience).

 

Bottom line is this: There is probably a reason that the parents of private school students can afford the tuition. They think rationally, make sound decisions, are fiscally responsible, etc, etc. The same can not be said of many of their public school counterparts...........I know you'd like to envision them being the same, but there IS a reason they are NOT.

 

 

This is one of the greatest misconceptions of catholic school parents. In a nutshell, you're saying we are rich, when most are middle class actually.

 

Here's my sob story, though I think it is a success story, and I don't measure success in term of money. I'll be brutally honest about my life, as I am if you were to meet me since I am a "free speaker". I'll will certainly annoy some of you. This is a true catholic experience, of which there are many. I tell it to illustrate this; simply attending private school does not make one a lord. There are quite a few serfs there as well.

 

I lived in Hikes Point growing up, accepted aid, a scholarship which I earned, grants and a work program to pay for St X. Then what was left, I paid our of MY pocket, not my parents. They paid for books only, as we were poor with 7 kids. My 6 sisters did not have to do this for some reason, only myself as the "man" I guess. I worked a 40 hour week in my Junior and Senior year at X, getting off from the Bristol at midnight some school nights. I worked overtime "off the books" (OT illegal since I was a minor) for straight pay as well.

 

Fast forward to today, not much has changed. My only kid goes to Mercy, although we tried public school two years when she was younger. Her mom is non-existant, though she lives a mile away. My kid was accepted (and recruited, they called me on my cell after we ignored the mailing) to Manual, however she declined. I am still middle class, have a huge debt with no end in sight until after high school. I do not accept handouts. St Raphael offered to help a few years ago knowing my situation at the time, but I declined. I do not consider myself poor, therefore I don't need aid. We did accept a scholarship to Mercy because my kid EARNED it.

 

My daughter rides TARC (city bus) which she pays for, she pay for her lunches, pays for her movies and works at the convent helping the nuns on Tyler lane. She get Straight A's, which is required! And very attainable by EVERY student in America BTW. She is 14, and has an IRA and soon a 401K from babysitting and cleaning houses. She plays on club traveling teams and will never go pro because there isn't a pro for field hockey or Lacrosse. But she darn well will enjoy hor high school years to the fullest! And hopefully she can play sports in college while she is there on her athletic scholarship.

 

Currently, I sit here in my 56 degree kitchen, as our furnace broke down. It broke several years ago! There is no AC as well, we use 2 small window units. We use elec space heaters at times, as I am now, then wears lots of fleece. Remember, what doesn't kill us, will make us stronger. Most would think this is stupid, as I sometimes do. But I know my Mercy school payment is the first thing I budget, then other bills follow. One day, I'll get down the list to a furnace. Or a roof so I don't need the pans in the DR. But I am a cash only guy with no rainy day fund. There is no cable or satelite on my 22 year old TV. I only have 'the net' cause I have to for my kid. I don't go out that much, nor have I had a drink in 12 years. It simply cost too much to drink, nor did I enjoy it. I can't be catholic you say!!

 

Every month, my checking account gets north of $40 at least twice, barring some glorious miracle. Luckily, I am now on Federal Jury Duty, and the extra money is very helpful. I'm the only juror glad to be there. :thumb: I haven't had to donate plasma in a few weeks now, which is nice.

 

However, I still donate every year to that fund at St X that helped me when I was there. I donate my time and not much money to my parish. In my will. most is left to Mercy right now, because my daughter will be fine on her own. That's assuming I have anything to give them, so we're not talking big $$$$ here. I hope I am at least worth a new turf field for the girls though.

 

So, please adjust your stereotypes to accept someone like me at the private schools. Everyone in my middle class circle has similar, though not as drastic, situations as mine. We all worry about the monthly payment in my neck of the woods.

 

What makes someone buy a $200 field hockey stick before buying anything for yourself? Or pay the $609 a month for an education that could have been had free at Manual? It may not be explainable. I think you had to grow up that way to get it. Knowing a kid successful in sports (in private school) is almost aways a better student because of it. Knowing that 97% of our seniors last year received a scholarship of some kind is peace of mind. So as not not to offend anyone here, I pulled up a random large Indiana school for comparison. Jeffersonville HS. They only had a 69.5% GRADUATION RATE!!!, much less look at scholarships.

 

I apologize for the length of this diatribe. That's why I stopped and I'm only half way done. :lol:

Miragesmack...I know you don't accept handouts, BUT...please accept my prayers that hard working people with their priorities in line get God's blessings. Good luck to you and your daughter.