There's not all that much excitement for a team going into the playoffs knowing they are going to get waxed. You can see the parents and fans going through the motions. It has a negative effect on the kids. Its painful to watch. But, sometimes its not forced. Some places they get it. It may not be a great accomplishment by everyone's standards, but if it is the best a team can do, so what. If the effort was there, be proud of that.

 

I use to count myself as one who said the regular season should count for more, thus only 1 and 2 should make the playoffs. I still like that format, cutting a week out of the playoffs (either giving an 11th game or an extra week of practice), but its never going to happen. More playoff games = more $$$$$$$$$$$$. So let 'em all in and let the playoffs sort it out. For everyone who says the first round games are terrible, go to the 3 v. 4 game and get over it.

While I'm not gung ho about the 6 class system, its absurd to think that a kid who wins a ring is somehow going to be the slightest bit disappointed or embarrassed to show off the ring.

 

Its blowhards like us on here that think that somehow its diminished.

 

Bravo. :thumb:

While I'm not gung ho about the 6 class system, its absurd to think that a kid who wins a ring is somehow going to be the slightest bit disappointed or embarrassed to show off the ring.

 

Its blowhards like us on here that think that somehow its diminished.

 

Would I be disappointed or embarrassed, not at all. But would I realize that it's not the same state championship the other 5 that CovCath won were, yes I would. Granted this is JMO, but I know other guys I talked to in my grade, the first senior class to play under this 6 class system, agreed with me. It's almost as if we're getting screwed out of the oppurtunity to play the best competition and the hardest road possible to get to that state championship. So yes, I would be just as excited and proud to win a state championship, but somewhere in the back of my mind I would still know it's not the same quality road that the former champions had.

I guess it's all in how the kid looks at it. Not absurd in the least - but please don't misquote me. The point I was making was that they might be proud of their ring; but they would have more reason to be proud, had they earned it in competition with a larger group of teams. I never used the words dissapointed or embarrassed.

 

Semantics. When you say they could/would be "more proud" you are saying that they are "less proud" ie disappointed.

 

My point is still valid. A kid that wins a state championship is going to be proud. Period.

 

Are teams that won the 4 titles last year somehow feeling like their ring and accomplishment are "diminished" since there are 3 others who have a ring as well? Do the Birds feel "diminished" because X was considerably better? I doubt it. Check with Dale the next time you see him and ask him. Maybe I'm wrong.

Would I be disappointed or embarrassed, not at all. But would I realize that it's not the same state championship the other 5 that CovCath won were, yes I would. Granted this is JMO, but I know other guys I talked to in my grade, the first senior class to play under this 6 class system, agreed with me. It's almost as if we're getting screwed out of the oppurtunity to play the best competition and the hardest road possible to get to that state championship. So yes, I would be just as excited and proud to win a state championship, but somewhere in the back of my mind I would still know it's not the same quality road that the former champions had.

 

I don't feel like I had to struggle as much with my education as my grandpa who walked to school then worked the farm when he got home. However, it didn't take anything away from my joy of receiving my high school and college diploma.

 

Win a ring this year or next and let me know how excited you get. I bet its more than you think.

Semantics. When you say they could/would be "more proud" you are saying that they are "less proud" ie disappointed.

 

My point is still valid. A kid that wins a state championship is going to be proud. Period.

 

Are teams that won the 4 titles last year somehow feeling like their ring and accomplishment are "diminished" since there are 3 others who have a ring as well? Do the Birds feel "diminished" because X was considerably better? I doubt it. Check with Dale the next time you see him and ask him. Maybe I'm wrong.

Totally incorrect. You can't just make that rhetorical leap. Yes, they very much should feel a little bit less of a sense of accomplishment in this six class system. It's just elementary math. Less teams = less challenge. It's that simple. But to turn that magically into "disappointment" makes no sense. It's apples and oranges.

 

Ask any of the Birds if they would feel a greater sense of accomplishment had they won their rings from among a larger pool of teams -- every one of them would say, "yes." Like I said, I guess it's all a matter of attitude. The kids here (and several other successful places) have the attitude of a champion. And a champion wants his victory to be as meaningful as possible. These players don't want it handed to them on a platter.

 

That's what pride is all about.

I guess it's all in how the kid looks at it. Not absurd in the least - but please don't misquote me. The point I was making was that they might be proud of their ring; but they would have more reason to be proud, had they earned it in competition with a larger group of teams. I never used the words dissapointed or embarrassed.

So, if they split Baseball into two classes, the team that wins the A/AA class should only be half as excited as the teams that win it now? Since they only had to theoretically beat 1/2 the teams that current champs have to theoretically beat?

 

I can't believe grown men are honestly getting this worked up over this -- for it or against. Adding two classes turns into giving out participation medals? That is so crazy it can't even be debated.

 

Is it perfect? No. Do I think it was "broken" with 4 classes? Not really. But to think that grown men, with jobs and mortgages, and families can possibly be this worked into a tizzy over this is hard to fathom. It isn't splitting the atom folks. It's how many groups do we divide high school football teams into. Seriously, I can't believe the level of angst this elevates some people to. There is passionate and then there is fanatical.

 

By the way, I am in no way shape or form directing this "soap-box" message to Birdsfan directly, although I did use a quote of his to get this monologue rolling. :thumb:

So, if they split Baseball into two classes, the team that wins the A/AA class should only be half as excited as the teams that win it now? Since they only had to theoretically beat 1/2 the teams that current champs have to theoretically beat?

 

I can't believe grown men are honestly getting this worked up over this -- for it or against. Adding two classes turns into giving out participation medals? That is so crazy it can't even be debated.

First of all, I'm not "worked up" at all. But I do have an opinion.

 

And I don't think it's about "excitement." Of course they should be very excited. But does that mean they can't simultaneously understand that it's not quite the same as had they played in a more competitive system?

I would guarantee there isn't a kid in the state that wins one of 6 titles who would feel that way. But I keep forgeting that the game is played for the adults...

 

 

I can certainly hear big brother telling his little brother "We won it when it was tough to get"

 

Sure, kids will be proud. However, no matter how you paint it, it IS winning with less competition.

 

You think Beechwood kids and New Cath kids arent ELATED when one beats the other? THAT is a feeling of victory they they NEVER forget. That is the high that comes from knowing that you beat the best. Lets you know that all that hard work was worth every drop of sweat. Thats what real competition is. That is the best feeling a KID can have. Teams that have little competetion will miss that very special moment. Takes something away from being a "winner."

 

I am sure that the change was made with the best of intentions and we will all get used to it when it comes into effect, but it feels like a descent into mediocrity.

I can certainly hear big brother telling his little brother "We won it when it was tough to get"

 

Sure, kids will be proud. However, no matter how you paint it, it IS winning with less competition.

 

You think Beechwood kids and New Cath kids arent ELATED when one beats the other? THAT is a feeling of victory they they NEVER forget. That is the high that comes from knowing that you beat the best. Lets you know that all that hard work was worth every drop of sweat. Thats what real competition is. That is the best feeling a KID can have. Teams that have little competetion will miss that very special moment. Takes something away from being a "winner."

 

I am sure that the change was made with the best of intentions and we will all get used to it when it comes into effect, but it feels like a descent into mediocrity.

Excellent points! :thumb:

I can certainly hear big brother telling his little brother "We won it when it was tough to get"

 

Sure, kids will be proud. However, no matter how you paint it, it IS winning with less competition.

 

You think Beechwood kids and New Cath kids arent ELATED when one beats the other? THAT is a feeling of victory they they NEVER forget. That is the high that comes from knowing that you beat the best. Lets you know that all that hard work was worth every drop of sweat. Thats what real competition is. That is the best feeling a KID can have. Teams that have little competetion will miss that very special moment. Takes something away from being a "winner."

 

I am sure that the change was made with the best of intentions and we will all get used to it when it comes into effect, but it feels like a descent into mediocrity.

 

 

Pre-6 class system: Who are the traditional powers in 1A? Beechwood and Mayfield , right? Yes, I know there are others including NC. However, Beechwood and Mayfield are in the pre-season discussion EVERY season when the topic of potential state champs is discussed.

 

6 class system: Who are the traditional powers in 1A? That's right. Beechwood and Mayfield. So lets assume that those two ONCE AGAIN make the state finals. Are the winners now supposed to feel that their state championship was "diminished?"

 

Obviously not.

First of all, I'm not "worked up" at all. But I do have an opinion.

 

And I don't think it's about "excitement." Of course they should be very excited. But does that mean they can't simultaneously understand that it's not quite the same as had they played in a more competitive system?

 

You're attacking this strictly from a mathematical perspective. Of course, being #1 out of 50 or so teams is MATHEMATICALLY more challenging than being #1 out of 38.

 

If that's your only point, then we agree.

 

However, from a pride standpoint using your argument, in ANY system other than a come-one-come-all, every team should be "less excited" or "less proud".

 

I simply don't buy it.

You're attacking this strictly from a mathematical perspective. Of course, being #1 out of 50 or so teams is MATHEMATICALLY more challenging than being #1 out of 38.

 

If that's your only point, then we agree.

 

However, from a pride standpoint using your argument, in ANY system other than a come-one-come-all, every team should be "less excited" or "less proud".

 

I simply don't buy it.

Pride is relative. And yes, I agree - in any other system than an "all-inclusive" one there is some diminishment of the accomplishment. But like I said, it's relative. If the diluted system iss all you've known, there would be no loss of prestige. But if you're comiing from a system where the competition is more acute, there is going to be a sense that your accomplishment is somewhat lessened.

You're attacking this strictly from a mathematical perspective. Of course, being #1 out of 50 or so teams is MATHEMATICALLY more challenging than being #1 out of 38.

 

If that's your only point, then we agree.

 

However, from a pride standpoint using your argument, in ANY system other than a come-one-come-all, every team should be "less excited" or "less proud".

 

I simply don't buy it.

 

What you think the players should think and feel and what players are thinking and feeling are two completely different things. I understand that you think a player shouldn't feel any different about winning a state championship in 6 classes than he would feel had he won in 4 classes, but you have to look at it from the player's point of view. Like I said before if we or anyone else were to win state in the new system, that team would still feel a great deal of pride and excitement over winning a state championship, but they would also know that they won it against less competition. There's nothing anyone can do to change that fact, and personally I'm angry that I won't have the chance to compete against the competition that all previous players had.

Pride is relative. And yes, I agree - in any other system than an "all-inclusive" one there is some diminishment of the accomplishment. But like I said, it's relative. If the diluted system iss all you've known, there would be no loss of prestige. But if you're comiing from a system where the competition is more acute, there is going to be a sense that your accomplishment is somewhat lessened.

 

I almost feel wrong saying this to a Highlands fan, but I agree with you 100% on this subject.